1964 upper steering column play

[Tim D.]

I just rebuilt my 1964 non-power steering column with all new parts from top to bottom per the assembly manual, including a reproduction turn signal switch which came with the new upper bearing installed. I have it all installed and adjusted and everything seems to work as designed except I have about 1/8-1/4 inch "play" in my upper steering column. The play is from side to side and/or top to bottom (not in and/or out). It feels like the upper bearing is allowing the column to wiggle. Any thoughts or advice would greatly be appreciated.
Thanks a lot!
Tim

[Dan H.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Tim, make sure the small spring on the steering box side is tight against the forward bearing in the column, try pushing it up and retightening the clamp to preload the column somewhat. Forgot to mention to loosen the coupler so the column can seat down in to seat the whole column.
Dan

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Dan, thanks for your response. I did preload the spring against the lower bearing by the required amount in the AIM. I also have the steering shaft seated down half way into the lower coupling as the AIM shows. This play is not occuring "in and out" from the coupling to the steering wheel. It is only up where the steering hub meets the "bell" as if the steering shaft is wandering inside of the upper bearing in the turn signal switch. The play is up/down, side/side, around/around. I have torn it back down 3 times and cant' seem to figure out why I have play. I know something is not right and I am also concerned about safety. When I look at my old turn signal switch and bearing and compare it to my new turn signal switch and bearing, the bearing itself, without the steering shaft installed seems to have just enough play to cause the play I am getting when everything is fully assembled and adjusted. Has anyone encountered this problem? Thanks!
Tim

[Wayne M.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Tim -- Dan offers good advice. Here's a link to a similar discussion a few months ago which may help.

https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...70737&uid=5507

There are a lot of bolts to loosen, then tighten after desired column (mast) position is obtained [many are not even aware that there's also an in-out adjustment for standard steering; ie. non-telescopic].

If you have access to a '63 Corvette Shop Manual, there's detailed instructions on all this.

On my '65, I ended up adjusting the entire column, mast, steering wheel, etc OFF the car (don't try this on a coupe, and the convertible deck lid has to be raised; I even removed the driver's seat).

Then, I pre-loaded the lower bearing spring/clamp to allow about 10 to 30 thou movement (this involves substantial compression of the spring).

[Timothy B.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Tim, Were there reproduction parts used for the rebuild, (upper bearing)? Is there any chance this bearing has a sleeve that's not installed?

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Dan, thanks for your reply and sending the link. I did preload the lower spring stop clamp to .010-.020 using a pair of vise-grips and shims as a "gauge" to compress the spring. After I tightened the clamp, I removed the shims. It is my understanding that this adjustment (along with the depth of the installation of the shaft into the steering geer) will properly orient the entire column and shaft and keep them from moving in and out like a telescoping movement. My movement/play is NOT in and out or forward and back like telescopic movement. It is more round and round, up and down, side to side while wiggling the steering wheel. The play seems to be in the upper bearing where the bell shaped housing and the hub meet. It acts like the steering shaft is wandering/walking within the upper bearing.

I rebuilt the entire unit out of the car on a bench. Then I installed it following my AIM and 63-64 shop manuals as close as I could. I made all of the adjustments they suggested such as:

1. all components are on high point
2. flat on steering shaft is properly oriented into steering geer and is inserted "1/2 way" into steering gear. I find this "1/2 way" to be a little confusing as to what they actually mean by 1/2 way. I currently have the shaft inserted so the end/tip of the shaft is showing right in between the space where the lower coupling meets the upper coupling. I'm not sure if this is what they mean by 1/2 way but it does seem to allow me to adjust the steering mast jacket so it is oriented properly as far as in/out (telescopic if you will) and still allow for a 0.70-0.90 gap between the bell housing steering wheel hub.
3. once I got everything that moves adjusted where I thought it should be, I tightened everything down.

The turn signal switch, cancelling cam etc are all new and seem to work just fine.

I would really appreciate any and all suggestions by all of you "in the know".

In the meantime, I will continue to check archives and revisit my installation and adjustments. However, I have done this about 3 times.

Thanks, Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

oops! Sorry Wayne. My last post should have been addressed to you. My apologies! Thanks, Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Tim, yes most all parts were reproduction parts except my steering shaft, bell shaped part and steering wheel hub. I am not sure if we can mention company/reproduction names but the new repro turn signal switch was bought from a very reputable company.

As you mentioned, it DOES act like there is a bearing sleeve or something missing or incorrect about the upper bearing. As you probably know, the upper bearing is built into the turn sig switch. The bearing installs and then a brass colored horn contact ring goes over it and pushes down into the plastic of the turn sig switch with 3 tongs. I think this may be for the horn ground??? The horns work great!

When I have both my old turn sig switch or the new switch out of the car, and the steering shaft is not installed, I can stick my pinky finger into the center donut hole of the bearing and move it around. This amount of "play" seems to be about the same amount of play I am getting with everything installed in the car.

All thoughts and advice are appreciated.
Thanks,
Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Now you guys have me wondering about the depth to which I installed the steering shaft into the steering gear coupling(s). As I previously mentioned, I slid the steering shaft into the upper coupling (closet to the firewall) so that the end/tip of the shaft is positioned exactly half way in between the upper and lower coupling.

I wonder if I slide the steering shaft all the way into both the upper and lower coupling so it won't go any farther in (bottoms out) if that will cause the top of the steering shaft to not stick out as far towards the interior of the car from the upper bearing. In other words, the upper bearing would be supporting the upper part of the shaft closer to the upper end of the shaft and therefore, may eliminate my play??????????????? Would this cause a binding effect down between the worm gear shaft and the steering shaft?

However, I thought the depth to which the shaft was installed into the coupling(s) was part of the adjustment regarding the in/out (telescoping) aspect of the whole steering column.

I have studied photos of various cars and it seems the steering shaft is installed in various depths into the steering geer couplings.

????????
Thanks, Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Wayne, I agree with you about the NOTE on axial movement of .01-.030 of the lower clamp that is in your link. I have seen this somewhere before and it didn't make sense to me either. It seems like the clamp should simply be compressed and then tight so it can't move. Could this "axial movement" be my problem? Everything on the steering column system on my car is tight but I DO seem to have some kind of an "axial movement" at the upper bearing. The bell is tight and then when I grab/wiggle the steering wheel, the hub will wiggle as if the whole steering shaft is wiggling within the upper bearing. Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

1963 cars call for a "wedge and screw" for the steering column that supposedly tightens the directional signal housing to the column jacket. I have not installed this wedge and screw kit. I did not take one off of my car and therefore did not order this kit. My car is a 64 BUT it does have the place for this screw to be inserted into the bell. However, my bell is very tight.

I did just notice that a 63 has a steering column shaft "sleeve" but since I have a 64 I shouldn't need that, right? I ordered all parts for 64 and built it accordingly.

Grasping at straws!
Tim

[Dan H.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Tim, my 63 and 64 columns are totally different critters! No wedge was used on the 64, it locks into the slots on the shaft. I think they were using up all the 63 bells on 64s. See section 12 for details. In the 63 AIM the 'wedge' is shown, not in the 64 AIM.

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

Thanks Dan. That all makes sense. I knew 64 columns were very different for 63s but I was grasping at straws. The fact that my bell had the place for the wedge screws had me wondering. You probably hit the nail on the head pointing out that GM probably used up all of the leftover 63 bells on some 64s and that is why my bell has a place for the wedge set up. Do any of you guys with known original 64 cars have a bell on your car that has the place for the wedge screw? If so, did you just leave it empty and not use the wedge set up since the wedge is only used on 63s?

I do have my steering column jacket tabs engaged and twisted into the steering coupler mast retainer slots.

It almost feels like the play is either between the steering shaft and the upper bearing OR between the upper bearing and upper bearing race?????

Thanks,
Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

OK guys.......I just found an interesting "discovery". I was just out in the garage grabbing my steering wheel and moving it around checking out the amount of play etc. I just noticed that the "play" moves up and to the left but NOT down and to the right. Down and to the right seem normal and solid as they should be.

This has me wondering if I possibly have a slightly bent steering shaft or slightly bent steering column jacket (tube) or both are bent. Also, as I recall, one of the four tabs on the top of my tube had just a slight corner (ear) broken off. I hate to disassemble the whole system, but I don't know how else to check to see if the shaft and/or the tube are bent.

Any thoughts??????????///

Tim

[Wayne M.]

Re: 1964 upper steering column play

OK guys.......I just found an interesting "discovery". I was just out in the garage grabbing my steering wheel and moving it around checking out the amount of play etc. I just noticed that the "play" moves up and to the left but NOT down and to the right. Down and to the right seem normal and solid as they should be.

This has me wondering if I possibly have a slightly bent steering shaft or slightly bent steering column jacket (tube) or both are bent. Also, as I recall, one of the four tabs on the top of my tube had just a slight corner (ear) broken off. I hate to disassemble the whole system, but I don't know how else to check to see if the shaft and/or the tube are bent.

Any thoughts??????????///

Tim

You're providing a lot of analysis here, Tim, and I'm sure you're going to find the solution. Too bad you weren't doing this about a month ago, when I had my column completely out, and we could have solved this in parallel, with pics.

Slightly off problem, but here's a pic I took on the forward end of the shaft / tube on my '65 (IMO, '65's are identical to '64 with respect to the entire steering column assy.). This was when I bought the car in 1988; Bubba had completely removed/lost the lower bearing inner race and balls, so the shaft was rubbing / wearing on the outer bearing seat/casing, to the extent that hitting a curb while solidly holding the steering wheel might have snapped the shaft through torque shear. NOS replacement shaft on the left. The "flat" splined length is about 2_1/2" to 2_3/4", which defines the total in-out column adjust possibility. I have my shaft inserted to just past the center of the steering coupling (ie, say 3/16" towards the steering gear); my preference. Just by loosening the 12-point 1/2" head upper steering gear coupling bolt, then the lower firewall support clamp, and finally the U-bolt that holds the upper tube to the bracket under the instrument panel, you should be able to push/pull the steering column to the desired position.

Did you replace the nylon (plastic) cancelling cam [that screws to the steering wheel hub] ?

I have driven cars with 2 of the (top of tube) 4 tabs broken off, and while sloppy, was still acceptable.