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Classic Engine Company

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  • Michael G.
    Extremely Frequent Poster
    • December 31, 1996
    • 1251

    #16
    Re: Classic Engine Company

    Amazing how quickly a post gets off topic. It starts with a member seeking opinions for supplier and then takes a 'left turn' into a conversion about fakery and deceit.

    Good morning all.....just an observation from the peanut gallery.

    Comment

    • Michael M.
      Very Frequent User
      • January 31, 1993
      • 603

      #17
      Re: Classic Engine Company

      I purchased a engine ( 327/350hp L79 ) from Tom in the mid-80's for a 1967 Chevy Nova. Tom is a very nice and knows his stuff. When I installed the engine I had a noise inside the engine. Car had very little power, so I called Tom and he said everything should be OK just drive the car a little longer. Well I had to take the engine out and when I took the engine apart I found four sleeves in the block and 283 piston rods with one rod being bent.

      Comment

      • Gene M.
        Extremely Frequent Poster
        • March 31, 1985
        • 4232

        #18
        Re: Classic Engine Company

        Originally posted by Michael Mytro (22211)
        I purchased a engine ( 327/350hp L79 ) from Tom in the mid-80's for a 1967 Chevy Nova. Tom is a very nice and knows his stuff. When I installed the engine I had a noise inside the engine. Car had very little power, so I called Tom and he said everything should be OK just drive the car a little longer. Well I had to take the engine out and when I took the engine apart I found four sleeves in the block and 283 piston rods with one rod being bent.
        I'm pretty sure nothing was said about 4 sleeves, otherwise who would ever buy it....... Did he make good on the piece of junk he sold you?

        Terry, I agree with you as cars pass different owners all the sudden the stamper becomes original...!

        Comment

        • Al R.
          Very Frequent User
          • June 30, 1988
          • 687

          #19
          Re: Classic Engine Company

          I agree with Jason. If he wants to make the car as correct as possible and not mis-represent it as the original engine, I really see no problem. I think for the most part we all have searched for correct parts for our cars, such as colored fuses, gas tank sending units, fan clutches, bolts, etc. The list goes on forever for every available part, even the fiberglass or tires and wheel weights.

          Comment

          • Michael G.
            Extremely Frequent Poster
            • November 11, 2008
            • 2157

            #20
            Re: Classic Engine Company

            I purchased an engine from Classic, PM me if you want to discuss. In any case, here's one of of his stamps for your perusal:
            63 pad.jpg
            Never been judged, never will be...
            Last edited by Michael G.; January 2, 2016, 11:00 PM.
            Mike




            1965 Black Ext / Silver Int. Coupe, L84 Duntov, French Lick, 2023 - Triple Diamond
            1965 Red Ext / White & Red Int. Conv. - 327/250 AC Regional Top Flight.

            Comment

            • Terry D.
              Extremely Frequent Poster
              • May 31, 1987
              • 2690

              #21
              Re: Classic Engine Company

              How can you say it will never be judged? Are you going to live forever? I have a hard time believing you would go through the trouble to put in a "original" motor and not gain something from it, be it money, or bragging rights! Al, I agree with you about trying to find correct parts, but that is way different than having an engine made up to represent original! There is a huge difference between restore and replicate! I'm sorry some of you might think this thread took a left turn, but by using these fakes you are not helping the hobby. If you don't want to stick to restoration maybe you should go buy a Cobra kit car and then you can tell everyone it is original too! Just my two cents, I'm done venting, thanks for listening!

              Comment

              • Erv M.
                Very Frequent User
                • February 20, 2007
                • 445

                #22
                Re: Classic Engine Company

                Just a quick observation.

                Our hobby is not growing it is dying, meaning that original cars are very limited and becomes less every year. With saying that most people could car less abount a restamped block in a 75 because the value doesn"t warrant the expense, so yes dollars are usually a motive for restamping.

                Without a method to restore a car back to original the spiral continues downward. Somewhere in this statement lies the debate that will rage forever. Probably between the haves and haves not.

                Comment

                • John S.
                  Expired
                  • July 29, 2009
                  • 640

                  #23
                  Re: Classic Engine Company

                  Originally posted by Bill Ogden (45584)
                  Tom Luedeke rebuilt an engine for me in 2007 and I have had not a minutes problem with it. I delivered the engine to his shop (that might have helped) and returned to pick it up when complete. He's a nice guy, but so very busy (and in that location...he has another where some of the work is done... a little shorthanded) and because of that if he doesn't recognize the caller ID, it might just go into VM. His phone rings all the time. BUT, he spent a lot of his time with me explaining what he was going to do. He partially dismantled the engine right there to show me. He always either picked up my call afterwards or called me back without fail. He leaves and locks his building over the lunch hour and is very disciplined about this. I had lunch with him one day and he couldn't have been friendlier....but he is going to lunch, and is going at the same time every day!

                  He has an exceptional reputation in that neck of the woods. And as you see in Hemmings he's got quite an inventory. I'd give him another try, but call early afternoon.


                  Bill
                  you have made a very good description of Tom(right down to lunch time). great guy. although he is very busy and is almost always working by himself, he will find the time to show and explain the work he does. the man takes great pride in what he does.

                  Comment

                  • Kenneth B.
                    Extremely Frequent Poster
                    • August 31, 1984
                    • 2085

                    #24
                    Re: Classic Engine Company

                    Originally posted by Michael Gill (28614)
                    Amazing how quickly a post gets off topic. It starts with a member seeking opinions for supplier and then takes a 'left turn' into a conversion about fakery and deceit.

                    Good morning all.....just an observation from the peanut gallery.
                    I agree. Some on here get a burr up their ass when it comes to replacing correct blocks but believe its OK to replace everything else on a Corvette. I don't see them bitching about finding dated other parts that are not installed on that Corvette at the factory. Not many of us have a 100% Corvette with all of its parts installed at the factory.
                    65 350 TI CONV 67 J56 435 CONV,67,390/AIR CONV,70 454/air CONV,
                    What A MAN WON'T SPEND TO GIVE HIS ASS A RIDE

                    Comment

                    • Kenneth B.
                      Extremely Frequent Poster
                      • August 31, 1984
                      • 2085

                      #25
                      Re: Classic Engine Company

                      Originally posted by Terry Deusterman (11486)
                      How can you say it will never be judged? Are you going to live forever? I have a hard time believing you would go through the trouble to put in a "original" motor and not gain something from it, be it money, or bragging rights! Al, I agree with you about trying to find correct parts, but that is way different than having an engine made up to represent original! There is a huge difference between restore and replicate! I'm sorry some of you might think this thread took a left turn, but by using these fakes you are not helping the hobby. If you don't want to stick to restoration maybe you should go buy a Cobra kit car and then you can tell everyone it is original too! Just my two cents, I'm done venting, thanks for listening!
                      What you really mean is that you think your Corvette has the original block & should be worth more than ones that don't. It is you that its all about the money & bragging rights. I think you should start the 100% born with parts Corvette club although don't think you can get many members beside yourself that has one of these cars.
                      65 350 TI CONV 67 J56 435 CONV,67,390/AIR CONV,70 454/air CONV,
                      What A MAN WON'T SPEND TO GIVE HIS ASS A RIDE

                      Comment

                      • Michael G.
                        Extremely Frequent Poster
                        • November 11, 2008
                        • 2157

                        #26
                        Re: Classic Engine Company

                        Let's be clear here, the engine in question is in a car that now has disc brakes, air conditioning, rack and pinion power steering, a Tremec trans, a hydraulic clutch, electronic fuel injection, electric fuel pump, the wrong color interior and paint, and a reproduction frame. Where exactly am I gaining anything with a this particular stamp here? The VIN is too shallow and the broach marks are clearly not discontinuous, so even the pad is clearly a repro. If anyone were to have this thing judged, Dr. Mikey would pick up the broach mark discrepancy in one second and that would be the least of the judging problems.

                        Frankly, I don't need the money to ever sell it. I could crush it, if I felt like it and it wouldn't bother me a bit. Moreover, I also have a 99.2 point two-time Duntov 1963 Fuelie, with a genuine, documented, original engine, why would I need to fake anything on this 63 driver car? I could give a crap about bragging rights. I posted the pad so you could see Tom's work, period.

                        Jeeeeze, ease up. Life's too short.
                        Mike




                        1965 Black Ext / Silver Int. Coupe, L84 Duntov, French Lick, 2023 - Triple Diamond
                        1965 Red Ext / White & Red Int. Conv. - 327/250 AC Regional Top Flight.

                        Comment

                        • Kenneth B.
                          Extremely Frequent Poster
                          • August 31, 1984
                          • 2085

                          #27
                          Re: Classic Engine Company

                          Originally posted by michael garver (49693)
                          let's be clear here, the engine in question is in a car that now has disc brakes, air conditioning, rack and pinion power steering, a tremec trans, a hydraulic clutch, electronic fuel injection, electric fuel pump, the wrong color interior and paint, and a reproduction frame. Where exactly am i gaining anything with a this particular stamp here? The vin is too shallow and the broach marks are clearly not discontinuous, so even the pad is clearly a repro. If anyone were to have this thing judged, dr. Mikey would pick up the broach mark discrepancy in one second and that would be the least of the judging problems.

                          Frankly, i don't need the money to ever sell it. I could crush it, if i felt like it and it wouldn't bother me a bit. Moreover, i also have a 99.2 point two-time duntov 1963 fuelie, with a genuine, documented, original engine, why would i need to fake anything on this 63 driver car? I could give a crap about bragging rights. I posted the pad so you could see tom's work, period.

                          Jeeeeze, ease up. Life's too short.
                          well said!
                          65 350 TI CONV 67 J56 435 CONV,67,390/AIR CONV,70 454/air CONV,
                          What A MAN WON'T SPEND TO GIVE HIS ASS A RIDE

                          Comment

                          • Terry D.
                            Extremely Frequent Poster
                            • May 31, 1987
                            • 2690

                            #28
                            Re: Classic Engine Company

                            Well Kenneth if you did a little research you would know my current 62 has a Tremec 5 speed and a 383 crate motor that gets about 7 to 8 thousand miles put on it every year and I live in Northern Ohio. I've done the all original routine, it was fun, but prefer a driver I can get out and actually drive somewhere besides the grocery store and have a heart attack if it gets a stone chip. And Michael if the car is a driver with all kinds of aftermarket stuff on it, why would you want motor like that, any V-8 would work. By the way nice to know you don't need the money!!!!!

                            Comment

                            • Michael G.
                              Extremely Frequent Poster
                              • November 11, 2008
                              • 2157

                              #29
                              Re: Classic Engine Company

                              Originally posted by Terry Deusterman (11486)
                              ... And Michael if the car is a driver with all kinds of aftermarket stuff on it, why would you want motor like that, any V-8 would work. By the way nice to know you don't need the money!!!!!
                              Cause it's the only V8 I've got???? Should I throw it away and get an LS9? ( I, apparently, don't need the money the LS9 would cost)

                              My head hurts, I'm confused, and I can't do this any more

                              Good night, I think...
                              Last edited by Michael G.; January 3, 2016, 11:58 PM.
                              Mike




                              1965 Black Ext / Silver Int. Coupe, L84 Duntov, French Lick, 2023 - Triple Diamond
                              1965 Red Ext / White & Red Int. Conv. - 327/250 AC Regional Top Flight.

                              Comment

                              • Jason S.
                                Expired
                                • January 1, 2012
                                • 72

                                #30
                                Re: Classic Engine Company

                                Originally posted by Terry Deusterman (11486)
                                Jason
                                If you have no intension of selling the car, why go through the cost and trouble to put a fake original motor in it? Why not just put in any chevy motor and drive it and enjoy it. After you do all this and the car is completed and you are out somewhere and a guy walks up to see your car are you going to tell him the motor is not original? The M/W dictionary defines restoration as "act or process of returning something to its original condition by repairing it, cleaning it, etc." Doesn't say anything about replacing with a fake to make it seem original. Don't get me wrong I'm a firm believer in doing what you want to your car, but I hate to see cars passed off as original when they are not! And by doing so you are keeping these tricksters in business.
                                Terry - I intended to go through the trouble of doing this because one simple fact - my engine is being rebuilt anyway.
                                if I'm going to have all the machining work done on AN engine, it costs the same to do all the machining work on a '62 block, just as it would cost me to redo the machining work on a '64 block that's in it now. Plus the bearings and gaskets, etc.....would cost the same either way whether I rebuilt a '62 or '64 block.

                                The "good news" is I can exchange the '64 block for a '62 block that likely has a casting date within about a 1 week timeframe of what my car probably had in it back in the day (based on looking at the statistics in the Noland Adams books).
                                It's not causing me much $ or heartache since the engine is coming out anyway. If I'm going to rebuild the engine.......why not rebuild it "better".....why spend money to knowingly put the "wrong" '64 block back in. That's the reason..........

                                Perhaps I never made it clear I was pulling the engine anyway......otherwise I would agree with you. If I was tearing apart the car just to make one casting date and stamp pad "more" correct - even though in every other way both the '64 and '62 3782870 blocks are functionally identical? Yes, that would seem like a lot of pain with little reward.

                                Comment

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