Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

[Mike G.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

alot better off using single stage. you can make it look correct and it will last.

[Brad H.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

This is why sooooo many corvette guys get back into the hot rods, you can build em any fricken way you want and everybody thinks their cool, with these old corvettes we have (probably the biggest pieces of engineering crap ever made) and the fact that there aint a judge alive who actually built these cars and actually knows what he is looking for anyway, half the stuff they look at should pass off cause of this. Isn't venting wonderful, ooops there's the door, more 58 original parts at the stoop, or are they? Merry Xmas to all, take time to chill on occasion. Brad .

[Roger W.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

The January 2010 issue of "Corvette Fever" has an article about making modern paints look like lacquer in the RESTO CLINIC 53-67 CORVETTE TECH Q&A section.

[Steve B.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

The better question is this: can BC/CC pass judging without any point deducts? The answer is yes. My painter in the Kansas City area (Mark Gordon @ Mark's Fiberglass) has painted two Regional Top Flight cars that both achieved no deducts though they were painted, quite effectively, with BC/CC.

I prefer BC/CC over the other platforms because it is the most durable paint system, and BC/CC usually carries a lifetime product warranty.

Hope this helps.
Tony

Just wondering what Mark charges for that type of paint job?
Thanks,
Steve

[Mike Z.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

OK, here is my two cents worth. I agree with Gene & Bill that a real paint guy can tell the clear coat without really trying-from 10 feet away. I disagree with Tony that just because a couple of jobs got by a Regional-it is a whole different ball game at a National Convention and expect the clear coat to be caught.
I agree 100% with Dick that the single stage is a great way to go. I do my own paint and body work, and do not feel the lacquer available today is anything like the original. I went one step further when I painted my 66 Duntov Award and 66 Top Flight cars: I sprayed the entire body with single stage, but then all the normally un-polished areas (i.e., door jambs, hood surround lip, fender lips) sprayed with lacquer the next day (no scuff, chemical adhesion is sufficient if done within 48 hrs. ), right over the the urethane-color sand entire job and feather the edges with 1000 grit and polish. I sprayed the last coat of urethane a little dry which leaves a bit of lacquer type roughness so I could polish, but leave just a hint of the lacquer look-this can easily be buffed/polish to a mirror finish after judging if one wishes. This process has absolutely no clear in it---the National judges loved the paint= no point loss.
Both of the above cars were solid colors, which makes it easy. On metallic colors, it is a bit more complex, but the 50/50 mix on the last two coats really hides the clear-even the factory used a clear in the metallic color process. My next project is Mossport Green, so will be using this process as I have on silver in the past.
FYI: the Duntov Award car was finished in 1999 and after 1100 miles= no stress cracks and looks as good as the day it was finished (maybe a little better due to further buff/polish after judging)-never being washed with water or waxed from day one, just dust with quick finish sprays and soft cloth. I agree one gives up very little durability with single stage vs. the BC/CC and best of all you end up with a finish very close to original, not that fake glass like shine. Anyway, that's my take on a very touchy subject. You have to decide exactly what you want out your car and proceed to that goal, understanding the consequences-good and bad.
Mike Zamora
#12455

[Randy R.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

What do you mean by a 50/50 mix on the last two coats? Does this mean that you add some clear to the single stage paint? I have a 67, Marina Blue, that is finally at the point of body work and paint.


Thank you,

Randy

[Greg L.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

Randy, yes a 50/50 mix on the last coat means that you mix the clear and color 1-1. I've been told by most people that this isn't a bad idea especially with silver because silver has a very high percentage of clear to begin with so it probably won't be detectable as it would with a solid or darker metalic color.

I didn't really want to get into the whole lacquer versus modern paint thing again because there are generally just as many arguments for each as there is against each and for this car I'm pretty much on the lacquer side. Sorry Chuck.

In the future though I think I'll be trying to get some of these modern paints to look like lacquer because that looks to be where the hobby is heading so that's what I'm trying to learn about. Looks like I better try and grab that Jan 2010 copy of Corvette Fever while it's still on the shelf!

[Tony S.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

Why don't you call him and ask? His tele. is 913 449-3439. He knows what he's doing.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

...I didn't really want to get into the whole lacquer versus modern paint thing again because there are generally just as many arguments for each as there is against each and for this car I'm pretty much on the lacquer side. Sorry Chuck.

Awww...Too bad; I thought it was time to say "I told you so". Maybe not quite yet; but remember those arguments so you can remind me when the time comes.

Randy, the mixing of clear in the final coat is to further increase the single stage urethane's durability. It is not necessary for appearance. Using only 50% clear delivers near BC/CC durability while making detection of the clear more difficult.

I probably would not mix 50% clear into a given color without first clearing it with the manufacturer's tech service. Too much clear will reduce the hiding ability of the paint (not likely to be a concern on the third coat), but it may also wash out the color. For a solid color like Rally Red, PPG's tech service recommended mixing a MAXIMUM of 50 percent clear on the last coat.

[Mike Z.]

Re: Can BC/CC be made to look like lacquer?

Chauck-I was not advocating adding clear to the final coats on solids, it will be dedected (even 50/50)-it is not necessary. The technique I described was/is intended for metalic colors. If you have ever sprayed metalics, you will understand the last coat and I do last two coats has a fogging technique: lay on the coat in normal fashion, but fog the the panel immediately to evenly spread the metalic-this prevents the concentration bands you see in some paint jobs. The factory knew this and used a very similar technique and that is why I suggest they would have used a clear in the application of the metalic colors-Only, not the solid colors. I have not had any issues with this technique and yes, I did discuss with my suppliers-have done with both Dupont and PPG-never a good idea to mix products, so keep it uniform brand products. For the non polished areas, the lacquer over the urethane still works with metalics, but metalics are much harder to match, so I have also used a dulling agent in the final mix for the those areas-the little bit of overspray onto the larger panels is simply color sanded and buffed, leaving the duller lacquer looking non polished areas. Good luck with your projects.
Mike Zamora
#12455