Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

[Oliver S.]

Every now and then I look if there's a '65 FI Coupe for sale that would qualify as a NM driver with nice paint, chrome and interior.
Now there is the following offer:

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/ctd/4254137533.html

But there is a catch ... according to the owner (also a NCRS member) the block was decked in the 80ies and the VIN was gone. There's no VIN on the FI unit. Block # and casting date would fit in the 6 month period before the car was assembled. He had some NCRS members have a look at the car and they thought it could have been a true FI car. If transmission and diff are NM needs to be checked. I really appreciate that the owner doesn't have the pad and FI unit stamped and being honest ... resulting in a considerable lower price.
Now I'm scratching my head what price range would be suitable. Hence, the posting here. Maybe some of the NCRS members who know the car are around on the TDB, too, and may provide their impression on the car's overall condition.

Oliver

[Michael J.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I don't know the car, but if an inspection shows it to be in solid shape and no major issues, the low to mid '50s looks about right.

[Joe R.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Every now and then I look if there's a '65 FI Coupe for sale that would qualify as a NM driver with nice paint, chrome and interior.
Now there is the following offer:

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/ctd/4254137533.html

But there is a catch ... according to the owner (also a NCRS member) the block was decked in the 80ies and the VIN was gone. There's no VIN on the FI unit. Block # and casting date would fit in the 6 month period before the car was assembled. He had some NCRS members have a look at the car and they thought it could have been a true FI car. If transmission and diff are NM needs to be checked. I really appreciate that the owner doesn't have the pad and FI unit stamped and being honest ... resulting in a considerable lower price.
Now I'm scratching my head what price range would be suitable. Hence, the posting here. Maybe some of the NCRS members who know the car are around on the TDB, too, and may provide their impression on the car's overall condition.

Oliver

Oliver,

I would recommend contacting Jim Gessner if you haven't already. He lives in Southern California and knows his Rochester fuelies. You should be able to reach him through this board.

Joe

[John S.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Oliver,
Contact Jim Gessner. Give him the vin to see if it is in the registry he keeps. Who knows, he may have some positive info on the car.
I have an original fuel car that save for a few things is all original. Let me know if you need help with pics or anything.
I saw the car on Craigslist also and agree that low to mid 50s would be ok if it is an original FI. If it is not an original car it is just another non numbers matching car with a fuel unit on it.

[John D.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Oliver, Since the car is in the 6800 range that means it's a December 64 built car. Not all Dec & Jan cars had the serial number stamped on the plenum.
I see it has an original ID tag riveted to the plenum. Can you provide that number?
I also see on the drivers side the main diaphragm cover is missing a special slotted screw that holds the float baffle on. That update didn't occur until late in '64. I forget the number but in the 14K to 16K range the float baffle was installed. This car should have that. But that's a minor detail.
Hard to believe how many 65 fuel cars are out there when less than 800 were made.
You fellows with a 65 fuel car. Look at the air cleaner adapter hose. Notice it's way out of alignment. My 63 FI car is buried under covers and junk and my mind is rusty tonight.
Nice RH exhaust manifold isn't it. The air cleaner has the correct configuration as far as the latches go. Since the car hasn't been restorerd under the hood nothing looks massaged does it.
The distributor vacuum advance fitting is wild though. But that's minor.
Try and get the tag serial number. It's a 4 digit number. Want to see if the unit is a 65 or a 64.
I have gotten calls on this car. One might think it would be gone by now for the price. One fellow mentioned that engine casting date concerned him.
A positive note is notice the accelerator rod and the clearance between it and the flame arrestor to Positive crankcase large diameter metal line going to the top of the block. Lots of clearance as it should be. I don't know how the new repros are but the old ones required smacking with a ball bean hammer for relieve so the accelerator rod didn't hit this tube. The Craiglist car looks perfect.
Nice looking car. JD PS. I stole a large flat screen TV out of the unused family room. I can really zoom in on details.

[Mike E.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I would like to see the trim tag...Black on black w/leather in '65 with no air seems like a rare combo for Southern Cali, it would be interesting to see the shipping report and see where it originally came from. I guess I'm not used to a car being worth over $50K that's missing a $4 clutch pedal pad.


Mike

[Oliver S.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I sent Jim Gessner an email - no reply so far.


Here's some additional info:
VIN: 06852
Build Date: ~Jan 14, 1965
Engine Block Cast Date: K124 (Nov 12, 1964)
Casting Number: 3782870
20131217_205714.jpg

1.jpg

If I identify the FI serial no. correctly as 1107 then it would be the lowest serial no. used in '65 when you take Noland Adam's Guide as reference. The lowest number there is 1463. Unfortunately, there is no pattern in FI serial no. assigned to Corvettes.
'65 VIN 1300 - FI serial no. 1463 (lowest FI no. listed)
'65 VIN 12320 - FI serial no. 1891 (highest VIN with 1xxx FI no.)
And #7017380 FI serial no. 1104 was used on a '64 FI car.

The car is also listed there:

http://www.usedcorvettesforsale.com/corvette-56962.html

There you can see trim and VIN plate


Oliver

[Jimmy B.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

why not call John the f.i. rebuilder and talk to him? He has been around a very long time and could give further insight on the car. It looks good though, even that old teak wheel looks good. Nice uinrestored under the hood waiting for the right person to come along and make it factory correct or enjoy "as is".

[Wayne M.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I sent Jim Gessner an email - no reply so far.

If I identify the FI serial no. correctly as 1107 then it would be the lowest serial no. used in '65 when you take Noland Adam's Guide as reference. The lowest number there is 1463. Unfortunately, there is no pattern in FI serial no. assigned to Corvettes.
'65 VIN 1300 - FI serial no. 1463 (lowest FI no. listed)
'65 VIN 12320 - FI serial no. 1891 (highest VIN with 1xxx FI no.)
And #7017380 FI serial no. 1104 was used on a '64 FI car.

Oliver

Here's two more data points; both Canadian-delivered fuelies.

1964 VIN 14732 (stamped on front boss of doghouse, IRRC) with 380 series unit, tag stamped 2087
1965 VIN 06114 stamped on usual place (pass rear corner of doghouse) tag #2642.
I used to own this unit; now united with its original car.

[Michael H.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Oliver

Without paperwork/warranty book and without the original block, it's difficult to determine if the car was originally an FI car. As previously mentioned, most of the clues are easily duplicated.

There is, however, one way that separates the real cars from the memorex copies.

If the front fiberglass is original, you can look under the front fenders to see if there were two extra emblem holes that have been filled just above the holes/studs for the fuel injection emblems.

If the car has been converted to fuel injection, the original crossed flag side fender emblem would have been removed and the holes filled.

You can only learn what is there if you remove any blackout paint from that area.

The fiberglass in that area should show the original texture of un-sanded fiberglass. That will include the hairs of the glass.

If you see evidence of filled holes and/or body work, that means that at some point, someone removed the flag emblem and added the fuel injection emblems.

If the fiberglass is the original factory installed panels, and there are no extra holes for the side flag, I would say there's a real good chance you have a real FI 65.

Other than that, there's no way to prove anything.

[Mike E.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Here are the AIM pages from the 3 available emblems that Michael is talking about. Fuelie is in the middle.







Mike

[Michael H.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

Here are the AIM pages from the 3 available emblems that Michael is talking about. Fuelie is in the middle.

Mike

Thanks Mike. The difference is clearly shown on the stud location and width dimension between the small block flag emblem and the 396 emblem.
The 396 emblem will not fit the original two holes of a small block car. (even if the third hole is drilled for the 396 emblem)

[James G.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I sent Jim Gessner an email - no reply so far.


Here's some additional info:
VIN: 06852
Build Date: ~Jan 14, 1965
Engine Block Cast Date: K124 (Nov 12, 1964)
Casting Number: 3782870
[ATTACH=CONFIG]49959[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]49960[/ATTACH]

If I identify the FI serial no. correctly as 1107 then it would be the lowest serial no. used in '65 when you take Noland Adam's Guide as reference. The lowest number there is 1463. Unfortunately, there is no pattern in FI serial no. assigned to Corvettes.
'65 VIN 1300 - FI serial no. 1463 (lowest FI no. listed)
'65 VIN 12320 - FI serial no. 1891 (highest VIN with 1xxx FI no.)
And #7017380 FI serial no. 1104 was used on a '64 FI car.

The car is also listed there:

http://www.usedcorvettesforsale.com/corvette-56962.html

There you can see trim and VIN plate


Oliver

Sorry for not answering sooner. Email problems now resolved. The car IS NOT in the 65 FI REGISTRY. It is a new number. DON HOOPER, So Cal Chapter Judging Chair says he may go inspect next week. There are many members in Orange Cty that can inspect.

[Oliver S.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I sent the information about where to look for absent holes together with the AIM excerpt to the owner. There are filled ones. I think chances that this is a real FI car are declining.

Oliver

[Michael H.]

Re: Offered '65 Fuelie Coupe - no VIN on engine pad. $$$?

I sent the information about where to look for absent holes together with the AIM excerpt to the owner. There are filled ones. I think chances that this is a real FI car are declining.

Oliver

Yes, declining quickly now.