top flight with different engine

[Michael W.]

Re: top flight with different engine

If the car in question has magically gained 100 cubic inches, I think prior knowledge would come into play. Otherwise a judge may be walking a fine line.

tc

Possibly last time it was missing 100 original cubic inches. What to do?

[Gene M.]

Re: top flight with different engine

Possibly last time it was missing 100 original cubic inches. What to do?

The data base should not allow keyed in entry when disagrees with previous input. Next step call national judging chairman, let him deal with it. sorry Dave.......

[Gene M.]

Re: top flight with different engine

Gene- you've misunderstood what I said. Can't use prior knowledge of a given car. If you judge the same car twice, you start with a fresh sheet.

No, options can not magically appear on car. Car can not grow or delete features/options from previous. Engines and transmissions need to be representative of what they were. Corrections made are another deal. These kind of major changes should be ironed out prior to judging starts.

[Kenneth B.]

Re: top flight with different engine

No, options can not magically appear on car. Car can not grow or delete features/options from previous. Engines and transmissions need to be representative of what they were. Corrections made are another deal. These kind of major changes should be ironed out prior to judging starts.

Again I ask the question How dose NCRS know that when the Corvette was first judged it was as it left the factory. Unless you have the holy grail of Corvette build sheets there is no way to tell except whats on the SN,trim tag & engine stamps.

[David B.]

Re: top flight with different engine

I'm not sure where this string is going, but it does seem to be focusing on the shortcomings of our system. We have the best judging system in the collector car hobby, period. Does that mean our system is perfect or it can't be defeated? No. If you want to try to defeat the system, you may succeed; and on the other hand, our judges/administrators may figure out what is happening and deliver to you a result you did not want to hear. Although a car is judged as a "clean sheet of paper" as referred to above, that does not mean that the car's prior judging result does not follow it...if we accepted a car as a PG car with a PG coded pad, and now the same car shows up with a manual transmission and a matching engine pad, the burden of proof falls to the owner to convince us that the car was incorrectly evaluated the first time around. Experienced Event Administrators like Gene Manno know that they may not simply change a color code or HP designation for a car without alerting the local judging chairman, the Team Leader or the National Judging Chairman (depending of the event level). Magical changes like this will be viewed with the appropriate skepticism, and the owner will be given that burden of proof assignment mentioned above. Finally, someone above said that he was aware of a car or cars that had been judged multiple times with different body colors; I would appreciate receiving a private off-line email with the details involved. Thank you. Dave

[John S.]

Re: top flight with different engine

dave, thanks for your comments. i learned much from having a car judged and believe that even a person new to this hobby could benefit from the judging system by having a car judged before a restoration is undertaken. while doing some researching i noticed cars that had been judged,now have different engine pad numbers and i was wondering how this would affect a car if it was judged again. through your replies i have a better understanding of the judging system.

[Kenneth B.]

Re: top flight with different engine

I'm not sure where this string is going, but it does seem to be focusing on the shortcomings of our system. We have the best judging system in the collector car hobby, period. Does that mean our system is perfect or it can't be defeated? No. If you want to try to defeat the system, you may succeed; and on the other hand, our judges/administrators may figure out what is happening and deliver to you a result you did not want to hear. Although a car is judged as a "clean sheet of paper" as referred to above, that does not mean that the car's prior judging result does not follow it...if we accepted a car as a PG car with a PG coded pad, and now the same car shows up with a manual transmission and a matching engine pad, the burden of proof falls to the owner to convince us that the car was incorrectly evaluated the first time around. Experienced Event Administrators like Gene Manno know that they may not simply change a color code or HP designation for a car without alerting the local judging chairman, the Team Leader or the National Judging Chairman (depending of the event level). Magical changes like this will be viewed with the appropriate skepticism, and the owner will be given that burden of proof assignment mentioned above. Finally, someone above said that he was aware of a car or cars that had been judged multiple times with different body colors; I would appreciate receiving a private off-line email with the details involved. Thank you. Dave

We get it NCRS judges may not be right but they are never wrong. Judge the Corvette as it is no matter what it was in the past. Where is the problem? Sounds like unless you are saying that now NCRS will also conceder what was not what is now. As we said before NCRS is a great origination but please let it be about the Corvettes that we can have fun with like in the old days when it was not about the money 99.9% top flight & 600 point master judges. You got to love American's we can't stand to do anything for fun it has to be a job,challenge,& obsession. Some of us chose not to play the game any more & I am afraid that the younger generation will not either.

[Roy S.]

Re: top flight with different engine

Ken, lighten up, its a hobby, have some eggnog, grab a polish cloth, go out in the garage and polish one of your babies. Better yet its probably nice enough in AZ to go out and drive one of them. many of us including Dave, probably Gene and a few others can't do that today.

[Francis F.]

Re: top flight with different engine

I'M with you KEN, our "66 coupe" may never be a Dontov car with it's transplanted motor. .I enjoy that much of the car is original,but the fact remains it is not 100% orig.
but you know what I like having fun with the 66,like the old days,people ask whats she worth,I say everything....enjoy the ride....
Francis

[Kenneth B.]

Re: top flight with different engine

Ken, lighten up, its a hobby, have some eggnog, grab a polish cloth, go out in the garage and polish one of your babies. Better yet its probably nice enough in AZ to go out and drive one of them. many of us including Dave, probably Gene and a few others can't do that today.

OK ROY I am off my high horse & will take the 67 OLD BLUE to dinner tonight. Hope to see you at BJ in Jan. I am changing master cylinder's on my 435/J56 & my 67 390 for the correct ones. I hope to see you at BJ in Jan. Hope you & your family have a great Christmas & New Year. Don't like eggnog but I will have a drink of Scotland's finest & toast the GOOD old days..

[Kenneth B.]

Re: top flight with different engine

I'M with you KEN, our "66 coupe" may never be a Dontov car with it's transplanted motor. .I enjoy that much of the car is original,but the fact remains it is not 100% orig.but you know what I like having fun with the 66,like the old days,people ask whats she worth,I say everything....enjoy the ride.... Francis

Thanks I thought I was pi**ing in the wind. I think most of us old guys don't need all the awards to enjoy our Corvettes. I love your statement "What it worth" How much is a smile & grin worth. My first Corvette was a 64 conv. 36 years ago. I pulled up to a stop sign & a little kid said 'Mister that is a pretty car" I didn't get the grin off my face for days. SAVE THE WAVE!

[Francis F.]

Re: top flight with different engine

Yes KEN,I pick my granddaughter up after school,while waiting for her it is verycommon for a 8/9 year old comment "that's a real nice car mister"
it's great to see the fine taste the youth has.

[Roy S.]

Re: top flight with different engine

OK ROY I am off my high horse & will take the 67 OLD BLUE to dinner tonight. Hope to see you at BJ in Jan. I am changing master cylinder's on my 435/J56 & my 67 390 for the correct ones. I hope to see you at BJ in Jan. Hope you & your family have a great Christmas & New Year. Don't like eggnog but I will have a drink of Scotland's finest & toast the GOOD old days..

Ken I will never forget looking at and lusting over your white/blue interior 435 convertible in the Holiday Inn parking lot at Bloomington gold, you and I both decided that day that you would take 54K and unfortunately I couldn't afford it, but I'll never forget it. Remember - real men drive em.