New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation - NCRS Discussion Boards

New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

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  • Richard M.
    Super Moderator
    • August 31, 1988
    • 11323

    New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

    I created a new tool to help with this task. Over the years I've dreaded installing these little buggers.

    So I fired up the lathe and came up with this...." Method and Apparatus ".

    P8130015.jpg

    The tool is a cylindrical hollowed ended "Puller". This version will cover the C1 and C2 generations. I'm getting samples of the C3 fasteners and may need another version for those as I think they're a different tip diameter.

    The original way to install these is to "Push" a blunt ended tool into the fastener, through the insulation, then through the firewall hole. Then with a helper pulling the tip with pliers or with a string tied to the tip, getting it to seat and lock in place. I work alone mostly, so it's a pain for me to use that method. Plus very often I end up punching through the tip with that tool.

    My method is the opposite. I dip the rubber tip in a soapy water solution, push the fastener into the tool using a blunt tool, insert my tool into the insulation and firewall hole. Myself, or a helper, hooks a handle or a hook tool on the end of the tool and give it a good yank.

    P8130020.jpg P8130023.jpg


    The rubber stretches by pulling it out of the tool about a inch and a half, then you hear a "POP" as it releases and latches to the hole. DONE!

    P8130028.jpg

    I'm going to be driving up to Carlisle for the Corvette fun late tonight arriving Thursday morning early. I'll be hanging around with my good friends in their swap space (G 90 something), so stop by for a demo. I'll have my one prototype tool with me, but I'm having more made professionally at a local machine shop.

    Rich
  • Larry M.
    Extremely Frequent Poster
    • January 1, 1992
    • 2688

    #2
    Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

    Rich:

    A good idea and long overdue in our hobby. Let me know when you have them for sale. Just send me a PM through this site or at CF. I am a firm believer that you can never have too many tools in your garage.

    Thanks for posting.

    Larry

    Comment

    • Timothy B.
      Extremely Frequent Poster
      • April 30, 1983
      • 5186

      #3
      Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

      Rich, You da man.. great idea.

      Comment

      • Joe M.
        Extremely Frequent Poster
        • April 30, 1990
        • 1338

        #4
        Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

        Rich, what is the purpose of the knurling on the solid end of the tool?
        Joe

        Comment

        • Gary B.
          Extremely Frequent Poster
          • February 1, 1997
          • 7018

          #5
          Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

          Originally posted by Richard Mozzetta (13499)
          ...
          The tool is a cylindrical hollowed ended "Puller"....
          Rich,

          What's the OD of the puller tool? And what's the ID of the hollow end?

          Gary

          Comment

          • Richard M.
            Super Moderator
            • August 31, 1988
            • 11323

            #6
            Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

            Hi Guys, thanks......been runnin' around doing errands for the trip to PA early tomorrow AM.

            Has to get a new battery for the C6 late yesterday and that threw the schedule off. Funny thing, I was checking the car for the trip and noticed the Batt was reading 11.2V on the DIC after using it all weekend. Had it tested at a shop and was weak, so I got a replacement right away. It was the 2nd battery, a AC Delco I bought in Feb 2010 so it had 4 1/2 years on it. All better.

            I've started the paperwork for a possible Patent application. I believe this tool concept can work on other fasteners of similar makeup as well. I've done a patent before and got one many years ago but it was a pain. Took 2 1/2 years for approval.

            Sorry, back to the tool......I don't want to make this a for sale thread, and will abide by the rules, but I'll probably advertise in the Driveline when I get all of the details worked out.

            The holes in the firewall are apx 0.4" so that's the OD of the tool. The tool has to fit through easily. The ID was the tricky part. I made a prototype from aluminum to test the idea and see if the rubber tip would fit in, and it did, but I broke the tool after a few tries because it was soft. I then went to a 1/2" bar stock, cut it down to .4" and it's plenty strong. The finished product will be stainless steel. My 2nd steel prototype has a 0.370" hole which leaves a 0.015" wall thickness. Depth is important too so the insertion tool doesn't punch through the tip, yet it's inserted enough for the "stretch & release" to occur.

            I put a knurl on the end to assist holding the tool while inserting the fastener, but it was after i made it so I could only get it on the solid part. The final version will be knurled along it's entire length.

            If anyone with a lathe wants to make their own here are the numbers I used. I also put a chamfer on the end ID to aid tip insertion.

            P8130013.jpg P8130010.jpg P8130011.jpg

            One caveat is the length. If the engine is installed, or a C2 with Power Brakes, it's pretty tight in there. I may bring the length down a bit to accommodate those cases. The present version will work for 1956 to 1967. The C3 tips are a different diameter and length I think, so I may need to make a different version for those. I have some samples coming from several manufacturers as a test. Othe marques such as Camaro, Pontiac, some trucks, etc use a similar fastener so I have lots of research to do.

            BTW, it works equally as well on the doubled-up insulation areas on the C1's. Those are always a pain the "old" way.
            P8130030.jpg

            Thanks,
            Rich

            Comment

            • Rob M.
              NCRS IT Developer
              • January 1, 2004
              • 12738

              #7
              Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

              Originally posted by Richard Mozzetta (13499)
              I created a new tool to help with this task. Over the years I've dreaded installing these little buggers.

              So I fired up the lathe and came up with this...." Method and Apparatus ".

              [ATTACH=CONFIG]54562[/ATTACH]

              The tool is a cylindrical hollowed ended "Puller". This version will cover the C1 and C2 generations. I'm getting samples of the C3 fasteners and may need another version for those as I think they're a different tip diameter.

              The original way to install these is to "Push" a blunt ended tool into the fastener, through the insulation, then through the firewall hole. Then with a helper pulling the tip with pliers or with a string tied to the tip, getting it to seat and lock in place. I work alone mostly, so it's a pain for me to use that method. Plus very often I end up punching through the tip with that tool.

              My method is the opposite. I dip the rubber tip in a soapy water solution, push the fastener into the tool using a blunt tool, insert my tool into the insulation and firewall hole. Myself, or a helper, hooks a handle or a hook tool on the end of the tool and give it a good yank.

              [ATTACH=CONFIG]54563[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]54564[/ATTACH]


              The rubber stretches by pulling it out of the tool about a inch and a half, then you hear a "POP" as it releases and latches to the hole. DONE!

              [ATTACH=CONFIG]54565[/ATTACH]

              I'm going to be driving up to Carlisle for the Corvette fun late tonight arriving Thursday morning early. I'll be hanging around with my good friends in their swap space (G 90 something), so stop by for a demo. I'll have my one prototype tool with me, but I'm having more made professionally at a local machine shop.

              Rich
              count me in for a set!!!
              Rob.

              NCRS Dutch Chapter Founder & Board Member
              NCRS Software Developer
              C1, C2 and C3 Registry Developer

              Comment

              • Greg H.
                Expired
                • June 30, 1985
                • 105

                #8
                Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                Hi Richard,
                I need to replace my insulation (67 AC car) so I will need your tool set.

                Thanks
                Greg Hollowaty
                714 434 6050

                Comment

                • Richard M.
                  Super Moderator
                  • August 31, 1988
                  • 11323

                  #9
                  Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                  Originally posted by Greg Hollowaty (8814)
                  Hi Richard,
                  I need to replace my insulation (67 AC car) so I will need your tool set.

                  Thanks
                  Greg Hollowaty
                  714 434 6050
                  Hi Greg,

                  My machine shop is all set to fabricate them but his CNC machine went down and there's been a delay in getting them made. I actually was helping him repair the machine recently. In the process I've learned a lot about these machines. Fun for me too. It's a Methods Slant 50.....just like this one.....

                  24833.jpg 24833A.jpg 24833B.jpg

                  We're hoping to have it up and running soon. He has the Stainless Steel material to make them there in stock. We just need to get the machine running. I'll report back here when I have some made. I have a list of interested parties and will add your contact info to the list.

                  A while ago fellow member Frank Dreano's gorgeous '63 coupe was here for a little engine & engine bay freshening up. While I was in the bay I noticed one of his insulation fasteners was missing. It's the one right above the gas pedal area, where the insulation is doubled up and overlapped. The head was on the inside but the tip was missing in the bay. It was dry and broken up when I got it out. The tool worked good there, as the back of the cylinder head was up tight against the firewall.

                  Before removing the old broken pieces....
                  PA310031.jpgPA310032.jpgPA310033.jpg

                  Dried out.....and view of the hole above the gas pedal.
                  PA310034.jpgPA310035.jpgPA310036.jpg

                  Old and new. Soaped up the tip and inserted in tool.
                  PA310037.jpgPA310038.jpgPA310039.jpg

                  Threaded into the hole from the inside, and after the "POP".
                  PA310040.jpgPA310042.jpgPA310043.jpg

                  Here's a vid clip of the tool at work. It popped right in.....



                  I was hoping to have some made for the Winter Regional next week but I'm afraid it may not happen. I'll update when it happens.

                  Rich

                  Comment

                  • Dan P.
                    Very Frequent User
                    • December 1, 1990
                    • 683

                    #10
                    Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                    I will take one when you get it made .

                    Comment

                    • Richard M.
                      Super Moderator
                      • August 31, 1988
                      • 11323

                      #11
                      Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                      Dan please send me a PM with your year and email and mailing address. I'm sending some out gratis for trials when i get them made.

                      Rich

                      Comment

                      • Greg H.
                        Expired
                        • June 30, 1985
                        • 105

                        #12
                        Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                        Hi Richard,

                        I am 4 to 6 months away from needing your tool. My body work is just starting and I will be replacing the complete front end. Please save one for me.

                        Thanks

                        Comment

                        • Scott P.
                          Very Frequent User
                          • April 30, 1992
                          • 178

                          #13
                          Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                          Richard, three midyears in Tulsa waiting for your tool to install those pesky rubber things. Ill buy one for sure. Thanks Scott.

                          Comment

                          • Richard M.
                            Super Moderator
                            • August 31, 1988
                            • 11323

                            #14
                            Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                            I have a list of interested parties and will contact you when I get them done. Those will get the tool for free so I can get some feedback. I'd like to limit it to ten. When the final version(s) is completed, I'll put them up for sale here in our Classifieds Section, the Driveline, and elsewhere. Our policy on the TDB is not to promote selling. I really wanted this to be a informational discussion, but it's grown into somewhat of a selling discussion, and I don't want to jeopardize the rules.

                            So.....with that said..... I need a favor. For the 1956 to 1962 C1's, the tool works great with the small diameter fasteners made for them. The 1963 to 1967 fastener has a slightly larger diameter. Could some of you with midyears please measure some of the holes in your firewalls? I had a few midyears that I measured and the holes were larger than the C1's. But also some that were nearly the same size as the C1's. Also, this tool appears it can be used for the C3 cars as their fastener diameter is similar to the C1 fastener. Why the C2 diameter got bigger is a unknown. They're harder to install.

                            If some of you could jot down the hole diameters on your '63 -'67 cars and post the numbers here it would help with my final version of the tool. If you have a dial caliper that'd be best but if not a good close fractional measurement would help too.

                            Thanks All,
                            Rich

                            Comment

                            • Gary P.
                              Very Frequent User
                              • May 31, 2005
                              • 104

                              #15
                              Re: New Tool - Firewall Insulation Fastener Installation

                              Richard, I to will take one for my shop. Keep me up to date. Thanks, Gary

                              Comment

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