63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

[Jason S.]

The NCRS judging manual states an "early" 1963 L76 would have a 3782609 water pump, and a "later" L76 would have a 3859326 water pump. In either case, these would not be dated yet for 1963.

My car is a late-December 1962 build - which is considered "early" in many cases when it comes to different parts.
Neither the judging manual - or the Noland Adams restoration guide - gives indications around what timeframe or VIN the water pump may have changed. I'm assuming for the moment mine would still be considered "early" and use the #609 pump in this case?

With that said, I see that original rebuilt #326 pumps are much easier to find (and much less expensive) than original rebuilt #609's. I found an original #609 for over $400, where the #326s regularly go for half that.

I am also seeing now that a large vendor - Corvette Central - is selling reproduction #609's for a reasonable price (in my opinion). they are supposedly USA made...........does anyone have experience with these repro pumps?

Jason

[Joe L.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

The NCRS judging manual states an "early" 1963 L76 would have a 3782609 water pump, and a "later" L76 would have a 3859326 water pump. In either case, these would not be dated yet for 1963.

My car is a late-December 1962 build - which is considered "early" in many cases when it comes to different parts.
Neither the judging manual - or the Noland Adams restoration guide - gives indications around what timeframe or VIN the water pump may have changed. I'm assuming for the moment mine would still be considered "early" and use the #609 pump in this case?

With that said, I see that original rebuilt #326 pumps are much easier to find (and much less expensive) than original rebuilt #609's. I found an original #609 for over $400, where the #326s regularly go for half that.

I am also seeing now that a large vendor - Corvette Central - is selling reproduction #609's for a reasonable price (in my opinion). they are supposedly USA made...........does anyone have experience with these repro pumps?

Jason

Jason-------

This has been discussed at great length previously. I don't think that ANY 1963 Corvettes or, probably, any 1964 Corvettes were ever originally equipped with a 3859326 waterpump casting. For one thing, the drawing for the 3859326 casting is dated May, 1965 and that's exactly consistent with the part number sequence.

I believe that 1963 Corvettes with engines using external bypass (i.e. 340 and 360 hp) used pump GM #3782609. Very late 1963's MAY have used pump casting GM #3839175.

[Joe R.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Jason-------

This has been discussed at great length previously. I don't think that ANY 1963 Corvettes or, probably, any 1964 Corvettes were ever originally equipped with a 3859326 waterpump casting. For one thing, the drawing for the 3859326 casting is dated May, 1965 and that's exactly consistent with the part number sequence.

I believe that 1963 Corvettes with engines using external bypass (i.e. 340 and 360 hp) used pump GM #3782609. Very late 1963's MAY have used pump casting GM #3839175.

For what it worth I completely agree with Joe Lucia when he says that
1963 Corvettes originally had 609 water pumps. 326 Water pumps were not delivered on 1964 Corvettes until May 1964 or later.

JR

[Tracy C.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

This is another incorrect item in the 63/4 judging manual. Roy Sinor promised it would be corrected at the next revision. See previous discussion at this link. I hope David will ensure this happens.

http://https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthrea...ter+pump+sinor

[Edward J.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Jason, I think that most judges will not deduct for either pump as you see most here believe the 609 is correct, But the 326 is spelled out in the JM. My 326 water pump went through the regional with out a hitch. unless a change is made I think you'll be safe with either.

[Jason S.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Thank you - I think Mr. Crisler's documentation tells alot. the judging manual is a great guide, but it doesn't surprise me that occasionally there may be some errors.
The "good news" is I have a couple options for the 609 pump - a rebuilt original at over $400 isn't palatable IMO, but now that there are US-made repros being made for the 609 at roughly $200, that seems more reasonable.

[Joe R.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Jason,

Here's the bad news!!!!

Now that you have broadcast over the NCRS board about the 609 vs. 326 water pump there is not a chance that you will pass with anything but a 609 water pump.

Sorry,

JR

[Frank D.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

I have a 609 'real deal' pump, rebuilt by Bill Mock I'll sell you for $400...
Avoid those repros some of them are Chinesium (maybe all of them) with thicker casting that impede water flow and can cause problems...

[Dan H.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Agree with Frank, I had a repro 326 and the casting inlets were very restrictive, get the real one (609) and avoid problems. Bill Mock does a fabulous job on the water pumps, good forever!
Dan

[Jason S.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Fair enough - I just looked him up in the Driveline mag and sent him an email.......anyone know off the top of their head what he typically charges, or should I just wait for the "shock" .

I also found a vendor near me that lists a 609 pump in their inventory......I'll have to swing by personally and inquire if it's a rebuilt original or one of the repros. Just to restate, though, the repro's I have seen recently available are claiming to be "US Made", FWIW. I'm not sure how much of it has to be made or assembled "In the USA" to wear that label though........

When I get access to one of these pumps - if Bill doesn't have one - can I identify if it's a restrictive "bad" casting by looking at the pump-to-block passages, or would the potential issue areas be inside the pump behind the backing plate?

[Joe L.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Jason,

Here's the bad news!!!!

Now that you have broadcast over the NCRS board about the 609 vs. 326 water pump there is not a chance that you will pass with anything but a 609 water pump.

Sorry,

JR

JR------


I'm not so sure of that. As long as the Judging Guide says that the 3859326 pump is correct for 1963, I would think that judges would be hard-pressed to "over-rule" that.

[Tim T.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

No matter what the JG says the 609 is the only correct pump for your application. Yes, they are expensive, but in the overall cost/value of a 63 they are minimal. If you are comfortable with one that is not correct but the JG says is OK, go for it. If you are anal like me, you will never be satisfied unless you get an original 609. Bill Mock is one of the best. Repros are just that.
Your decision.

[Frank D.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

The passages are one method, then a repro can have cheapo 'vanes' internally to circulate the water and often the number/letters stamped on the casting are incorrect/wrong. If you want pics of the "609" pump I have and a copy of the receipt from when I purchased it; email 'fdreano@earthlink.net'.

[Joe R.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Joe L.,

Get you a 63 or 64 and go get it judged! You'll be talking a different tune after that experience!
And I speak from experience and a lot of it!

JR

JR------


I'm not so sure of that. As long as the Judging Guide says that the 3859326 pump is correct for 1963, I would think that judges would be hard-pressed to "over-rule" that.

[Frank D.]

Re: 63E Water Pump - 3782609 vs 3859326

Yeah - I'm doing just that next month in Lakeland. If you're in the 63 world, for some parts, you just have to "pay to play". They are rare, and, in some cases, there are only a few specialists who restore them. I expect my '63 console back from Any Cannizzo next week....I've been selling Avon door-to-door to pay the bill (* SMILE *)...

As with many things in life you can have it CHEAP, FAST, or, CORRECT... You can get any one of those three things but not all three...