Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

[Michael W.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

However, my understanding of the judging process is key to "Typical for Production", not verification of "born with". If somebody goes to the trouble and level of quality to add a non-original component and does it to the point of it being "typical for production" then so be it. This in NO WAY is saying that it is okay to misrepresent a car for personal gain and profit. To me there is a very clear difference.

Quoted from way up above:

This subject is covered in the Judging Reference Manual, section 4 item #9 page 32. The detectale addition or deletion of any regular production vehicle OPTIONS subsequent to factory assembly is inconsistent with NCRS Judging Standards and therefore subject to a FULL DEDUCTION on originality and condition. Lots of examples given including pw, ps, pb, side exhaust, etc.

We all happy now?

[Jim D.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

[QUOTE=Michael Ward (29001)
We all happy now?[/QUOTE]

Yup. If you do it like the factory did, NO DEDUCTION. Just like all the small block cars that are now big block cars and get NO DEDUCTION.

[Terry M.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

So I take it C5 and C6 Corvettes are among the "high-end" sports cars you are referring to? Damn, and I thought they were Chevrolets.

[Terry M.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

How about this:
CAN it be done? Yes
SHOULD it be done? No

It is your car; do what you want with it.

[Joe L.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

So I take it C5 and C6 Corvettes are among the "high-end" sports cars you are referring to? Damn, and I thought they were Chevrolets.

Terry-----


The vast majority of C5 and C6 Corvettes use floating type calipers with 2 pistons front and 1 piston rear. This is the same basic set-up as C4 Corvettes. Only Z06 and ZR1 have the fixed calipers, 6 piston front and 4 piston rear.

[Terry M.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Terry-----


The vast majority of C5 and C6 Corvettes use floating type calipers with 2 pistons front and 1 piston rear. This is the same basic set-up as C4 Corvettes. Only Z06 and ZR1 have the fixed calipers, 6 piston front and 4 piston rear.

Well I made the mistake of thinking they were all like my Z06. Oh well. I am not looking forward to working on those brakes when the time comes, but they sure do look pretty. Regardless of what I paid for that car, I still don't think of it as hi-end. It is just a Chevrolet.

[David P.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

I love finding interesting nuggets of info like this, thanks Terry. I understand changing to o-rings can affect brake feel/effort as well, but not much of a factor for p/b cars like mine. Sorry, did not mean to hijack the thread. Good luck to the OP; these decisions to change car attributes are personal and can be difficult. At least the reversible decisions are a bit easier to make. Now, cutting parts to add side pipes, well that's a different story IMO There is a line out there somewhere...

Hi Joe and Jim,

I recently replaced all 4 of my leaking calipers with the o-ring style. Here is what I was reading on a number of Corvette Brake websites:

1965-1982
Why go with O-Rings?
Lip seal design seals are used on 1965-1982 Corvette calipers. Lip seals have inherent problems.
...
Calipers are still sleeved with a stainless steel sleeve and completely remanufactured using all new parts but instead of using the lip seal that come from GM these calipers utilize the O ring seals and O ring pistons.
Terry

[Michael W.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

I understand changing to o-rings can affect brake feel/effort as well, but not much of a factor for p/b cars like mine. ..

Don't know where you read that, but there is no evidence to support it.

[David P.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Thanks for the correction, Michael. I have to chalk it up to "lore"; I can't remember where I read that. My bad.

Don't know where you read that, but there is no evidence to support it.

[Timothy B.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

David,

The advantage to the o-rings is there is no pumping action within the calipers from rotor run out. With the old style Chevron lip seals there are springs behind the pistons that keep the piston in contact with the disc pad and if the rotor has some run out the in-out pumping action can cause problems with air and leakage. The o-ring pistons do not use springs so when they are pushed back they stay so no pumping from run out.

[David P.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Great explanation Tim, thank you!

[Michael W.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

David,

The advantage to the o-rings is there is no pumping action within the calipers from rotor run out. With the old style Chevron lip seals there are springs behind the pistons that keep the piston in contact with the disc pad and if the rotor has some run out the in-out pumping action can cause problems with air and leakage. The o-ring pistons do not use springs so when they are pushed back they stay so no pumping from run out.

Which still results in a low pedal. C'mon guys.........

[Timothy B.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Michael,

For the record, I have the old style Chevron lip seals on my 67 but I don't recall hearing of anyone reporting a low pedal using these newer o-ring pistons, I understand what your saying though.

[Michael W.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Michael,

For the record, I have the old style Chevron lip seals on my 67 but I don't recall hearing of anyone reporting a low pedal using these newer o-ring pistons, I understand what your saying though.

Timothy-

Nor do all cars with chevron seals pump air.................... The myths run rampant

Runout beyond GM spec needs to be fixed properly and not covered up by band-aid fixes like o-ring seals.

[Domenic T.]

Re: Can PS or PB be added to a midyear without NCRS deduction?

Just a note on O-ring brake systems.
I have never seen a lip seal on aircraft brakes, they are all O-ring and the working pressure when applied durring emergency, take off abort, is 3,000 PSI. There are many brakes with many cylinders on each wheel that can get so hot that the rim melts a lead plug to let the nitrogen out of the tires so they wont blow.
I think that's a good reason to concider if your planning to switch.

DOM