C3: How can you tell repro parts

[Jon S.]

The last time I had my '69 Flight Judged, two items lost points because the judges said they were reproductions. Unfortunately, the judges didn't write on the sheets how they could tell they were repros.

The first of these was the 'Tonawanda' decal on my valve cover. The TIM&JG says nothing about the Tonawanda decal except that it is there (no description of dimensions, finish, or color). How can I tell an original from a repro?

The second item were the crossed flag emblems. All the TIM&JG says about the emblems is that the upper left corner of the checkered flag should be black. Mine are, so how do I tell a 'correct' emblem?

Thanks,
Jon
#10673

[Joe L.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon--

Sometimes, you can't tell the difference; sometimes, you can.

The script on the reproduction Tonawanda valve cover label is slightly different than the original. It seems to me that the "T" is thinner, or something like that. I've never paid much attention to this detail. Originals are almost impossible to obtain these days, so whatever you get in reproduction is about as good as you can do.

The only difference that I am aware of on the hood and fuel door emblems is that the "reproductions" are of noticably better quality than the originals. Also, some folks think that the "red" on the originals was a little different than the "reproductions".

Both of the emblems are still available from GM under GM #3912706, front, and GM #3957809, rear. However, these emblems were not really high quality to begin with (i.e. when the cars were made new) and they got a lot worse in later SERVICE. It's possible, though, that GM is now obtaining these from the "reproduction" source (Trim Parts). In that case, they'll be very high quality and, therefore, completely "non-original".

[Joe L.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon--

Sometimes, you can't tell the difference; sometimes, you can.

The script on the reproduction Tonawanda valve cover label is slightly different than the original. It seems to me that the "T" is thinner, or something like that. I've never paid much attention to this detail. Originals are almost impossible to obtain these days, so whatever you get in reproduction is about as good as you can do.

The only difference that I am aware of on the hood and fuel door emblems is that the "reproductions" are of noticably better quality than the originals. Also, some folks think that the "red" on the originals was a little different than the "reproductions".

Both of the emblems are still available from GM under GM #3912706, front, and GM #3957809, rear. However, these emblems were not really high quality to begin with (i.e. when the cars were made new) and they got a lot worse in later SERVICE. It's possible, though, that GM is now obtaining these from the "reproduction" source (Trim Parts). In that case, they'll be very high quality and, therefore, completely "non-original".

[Dave McDufford]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

I have toured the Trim Parts plant as part of a chapter meeting. For the most part they are using the orginal GM tooling for things like the emblems so it would be difficult except perhaps for color to tell the difference.

Dave

[Dave McDufford]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

I have toured the Trim Parts plant as part of a chapter meeting. For the most part they are using the orginal GM tooling for things like the emblems so it would be difficult except perhaps for color to tell the difference.

Dave

[Robert C.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon, The deductions for your caron those 2 items should not have been taken unless a specific difference is noted. The word "repro" should never apear on a judging sheet. I would contact your team leader and tell him of your situation so that doesn't happen again.
Bob Cook/ 68-72 Judging Team

[Robert C.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon, The deductions for your caron those 2 items should not have been taken unless a specific difference is noted. The word "repro" should never apear on a judging sheet. I would contact your team leader and tell him of your situation so that doesn't happen again.
Bob Cook/ 68-72 Judging Team

[Roy B.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts "wait"

I don't mean to argue with a 260 level judge, but after judging for many years #182 and never asked for any points and have none, I feel the owner of any year should know if they have a repro part on their Corvette.
If that part can be determined to be a repro why not let the owner know? or lets take the word original off the JM.
I would think a new Corvette owner having his or her Corvette to be judge at $100.00 would like to know weather they got an original Corvette. Isn't that the idea of judging????

Hay! why not throw out all those nasty ugly looking original parts and replace them with pretty repro's.

[Roy B.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts "wait"

I don't mean to argue with a 260 level judge, but after judging for many years #182 and never asked for any points and have none, I feel the owner of any year should know if they have a repro part on their Corvette.
If that part can be determined to be a repro why not let the owner know? or lets take the word original off the JM.
I would think a new Corvette owner having his or her Corvette to be judge at $100.00 would like to know weather they got an original Corvette. Isn't that the idea of judging????

Hay! why not throw out all those nasty ugly looking original parts and replace them with pretty repro's.

[Jon S.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Thanks guys. The point deduction was minimal, and given that it sounds like it might be really hard to tell the difference if I find a "correct" part, I guess I'll leave them for now (I might end up making things worse if I replace them). If the subject comes up in judging this summer, I'll ask them to note more details on the sheet or, perhaps, reconsider the deduction.

[Jon S.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Thanks guys. The point deduction was minimal, and given that it sounds like it might be really hard to tell the difference if I find a "correct" part, I guess I'll leave them for now (I might end up making things worse if I replace them). If the subject comes up in judging this summer, I'll ask them to note more details on the sheet or, perhaps, reconsider the deduction.

[Patrick H.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Sometimes when judging, the word "repro" may get written, but the judge should take the time later to discuss with you exactly what the differences might be. I've found many times where the timy spaces given on the Judging Sheets for comments aren't large enough to write all I'd like to write.

Patrick

[Patrick H.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Sometimes when judging, the word "repro" may get written, but the judge should take the time later to discuss with you exactly what the differences might be. I've found many times where the timy spaces given on the Judging Sheets for comments aren't large enough to write all I'd like to write.

Patrick

[Terry M.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon,
In the judges' training scools we constantly (at least it seems to me) harp on the point that the word "reproduction" is NOT adequate for comments to justify a deduction on the score sheet. Somehow the message doesn't get to the folks who need to hear it. THe reasons for that are exactly what you have encountered.

The reproduction Tonawanda label is slighly smaller (about 1/16 to 1/8-inch) in both length and width than the original. There are the aforementioned font differences as well. The original is a three part sandwich. A piece of heavy paper covers the adheisive-backed label, and a thinner piece of lightly adheisive paper covers the top. The heavy paper is removed, and label and cover paper attached. After paint (for those engines which had painted covers) the top cover paper was removed. I believe the reproduction piece is only a two part sandwich. The cover paper is not present on the reproduction.

[Terry M.]

Re: C3: How can you tell repro parts

Jon,
In the judges' training scools we constantly (at least it seems to me) harp on the point that the word "reproduction" is NOT adequate for comments to justify a deduction on the score sheet. Somehow the message doesn't get to the folks who need to hear it. THe reasons for that are exactly what you have encountered.

The reproduction Tonawanda label is slighly smaller (about 1/16 to 1/8-inch) in both length and width than the original. There are the aforementioned font differences as well. The original is a three part sandwich. A piece of heavy paper covers the adheisive-backed label, and a thinner piece of lightly adheisive paper covers the top. The heavy paper is removed, and label and cover paper attached. After paint (for those engines which had painted covers) the top cover paper was removed. I believe the reproduction piece is only a two part sandwich. The cover paper is not present on the reproduction.