C3 Exhaust Systems

[Don B.]

I am getting ready to replace my exhaust system on my 72 coupe. I was considering a Gardner reproduction system but I was told that is it a waste of money in terms of NCRS judging because any new system will cause points to be deducted, so it really doesn't matter whether it is a reproduction system or not. Obviously, the Gardner system is an expensive option and while I am not trying to pinch pennies, I want to get the best value for my money.

1. Is this a correct statement?
2. Is there a system that will minimize loss of judging points?
3. Will it lose more points if it stainless steel than (soon to be rusty) mild steel?
4. Does anyone know of a system that is likely to be the most identical to the factory installed system.

[Don H.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Is this a correct statement? Not if you need a new exhaust system. Yes, any new system will not exactly match the original in several ways, and will take deductions in flight judging.
Is there a system that will minimize loss of judging points? Yes, any carbon steel system will take less point loss than aluminized or SS. There are Standard Deductions that apply to aluminized (25%) and SS (50%) systems.
Will it lose more points if it stainless steel than (soon to be rusty) mild steel? Yes, see answer to 2 above.
Does anyone know of a system that is likely to be the most identical to the factory installed system. We each have our ideas what we like. I happen to like the Corvette Central carbon steel system.

Don, Russ reminded me that I should have said I like the CC one-piece carbon steel system, especially the N11 version. It fits, sounds and judges as good or better than anything else you can buy (in my humble opinion)

[Don B.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Thanks Don

[Russ S.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

If you like a good sounding system I would go with the CC off road one piece back from center system.

[Gene M.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

If ya just care about points nothing is total correct. Reproductions will all get something wrong and should see a deduction. I’m with a few others on this board and hate rust. I for go the points and have 300 series stainless, the forever material. Also if you drive your car the stainless has a nice mellow tone. But there is a cost premium for 300 series stainless.

[Terry M.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Don, Russ reminded me that I should have said I like the CC one-piece carbon steel system, especially the N11 version. It fits, sounds and judges as good or better than anything else you can buy (in my humble opinion)[/I]

Don H,

Remember there was no N11 system available for 1969 and newer C3s. One may like the sound (which is a subjective opinion), but the exhaust system is judged on the basis of CDCIF and not sound.

[Russ S.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

But Terry, in judging you can't tell it is a N11 system and the configuration is the same as originally on the later than 67 sharks. Of course it only correctly fits a 4 spd car.

Don H,

Remember there was no N11 system available for 1969 and newer C3s. One may like the sound (which is a subjective opinion), but the exhaust system is judged on the basis of CDCIF and not sound.

[Terry M.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

But Terry, in judging you can't tell it is a N11 system and the configuration is the same as originally on the later than 67 sharks. Of course it only correctly fits a 4 spd car.

Must be CCs N11 that is configured the same. GMs N11 (when it was available) was not.

[Don B.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Thanks for all of the input. I now have a lot to think about, but I am inclined at this moment to go with an aluminized system from Corvette Central. They are fairly economical

One more question: Do the tips make a big a big difference? I think the ones on my car are original, but I cannot seem to find any markings, part numbers, etc. They are not beat up, but do show some corrosion. Any recommendations for a new one?

[Patrick H.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

One more question: Do the tips make a big a big difference? I think the ones on my car are original, but I cannot seem to find any markings, part numbers, etc. They are not beat up, but do show some corrosion. Any recommendations for a new one?

Can you post photos of them?

If they are original, I would have them rechromed by someone who knows what they are doing.
It's way too easy to overrestore them if you're not careful.

[Jeff P.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

I recently got a system by Gardner. This is the closest to correct I have seen for my 68.

[Gene M.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Keep in mind the standard deduction covers the “type” of system being evualated. The configuration, welds, markings, method of assembly, forms, construction, etc must be correct to avoid more deductions. As Terry points out this is were the CDCIF applies.

[Gene M.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

That is not a correct statement once you apply the standard deduction CDCIF no longer applies.

Paul, you have a misunderstanding item 6 in standard deductions pertains specifically about stainless steel and aluminumized replacements for standard MINIMUM DEDUCTIONS OF 50% & 25%. IT GOES ON TO SAY THE DEDUCTION WILL BE GREATER IF NOT CONFIGURED CORRECTLY. The base 25% and 50% are for the stainless and aluminized materials. So understand the CDCIF process as Terry pointed out is the criteria used for other than any deviation for incorrect materials.

This is an area where many do not understand the intent of the standard deduction is a separate call from the CDCIF. It would be possible to have everything correct and have a 50% deduct for wrong stainless material. But I’ve not seen anything vendor offered that does so.

[Terry B.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

I have been following this thread and I am confused about how we are administering a standard deduction. I thought the purpose of a standard deduction was to make judging consistent and eliminate the variables of the number of points taken off for a part or system that was not being made as the original, as example: tires, batteries, windshield glass. If there is a standard deduction for the exhaust system, wouldn't also adding CDCIF be taking points off for items the standard deduction had already addressed? More explanation is needed if you are going to apply both.

Thanks,

Terry

[Gary B.]

Re: C3 Exhaust Systems

Sorry, long post, but bear with me.

NCRS Judging sheets for 68-72 for the exhaust is:

8 Originality, 7 Condition; Exhaust Pipes and Heat Riser. Also judged is the self-locking nuts at the exhaust manifold, the triangle clamp flange and donut.

6 Originality, 4 Condition; Exhaust Hangers (at transmission and at muffler) and all four Clamps. Also judged is the ground straps and fastener and the bolts holding the muffler at the rear hanger.

8 Originality, 7 Condition; Mufflers. Also judged is the decals on the muffler.

6 Originality, 4 Condition; Exhaust Tips. Also judge decals.

According to the Judging Reference Manual, 8^th