The Graying of NCRS

[Paul J.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

My point is this; Yup, I'm going to have a LOT more invested in the car then it will be worth, but that doesn't bother me in the least. It will be the pride of knowing I restored/saved a car that, while no L-88, is still a corvette, a little piece of automotive history.

Monte and Rich:

In 1994 I had lunch with Jim Perkins, while he was still general manager of Chevrolet and a GM VP. I was complaining about a few things (like the front of the new S-10) and he was a little pi**ed at me, but he was a car guy and the conversation went well. At the time I was trying to build my first shop to start doing full frame off restorations, and I was having a reality check on the cost of restoration of a 59 Caddy versus the actual market value restored. When I started complaining about how I'll have too much money in a car that was not "special", he stopped me and said "That's not why you do it". "Snap", like a thin glass rod something in my mind went "snap", and I realized that you restore any old car not just to enjoy, but to preserve a little bit of history, and give the next generation the opportunity to experience it. If you're restoring a car that you will keep, the cost is not so important if you are reasonable. You may eventually recover some of those costs as the car increases in value, and there is also the value in the enjoyment of doing the restoration.

Paul

[Edward S.]

Re: Drive you car !

There have been so many posts on this question that If I answered every one that caught my eye my posting would approach the size of "War & Peace'. So I will try to make it short and sweet - I have been a member for quite some time, and recently sold
a L78 I had for 12 years and took to a Duntov/Triple Crown level. First of all no matter what award I won I always drove the car whenever I could - my motto was always that more then half the fun of owning a classic car was driving it. The only thing that has changed was that I always said the L78 could pass alot of things on the road except a gas station. I am retired for some time now living on a fixed income and the price of gas was starting to be a problem. If your not driving the car, why would you have to spend alot of time polishing it? I will address the two issues I feel effect our
hobby now. The economy makes the purchase of a Corvette( not to mention cost to
restore) a hardship for many young people today. Even in good times, I was not able to buy my first used vette until my early 40's and my daughters getting ready to finish
school. Now on to my own reason to fear the future of the NCRS - ladies and gents we are in love with a car that has always been a TWO SEATER, I had always thought i would give my 65 to my daughters and grandkid's. Don't know why I never thought
perhaps they might have families large enough to make a two seater out of the question. Well thats what happened - my older girl can't afford to buy a extra car right now and I helped my youngest to find a 65 mustang conv. she wanted. Many times now she puts the top down, straps the kids in the back seat and we meet at a car show or cruise - in and spend quality time together ( just like the old days ). I am too old now to see it as a problem for me - but I think as a hobby we face a long and hard road to hoe. I sure do miss my 65 L78 - I did however buy a much cheaper and low HP
65 coupe to replace it, banked the extra money to help pay for my future. Just wanted to give you my thoughts on the subject.

[Dick W.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

If you're restoring a car that you will keep, the cost is not so important if you are reasonable. You may eventually recover some of those costs as the car increases in value, and there is also the value in the enjoyment of doing the restoration.

Paul

Bingo, I have never looked at my vehicles as an IRA, pension plan, etc. I have done mine for pure joy and pleasure. The pickup that I have in my shop will cost me $40,000 + to restore. Will I make a profit on it? Not in my lifetime, nor probably in another lifetime. I restore what I want, it may take me a few years to get the frog-skins to finish it, but so be it. Enjoy the cars, treasure the friendships you make along the way.

My goal in life is not to die with a perfectly preserved face and body, but to go out hollerin' "whoooo, what a ride!!

[Jerry B.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Try playing a game of golf. You have nothing to show for it but a shoulder replacment.

[Ian G.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

I'm 39, and joined NCRS 4 years ago when I was 35 like Dan. I'm restoring a 59, having been lucky enough to get some stock options during the tech bubble through my tech job here in California. I used to attend chapter meets quite a bit when I started the restoration, b ut I have kind of trailed off as my job has put a lot of demands on me and the restoration is kind of dragging on with about 4 years of manual paint stripping. The car is completely disassembled and I'm really looking forward to finishing the paint stripping and then actually rebuilding the thing to look and feel like it did in 59. I'm even putting in a 3 finger clutch and a duntov cam. For me it was always about the 56-59. I get really down into the part minutiae as well. I really had no interest in any of the other models (except over time I decided I do like the looks of the C2s). I always thought C3s and C4s were kind of ugly (no flames please :P ) and the C5 was almost cool. C6 is awesome, but I already have my C1. I've always been into history and collecting old things, and building models and searching around at swap meets. So that might explain why I'm in the hobby. I don't remember my friends back in the 80's and 90's liking C3 & C4 corvettes much at all. I wonder if part of it, is those models just aren't that popular? So I mean, if you don't like the C3, the C4 is just a "used car". The C6 seems to have really reinvigorated the marquee, and I imagine people will want to restore those when they get older -- I know I would love to own one, and would want to keep it original for the most part.

Something else I wanted to mention, is that one of the driving factors in my decision to join the NCRS was this website. back then it was open to the internet and I could see that you guys really knew your stuff and this was the best organization to learn about buying and restoring a classic corvette. I'd be interested in member's opinions if re-opening the "TDB" to the public would eb a good way to pull in the members. I know it's considered a perk of membership, but I may never have joined if it were closed...

[Joel F.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Something else I wanted to mention, is that one of the driving factors in my decision to join the NCRS was this website. back then it was open to the internet and I could see that you guys really knew your stuff and this was the best organization to learn about buying and restoring a classic corvette. I'd be interested in member's opinions if re-opening the "TDB" to the public would eb a good way to pull in the members. I know it's considered a perk of membership, but I may never have joined if it were closed...

Like a few of the others, at 40 I am part of the target demo we're looking to attract. When I joined in 2004, having had access to the TDB prior to joining had a positive influence on my decision to join.

I was able to post complete beginer questions to the board and received honest, thoughtful responses to my questions and helped ensure I bought a quality car that could eventually be a good candidate for participation in Flight judging. If I had not had this opportunity, like so many others I could have bought a car that had issues (trim tag, engine swap, etc.) that would have precluded me from even being interested in the NCRS and the values the organization stand for.

I realize we currently let non-members have "view only" access to the TDB for a limited time. I think perhaps extending this period would attract additional members. We might also consider that we allow these visitors to create a special log-on that lets them actually post questions for a brief period. I think a lot of potential members may read the posts here initially, but when they actually have a question they go to our "competitor", the Corvette Forum. At that ponit, it is probably game over for most of these potential members as the CF has a very anti-NCRS attitude and probably discourages a lot of people from seeking membership. Anyway, this is just my $.02

[Ian G.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Yep, give non-members 30 days read/write on the forum. try before you buy. I wish I'd been smarter when I bought my car. I paid 38 for a fixer-upper '59 290 horse fuelie and have spent nearly that much in parts. I think I will still be within it's top flight value when I'm done though. I really enjoy hunting for the parts...

[Patrick N.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

I agree with you guys, I am barely in my 40's as well and stumbled onto NCRS after I bought my 68' and decided to restore it to original condition. Would have been better if I knew about this organization prior to the purchase and could have asked some questions. The only criticism i have about this organization which ties into the conversation of how to attract younger members is that NCRS is the master of stealth marketing. NCRS is not the easiest thing to discover casually- no banner adds on other websites, not advert on other links / forums. That is too bad because the quality of information and experience on this forum is next to none, it is top notch, but hard to discover. Heck- why is NCRS not advertised on the repro sites we all go to????? we sure bring them a heck of lot of business.

[Ian G.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Agree. I know Dick W said NCRS has advertised in Corvette magazines, but advertising on websites, which is probably cheaper, would maybe bear more fruit. Corvette blogs, corvette vendors, restoration sites... I know people in NCRS are into WWII collecting and restoration... advertise on those sites maybe. cross-marketing. I know I am interested in both old cars and WWII stuff. maybe crazy idea, maybe not?

[Peter N.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

As a new member. allow me to say how & why I joined, which may help the powers that be when thinking along the lines of the subject at hand.

When I started researching the purchase of a midyear, I learned (via searching for the subject online) that the 2 primary sources of help were NCRS & CF Forum. I purchased memberships at both.

Through CF, I learned that one should always get the car inspected first. I obtained the name of a knowledgeable person to do that from a phone call to NCRS.

I will stay a member here for the knowledge & advice available (I've already spent a few C notes at the NCRS store). But, like Jack Panzica
pointed out, NCRS is perceived more about the judging & correctness of the cars, rather than the enjoyment of driving them. I'm not saying this is wrong at all, just that it's the perception that vette guys have. My '66 BB Coupe was a Top Flight Trailer Queen when I got it, but I will never enter it in a show ...I get my kicks (on Route 66) by driving it.

I now have 3 personal friends that I've met via their offers of help from both organizations. My CF friends hosted my stay in Florida when I flew from Calif to buy the car. NCRS member Don Hooper contacted me via PM with his offer of help when I asked for advice after I got the car.

Interestingly, the 2 CF guys drive their cars all the time, & Don drives it very seldom. He's primarily interested in the judging aspect....& I might add, in making me buy the coffee after I drive my vette 70 miles to meet him.

[Terry M.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

I know NCRS has considered advertising on vendor web sites, but decided against it because we do not wish to appear to be endorsing any vendors' product. Too many vendors try to imply some kind of endorsement or connection as it is.

[Peter N.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

I know NCRS has considered advertising on vendor web sites, but decided against it because we do not wish to appear to be endorsing any vendors' product. Too many vendors try to imply some kind of endorsement or connection as it is.

Good point & very true...the used car dealers here make up an interesting segment of the membership of NCRS & exploit that connection very effectively.

[Patrick N.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Totally understandable and I respect that position, but I would think there is a manageable difference between advertising and endorsing. We often reference vendors we deem having the nearest to original products all the time and endorse their products. Running banner adds or links on their sites would only increase the awareness of the organization and participation. Most vendors (not all) currently offer discounts for current NCRS members- that alone would be a great way to attract new members- "Join NCRS today and receive XX % off your order".

After all, it is where we are spending our money and time- how many untapped members could be received. You could embed a code associated with the order to track traffic and membership through those vendors web sites so the organization could measure how effective a campaign such as this truly is. You could also track click through to see how many people hit the NCRS website directly from the add, again to measure its effectiveness.

[Philip P.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

I am not sure that I would want my purchasing information for public use, I know there are ways to protect it, but have we all not been victims of "fishing". It is a slippery slope in my opinion. I know when the opportunity arises I promote NCRS to anyone that is interested. The vendor that I use the most does not offer a NCRS discount, would be nice however. I did get an add from one vendor offering "Top flight" program wonder where that came from, did not see any mention of NCRS.

[Patrick N.]

Re: The Graying of NCRS

Agree. I know Dick W said NCRS has advertised in Corvette magazines, but advertising on websites, which is probably cheaper, would maybe bear more fruit. Corvette blogs, corvette vendors, restoration sites... I know people in NCRS are into WWII collecting and restoration... advertise on those sites maybe. cross-marketing. I know I am interested in both old cars and WWII stuff. maybe crazy idea, maybe not?

It is crazy how many Vette magazines disappeared, sure they say the Vettes are fully embedded in sections with a more general enthusiast mag. I see more great looking vettes in the adds in those mags then in the articles, whatever. I think your point is solid, reach the potential members where their interests lie. I'm only in my 40's but I would also love the chance to restore a WWII plane myself, maybe one day