67 convertible door outer window seal

[Neal K.]

There is a thin stainless steel trim piece with an attached rubber wiper that runs horizontally along the entire outer top edge of both convertible doors. The rubber wiper provides an outer seal for the door window in the up position. The rubber wipers on mine need to be replaced. I see that repops of the rubber wipers are available. My dilema is that the rubber wiper on the drivers side is attached with rivets and on the passenger side it is attached with staples. My 67 car is an early sept 66 production. I tried to find something on this in the AIM but couldn't. Are the attachment methods supposed to be different from one side to the other? Was one left over from the 66 production? Was one a service replacement?
Thanks
Neal

[Gene M.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Neal,
Originals are attached with staples.

The small screws that attach it to the door can be real buggers to get out...........

[Jimmy B.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

IF you can't get those small screws out what mehod of extraction do you recommend?

On my 65 I have removed 3 screws and the rest will not budge and of course the heads are so tiny....

Thanks,

Jim

[Gene M.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Jim,
Grind the screw heads with a small carbide dremel so you can remove the molding. Then you can clamp small long nose alligator vise grips on the "stubs" to remove.

[Michael G.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Neal,
Originals are attached with staples.

The small screws that attach it to the door can be real buggers to get out...........

I don't know how true that is, my early production '66 (Sept'65) had the same fastener set up as Neal's. Staples on one door and rivets on the other attaching weatherstrip to trim. Assembly manual may call for staples however that wasn't the case on my car.

Btw.....car is a A.O. Smith body.

[Neal K.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Michael,
Have you owned your car for a long time? Is it possible that a prior owner may have ordered a service replacement which back in the day probably was the entire piece with the wiper rubber attached?
Neal

[Michael G.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Michael,
Have you owned your car for a long time? Is it possible that a prior owner may have ordered a service replacement which back in the day probably was the entire piece with the wiper rubber attached?
Neal

Neal,

Have owned the car 4 years....full body off resto. Anything is possible however not always probable and would be best guess why the dieviation from the assmbly manual (specifications). GM had their "main suppliers" for any given component or part, they had alternate suppliers as well. It would be my opinion that on occasion alternate supplier componets/parts dievated from typical.....staples versus rivets as in this case. Of course this is another conversation

[Neal K.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Update,
I have done further research on the upper door outer moldings. I puchased 4 used ones. 2 came from a 67 and 2 from 63-66 doors. The 2 from the 67(a right and a left side) both have rivets holding the rubber wiper in place. The 2 63-66(a right and a left side) both have staples holding the rubber wipers in place. Additionally the 2 63-66 moldings have 4 clips on the back side which slip under the fiberglass lip on the door and the rounded top reveal rounded edge of the molding(the part seen on the outside of the door) has a smaller diameter and is a little more oval in shape than the 67's.
My conclusion is that the 67 molding is totally different than the 63-66 and that the difference between the manner of attaching the rubber wiper on my 67( stables vs. rivets) must be due either to a revision during the production year or that more than one manufacturer provided the part and there was a difference in how the rubber wiper was to be affixed between the manufacturers.
Neal

[Dan T.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

I have a late 66 Coupe, 21521. Like yours it had rivets on one side and staples on the other. Drivers side had staples. I installed staples on both sides when I put in new rubber. Those little screws are tough little guys. But we put a little blaster on them and it worked, just let soak a while. Good Luck. Dan Termeer 2325

[Ronald L.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Guys, lets kill the multiple supplier thing.

For a volume of 25000 units per year, you would never be able to justify the cost of having two different door trim suppliers and two different sets of tooling, or extrusion dies that ran these weatherstrips. There was ONE die, and it can make 55 feet per hour, you figure out what fraction of a week it would take to run 100% of Corvette production if each weather strip was 2 foot long! 4 feet per car, how many car sets per hour?

The only significant part that was dual tooled were certain body panels due to the different build locations.

Standard fasteners that were used on multiple car lines would have more than one source but quarter by quarter the decision was made by purchasing who was shipping where. In this case if you were ont he outs you got the Vette plant because the volume stunk compared to any of the other major plants kicking out 100 - 200, 000 units per year.

Back to the strips - look at a vintage service parts book to see how this part was serviced. Separate pieces or, full assembly?

[Neal K.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Ron,
I can't debate your logic on the issue of multiple suppliers. The fact is that the rubber wiper on the 67 molding was attached by 2 different methods, staples and rivets. The different attaching methods appear on either side. Some cars have one of each and others have both of one or the other. In no case did I see evidence that the rubber had been replaced. There were no staple holes in the molding and wiper attached with rivets and no rivet holes in the ones attached with staples). The 67's are clearly different than earlier C2's as the top rolled edge is larger in diameter. I do not know if this change occured in 67 or perhaps earlier.
I admit I speculated on why there is a difference in the method of attaching the rubber wipers in 67 and leave it to others more knowledgable to come up with an explanation, if they are so inclined. Ron, I am leaning towards your supposition that if a GM replacement was ordered that it came as a complete unit with the rubber attached and that those were attached with rivets instead of staples.
Would I be incorrect in assuming that for restoration purposes either method of attachment would be acceptable? The method of attachment of the rubber wiper is visible when the door window is in the down position. Perhaps someone with an unmolested 67 would be kind enough to look down in ther door and share with us what they see.
Thanks for your input.
Neal

[John H.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Neal -

The same outer seal assemblies (3826869-70) were used on all '63-'67 convertibles, and the same part numbers are released in the P&A book for Service. '66 and '67 JG's cover this in some detail. Through mid-'66, the rubber seal wipe was stapled to the stainless molding; from mid-'66 on, it was attached with small flat head rivets (NOT pop-rivets). The seal assembly part numbers never changed, so it was a running drawing change only. It arrived at St. Louis as a complete assembly from the supplier - they just took it out of the box and screwed it to the door with those tiny phillips-head screws.

[Neal K.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

Ron,
Your suggestion on where to research further was spot on. I looked in my Chasis Service Manual and found on page 18-14 under Widow Outer Seal Assembly a discussion of the replacement of the seal "assembly" which refers you to figure 39 on page 18-18. Looks to me like the moulding and rubber seal were serviced as a unit.There is no discussion as to the method of how the rubber seal was attached to the stainless steel moulding. I also looked in my 1975 Corvette Parts Catalog and found in section 10.710 SEAL ASSY.--Moulding, Door Window Glass part numbers "3826870 R.H. and 3826869 L.H. outer", for a 63-67 convertible. looks to me again like it was serviced as a complete assembly. The part numbers are the same for 63-67 even though I have 4 more assemblies which exhibit 2 different styles. One style has a smaller diameter rolled edge and 4 attaching U clips and the other style has a larger diameter rolled edge and no clips(the larger diameter ones I think are from later model year C2's.
Would you conclude then that all the original rubber seals were attached with staples, as Gene indicated, and the replacements attached with rivets? Even so, I am still puzzled because in my conversations with a couple of corvette restorers they maintain that they had worked on a number of original cars and that the use of staples and rivets was mixed. For judging purposes would I be wrong in using staples on both the left and right side?
Thanks for your patience and input. Some of these restoration issues are rather arcane.
Neal

[Neal K.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

John,
I was writing my post before I read yours. The discussion still seems to go in circles. If I interpert what you are saying correctly, either staples or rivets would be correct in 67 and would be acceptable for judging purposes?
What is your thought in the difference in the diameter of the rolled stainless edge and the 4 U clips?
Neal

[John H.]

Re: 67 convertible door outer window seal

John,
I was writing my post before I read yours. The discussion still seems to go in circles. If I interpert what you are saying correctly, either staples or rivets would be correct in 67 and would be acceptable for judging purposes?
What is your thought in the difference in the diameter of the rolled stainless edge and the 4 U clips?
Neal

Neal -

Per the JG's, 66's through the middle of the year had the rubber seal stapled to the molding, and from that point on through the 1967 model year the rubber seal was riveted to the molding. I don't recall ever seeing four U-clips on an original car.