70 bolt ID help

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
How about the 4th bolt for the water pump…the one that mounts the alternator brackets?
Regards,
Alan

That makes complete sense. Now I will go out later and see what bolt I used. I have a vague memory that this one bolt seemed odd so I used another. If that is the bolt what is the correct finish?

Thanks, Bill

[Alan S.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
That bolt is called out with a part number (9419056) in the 71 AIM which makes me think either no bolt was installed at that location in Flint or the bolt was removed and replaced with 056 at St.Louis.
My example has a darkish plating remaining on parts of it. Phosphate?, Black Oxide? But not as uniform as it appears on the bolt in your picture.
Regards,
Alan

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
That bolt is called out with a part number (9419056) in the 71 AIM which makes me think either no bolt was installed at that location in Flint or the bolt was removed and replaced with 056 at St.Louis.
My example has a darkish plating remaining on parts of it. Phosphate?, Black Oxide? But not as uniform as it appears on the bolt in your picture.
Regards,
Alan

Hmm-That part number comes up as 2-1/4" long unless I am reading something wrong. The one pictured measures 1-1/2" long. That part number also pops up as a thermostat bolt for a BB.

Bill

[Alan S.]

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi bill,
On my 71 water pump…. looking from the front:
Lower right 2 1/2"
Upper right 1 3/4"
Lower left 1 3/4"
Upper left 2" (the one in question)
Regards,
Alan

Did the optional equipment (like power steering or A.I.R.) ever affect the bracketry mounted at that point and thus the bolt's length?

I don't know for sure. Did you measure the bolt lengths from under the head to the end of the bolt or the overall length including the head?

Thanks, Bill

[Alan S.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
From under the head.
Regards,
Alan

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
From under the head.
Regards,
Alan

Still not sure. I have another question. On the bolts for the water pump, which ones have washers and which bolts don't? What kind of washers?

Thanks Alan. I am rechecking some things I had done earlier.

Bill

[Edward J.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Bill, not sure if your car has a rear engine lift bracket that attaches to the bell housing but that could be about the length of a 3/8 bolt??? I think the 4 speeds had a engine lift bracket attached to the bell housing that would require a longer bolt.

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Bill, not sure if your car has a rear engine lift bracket that attaches to the bell housing but that could be about the length of a 3/8 bolt??? I think the 4 speeds had a engine lift bracket attached to the bell housing that would require a longer bolt.

Hi Edward,

I was kind of thinking that inasmuch as it could be a bolt i removed when doing the clutch and pulling the bell housing. I vaguely remember one bolt being different and thinking let's make them the same. I am leaning that way. The other locations mentioned are areas I labeled pretty well. I just set the bell housing bolts to the side until I reinstalled and I definitely remember seeing one odd bolt. This might be it.

I kind of hope so.

Thanks, Bill

[Alan S.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
I have a split lock washer on each of the 4 water pump bolts.
Is this thread dealing with the 'odd' bellhousing bolt you remember from your clutch/bellhousing work?
Regards.
Alan
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...-assy-sequence

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
I have a split lock washer on each of the 4 water pump bolts.
Is this thread dealing with the 'odd' bellhousing bolt you remember from your clutch/bellhousing work?
Regards.
Alan
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...-assy-sequence

Maybe in a round about way. Sometimes I just do not do a good enough job keeping track of the hardware. I make assumptions only to read a thread and realize I should not make such assumptions.

I am starting to think this is the bolt that may have originally held on the lift bracket on the bell housing. What did the bolt look like on your 71 rear lift bracket?

Interesting that you have split washers on all the water pump bolts. I saw an old thread by me where Joe L responded saying no washers except on the bolt or nut for the alternator bracket to water pump attachment.

Makes be wanted to say Hmmm.

Thoughts?


Bill

[Alan S.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
I have 2 pictures, one showing a bit of the water pump on a 69 Bowtie car, and the other a car that I believe is going to be presented for Bowtie judging.
The 69 shows a washer, while the potential candidate doesn't.
?
Regards,
Alan

Added: I looked at another Bowtie car and didn't see any washers except on the bolt that mounts the alternator brackets.

[Bill L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
I have 2 pictures, one showing a bit of the water pump on a 69 Bowtie car, and the other a car that I believe is going to be presented for Bowtie judging.
The 69 shows a washer, while the potential candidate doesn't.
?
Regards,
Alan

Added: I looked at another Bowtie car and didn't see any washers except on the bolt that mounts the alternator brackets.

I wonder if maybe something changed where the lock washers were added.

Did yours have a 3/8" start washer on the bolt that goes through the alternator bracket to the exhaust manifold? The 70 AIM calls out a star washer.

Thanks, Bill

[Joe L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Hi Bill,
I have 2 pictures, one showing a bit of the water pump on a 69 Bowtie car, and the other a car that I believe is going to be presented for Bowtie judging.
The 69 shows a washer, while the potential candidate doesn't.
?
Regards,
Alan

Added: I looked at another Bowtie car and didn't see any washers except on the bolt that mounts the alternator brackets.

Alan------


All 1969 small blocks used a double-ended, flanged STUD at the upper driver side water pump bolt location. The alternator support bracket armand alternator brace were fastened between the stud's flange and the water pump. A split lock washer was used between the stud's flange and the alternator brace. The outer portion of the stud retained the AIR pump brace with a nut and split lock washer.

For 1970-71 no stud was required for base engine and L-46 because no AIR pump brace was used. So, a bolt of GM #9419056 was used. This retained the alternator bracket and brace with a split lockwasher between the bolt head and alternator brace. 1970-71 LT-1 used the same arrangement as all 1969 small blocks.

The GM #9419056 bolt was 3/8-16 X 2", phosphate finished, and of GM material grade 280-M (3 radial lines).

[Joe L.]

Re: 70 bolt ID help

Maybe in a round about way. Sometimes I just do not do a good enough job keeping track of the hardware. I make assumptions only to read a thread and realize I should not make such assumptions.

I am starting to think this is the bolt that may have originally held on the lift bracket on the bell housing. What did the bolt look like on your 71 rear lift bracket?

Interesting that you have split washers on all the water pump bolts. I saw an old thread by me where Joe L responded saying no washers except on the bolt or nut for the alternator bracket to water pump attachment.

Makes be wanted to say Hmmm.

Thoughts?


Bill

Bill------


I know of no original waterpump installation that used lock washers under the bolt head except for positions which also retained some sort of bracket or brace. Those applications used a lock washer between the bolt and bracket or brace. None used a lock washer between the bolt and pump.