C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

[Ed S.]

I ordered a left and right vent window regulator repair kit from Paragon. While repairing the right side unit I noticed that the primary repair part in the kit (the gear) was significantly lighter in weight than the one I removed, it felt flimsy. I checked the left repair kit part and found that it was more like the original - heavy and sturdy feeling. It was not the same as the right gear. Also, the new right gear would not seat fully in the regulator housing and it binds when I tried to turn it by hand. The shaft is thicker than the original.

I called Paragon to discuss the poor quality of the part. They expressed sorrow for the problem I was having but they said all their parts are the same, the left and right gears on the shelves are the same as what they sent me, and it is not uncommon to have to sand or grind down the diameter of the shaft to make it fit. The tech rep went on to explain that these parts are from a US manufacturer and made in the US, not overseas and, if I were to order the offending part from another supplier I would probably get the same item because Paragon supplies most of the Vette specialty vendors with this item (or they get it from the same manufacturer). He further explained that what I experienced is not an unusual or unique problem - common with reproduction parts - all depends on the manufacturer - in this case there is no satisfactory alternative.

Very unfortunate - it is getting impossible to maintain these cars in a state of like-original - unless you just park it and never drive it but I am not willing to do that.

[Russ S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

There's no way you should have to machine them to fit. If you do the manufacture has obviously done a poor job of machining the gear.

[Ed S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Russ, you would think so but.... when the vendor tells you a replacement will be no better or different then what you got what choice do you have. But, after "sleeping" on the issue for a night and thinking about what you said, I am motivated to call Paragon back and take this up the chain of command a notch or two. This cannot be the quality control standard they expect customers to expect. Will keep you informed of progress / developments.

[Frank D.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

The repro drive gear in the headlight motors went through the same evolution; originally over-sized and ill fitting -- took some work to get them installed. Eventually, through complaints, a desire to do better or just better sources the gears were corrected and fit perfectly now.

I rebuilt my DS vent window regulator with one of those kits (3 parts is a "kit" now I guess)...it doesn't bind anymore but wouldn't pass judging. If you put the end of the handle at the top of its stroke and shake the vent window glass frame the handle will quickly drop. There is no resistance (hence tight fit) in the setup whatsoever...

[Ed S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Frank, I don't want to start a fire storm here but you made a very poignant point when you said, ".... but won't pass judging". As time passes and original parts become non functional we have no choice but to replace them with less than fully functional or authentic appearing substitutes...."that won't pass the judging test".

Eventually, no Corvette will earn a Top Flight unless a near perfect example is vacuum packed and stored away for posterity, which in my mind, defeats the purpose of having one of these great cars --- driving it. It's sad, something will have to give. We either stop using them and exposing them to air or change judging criteria, in the long run we can't have it both ways. I hope I haven't offended anyone with my observation - I have no plans (at this time) to pursue Top Flight status but like many of us, I am expending a good bit of time and money in an effort to maintain my '64 as original (and functional) as possible.

[Frank D.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

I don't think there is anything wrong with your observation. Wasn't it Noland Adams that said something to the effect that most the cars fresh off the GM assembly line back in the day wouldn't pass current judging standards ? Two things will happen; repro parts will have to get better and closer to factory specs in fit and function or the judging standards will change. Otherwise, when the fixed pool of OEM/NOS/original used parts is depleted the number of cars that can reach Top Flight will decrease - its simple math. I don't lose sleep over it since none of my cars are judged.

That doesn't mean I don't want decent repro parts however...

I think the repro parts will gradually improve as demand rises and price points make improvements practical for manufacturers. I can tell you I have personally seen this in the Mustang hobby. In the 70s/80s there was a spate of Taiwanese sheet metal for the first gen Mustangs that was embarrassing. Paper thin and fit and function was abysmal. Today you can get pieces that hardly require any trim up to install and are indistinguishable from factory in many cases. Time will tell.

What I do revile is having to do jobs twice -- at some point I'll have to tear down my vent window regulators AGAIN and figure out a way to make them work better...

[Ed S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

(Final) update. I called Paragon and spoke to a supervisor this morning, got the same answer albeit a bit more sympathetic. The reason there is a difference in the left and right gears in the repair kits I bought is that the left gear is NOS while the right is a reproduction. They have a bunch of NOS left gears but no right side gears. So.... anyone that thinks they might need a vent window regulator repair kit in the future might consider ordering at least the left side vent window kit now and get a NOS part while they last. Paragon part # 13315K. As for the part that doesn't quite fit perfectly, unfortunately they have no desirable replacement - it will have to be "adjusted" by owner.

The fix involved removing a few thousands of an inch of material from the circumference of the shaft. Easily done, the other end of the part can be secured in a 1/2 inch drill chuck. While spinning the gear in the drill I just held a narrow strip of emery paper against the oversize part of the shaft and took some material off. Easy fix - fits perfectly. Hope it lasts.

[Jim S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Ed,

I have a set of Vent Widow Regulators . I bought these 20 years ago. (ala. Joe Lucia: not for sale ) But I was wondering if your NOS example had the same GM part number ? I think they are for a C2 , but could only be for later years , or both as well . I am planning on using them on my 66 , so just checking

Jim

[Ed S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Jim,
I purchased vent window regulator "repair kits" from Paragon, not the whole regulator. So far I've removed and repaired the passenger side regulator - haven't taken the left side out of the car yet. I just checked the PS regulator for a part number. The only thing that is on it is the number "7"; under it there is an "FR8", under that there is "6X". There is a very small symbol beside the "F" it looks like a number of concentric circles (very small) and a diamond shape in the center of the smallest circle.

If you intend to use / install the regulators I would recommend opening them up and cleaning out the lubricant - it is probably dried up or at least like paste. Then replace it with new lithium based lubricant. There was absolutely no moist lubricant inside my regulator at all - of course it is 51 years old. Procedures for opening and re sealing the regulators is part of the overhaul process and instructions are available on the web. Let me know if you need them, I have them in PDF and word.

[Jim S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

"I purchased vent window regulator "repair kits" from Paragon, not the whole regulator."

Oh yeah , Hence title of your thread , Duh !
If you wouldn't mind , I will take that PDF.

Thanks,

Jim
jimschwering@cox.net

[Page C.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Hi Ed,
I went through the same thing with the right side regulator gear. The left fit perfectly and I had to turn the right down to fit the case. I purchased them from Zip who gets them from Paragon. Paragon was a little vague about there source and when I pointed out the the OD of the shaft was about .002-.003 larger than the hole and made of a different material they said they would check on it. I turn it down and used it but it's hard to believe that somebody who is making them can't copy and existing piece. This is not rocket science

[Tracy C.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

I ordered a left and right vent window regulator repair kit from Paragon. While repairing the right side unit I noticed that the primary repair part in the kit (the gear) was significantly lighter in weight than the one I removed, it felt flimsy. I checked the left repair kit part and found that it was more like the original - heavy and sturdy feeling. It was not the same as the right gear. Also, the new right gear would not seat fully in the regulator housing and it binds when I tried to turn it by hand. The shaft is thicker than the original.

I called Paragon to discuss the poor quality of the part. They expressed sorrow for the problem I was having but they said all their parts are the same, the left and right gears on the shelves are the same as what they sent me, and it is not uncommon to have to sand or grind down the diameter of the shaft to make it fit. The tech rep went on to explain that these parts are from a US manufacturer and made in the US, not overseas and, if I were to order the offending part from another supplier I would probably get the same item because Paragon supplies most of the Vette specialty vendors with this item (or they get it from the same manufacturer). He further explained that what I experienced is not an unusual or unique problem - common with reproduction parts - all depends on the manufacturer - in this case there is no satisfactory alternative.

Very unfortunate - it is getting impossible to maintain these cars in a state of like-original - unless you just park it and never drive it but I am not willing to do that.

I've rebuilt several vent window regulators using the machined gears and have never had a problem with fitment. I wouldn't use an NOS pot metal gear if it was free. After a few uses, the gear splines twist and you get a real sloppy handle just like the one you had before the rebuild. The replacement gear will out last you or your car.

America's finest sells good gear kits direct or you can get the same kit from Corvette Central.
tc

[Ed S.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Jim,
Two PDFs with step by step info & pics on how to rebuild a mid-year window regulator. I found these on the internet, the longer of the two has been referenced in NCRS Tech forum postings a number of times. I cannot take credit for either article, the author's names are on the first page of each - and my thanks and a tip of the hat to both of them, they were very helpful. The longer of the two articles addresses a lot more than just the regulators. Good luck

[Page C.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Tracy,
Does the machined gear from Americas Finest have the stop feature built into the gear to keep it in the range of opening and closing like the original GM gear? In the past this feature was missing.

[Tracy C.]

Re: C2 Vent Window Regulator Repair Kit

Tracy,
Does the machined gear from Americas Finest have the stop feature built into the gear to keep it in the range of opening and closing like the original GM gear? In the past this feature was missing.

No stop feature but once installed the window will turn inward and stop against your door panel anyway just like the factory part. The stop feature of the original design is only evident when you have the regulator out of the car.