Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Hey guys, here are some pics. Tim
Hey guys, here are some pics. Tim
-
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
more pics.Comment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Sorry, a few that are more relevant to my problem. TimComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Do these photos give anyone a clue?Comment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play GONE/FIXED!!!!!
Hey Guys, Finally!!!!!!!!!! It is fixed and the upper bearing slop/play is gone. The area where the hub meets the column is really solid now. Horn, turn signals, cancelling cam all work as they should (they always did). A HUGE thank you to Dan H, Wayne M, Tim B, John H, & William C. I REALLY appreciate everyone's help, advice, expertice and patience. You guys really helped me get to the bottom of this problem.
For the record, I tore it all down and checked everything out (again). I used only the 64 parts listed in the AIM. As most of you said to do from the beginning, I followed the 63 shop manual (again). I did have a better understanding of how the preloads work. I was really having a hard time understanding how the upper bearing was preloaded. In one of Wayne's replies, he said the nylon cancelling cam had to be seated firmly into the upper bearing race. I studied how this fitted together and how it worked when I had it all apart again. Suddenly, it all started to make sense. When I torqued my hub on, it really seated the upper bearing. WHEN I was making all of the adjustments per the 63 shop manual, I had a little better sense of what I was trying to accomplish and why with each move and it all went together very nicely this time and it's TIGHT!
One thing I did was a little unorthodox. My upper bearing, even brand new out of the bag (and out of the turn signal switch) seemed to have play/slop ( I know they were not preloaded yet). I ended up having 3 different upper bearings to compare. I cleaned the grease out of each and found all of them had the same amount of play, each had 19 BB's in them, and each had enough room for one more BB. I bent the race on one bearing and took a BB out of it and installed that 20th BB in another new bearing. It was a little tricky to get it in there because of the lip/clearance that keeps them from falling out. I then packed the bearing with new grease and installed it. It still had some play but not quite as much. I don't know if this had anything to do with solving my problem or not, but I think it helped. The main issue was getting both bearings preloaded which is what all of you said from the beginning.
I thought I would share this 19 vs. 20 BB's per bearing because there are a lot of guys in the archives that have experienced the same problem that I have as far as upper bearing slop/play. I'm sure GM designed these bearings with 19 for a reason, but all I know is mine is now tight and everything works really well.
Time to install my carpet. HOORAY!
TimComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Tim,
Thanks for posting all the info on this. I can't wait until I try this on my '64. That looseness in the column is driving me nuts. I hope this ends up being the answer.Comment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Now you guys have me wondering about the depth to which I installed the steering shaft into the steering gear coupling(s). As I previously mentioned, I slid the steering shaft into the upper coupling (closet to the firewall) so that the end/tip of the shaft is positioned exactly half way in between the upper and lower coupling.
I wonder if I slide the steering shaft all the way into both the upper and lower coupling so it won't go any farther in (bottoms out) if that will cause the top of the steering shaft to not stick out as far towards the interior of the car from the upper bearing. In other words, the upper bearing would be supporting the upper part of the shaft closer to the upper end of the shaft and therefore, may eliminate my play??????????????? Would this cause a binding effect down between the worm gear shaft and the steering shaft?
However, I thought the depth to which the shaft was installed into the coupling(s) was part of the adjustment regarding the in/out (telescoping) aspect of the whole steering column.
I have studied photos of various cars and it seems the steering shaft is installed in various depths into the steering geer couplings.
????????
Thanks, Tim
I agree, check and see if you can push the shaft into coupling more. I had play, and looked at my coupling and my shaft , I had not pushed the wheel and shaft into the bell enough before I tightened the coupling bolt.
Loosened spring, and pushed shaft in, tighten bolt and all was well.
JackComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Jack, thanks for the info. TimComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Hello Tim, please let me know when you get this problem resolved I have the very same problem with my 65 roadster, I have torn my steering columm down three times. It is also rebuilt with all new parts. please let me know what you found on yours to fix it.Comment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Hi Brenton,
I know what you are going through. Mine was a pain in the butt. Please read this whole thread and then focus on response #35 by me. After all of the discussions with everyone's help, the solution pretty much came down to correctly pre-loading the upper bearing where the slop/play was occuring. With the help of NCRS members on this thread, the 63-64 Shop Manual, my 64 AIM and tearing it down 3 times and understanding the whole procedure better I was able to get it resolved. However, as I stated in #35, I DID add another BB (bearing ball) in the upper bearing to make a total of 20. The three separate upper bearing assemblies I was comparing each had only 19 BBs. In my opinion, they were sloppy. I'm sure they were designed with 19 BBs for a reason, but all I know is mine was finally tight and 'right' immediately after I added the extra 20th BB. However, I DO think I may have finally pre-loaded the upper bearing properly on the last try as well. So....which varialbe fixed it? Not sure....maybe one or the other or both. Hope this helps.
TimComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Thanks JimComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Thanks Jim for all your good info on upper steering wheel play, I think i found my problem i removed my steering wheel hub once again and discovered that the hub i picked up at a corvette expo came off of a 63 corvette which is fine, I think they or the same from 63 thru 66. But the turn signal cancelling cam is different on a 63 The piece that should seat in the upper bearing is not there on the 63, I will now purchase a turn signal cancelling cam to fit my 65.
THANKS AGAIN
Comment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Very interesting thread and I'm sorry I didn't read it earlier. The pre-load on the lower spring should move the canceling cam into the center of the upper bearing and take out ALL movement in the upper column. For some reason Tim's pre-load did not accomplish this necessary step. The lower bearing being new and tight may have caused the pre-load to feel correct.
Taking apart the upper bearing and adding one ball should have NO effect on the play in the upper bearing. In theory there should have been 9 bearing balls on either side of the bearing and that would have allowed very little tolerance.
It would not be advisable for everyone with a loose column to add a bearing and expect the slop in the column to disappear.
Most of the time the slop in the column is caused by the lower bearing eating into the shaft and destroying lower end.
Working as Tim did to find the problem and having patience to not let go of a minute detail rewarded Tim with a like NEW steering column.
JRComment
-
Re: 1964 upper steering column play
Brenton, sounds good. I hope you found your problem. Let us know how it comes out.
TimComment
Comment