Retro tires

[Michael H.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

GL,

I should have been more specific and not included the Cosworth in my previous outlook on Vega. They were a different item and most wound up in the hands of collectors so the rust problem would have been a non issue. They were/are a pretty cool little car and I do appreciate them for what they were. When I think about Vega, I get the typical mental picture of one totally rusted beyond hope, sitting on the side of the expressway with the hood up and no one around.

I completely agree with you on the Corvair safety issue. That whole thing was a fraud from the beginning. Nader only invented most of the things he claimed were wrong with the Corvair to make a name for himself as an attorney. (hint: type "anti Ralph Nader into yer search page)

[Dick W.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

Yeh. The Cosworth was what I bought (X2) One I had over 12,000 miles of fun with. Amazing little toy. Always thought that they were hand grenades with the pins pulled though. The other has only 19 miles on it today

[Mike Cobine]

Not a bad car if you use all AC / GM parts.

The electric fuel pump in my '75 ran about 60,000 miles. The second about two weeks. The third was still going when the car was sold with 150,000 miles.

Lesson? Buy only AC parts in critical areas like the pump in a gas tank. The generic brand from the parts store saved a few dollars only to lose it all two weeks later.

[GL Anderson]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

I agree and do know all about Mr Nader. As a long time Corvair guy (CORSA member) besides Corvettes, Vegas and all sorts of other cars, I have had a very dim view of him since he burst on the scene. I have had Corvairs, early and late models, since the middle 60's and driven them past any sane limits even by todays standards, without any problems at all. Must be my early go-cart training or else they were better cars than given credit for. GL

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Fable?

The zinc plating was added in '75. My '75 had zinc coating all through the engine compartment.

It did rust out, though. Wiper grill was chipped when I got it new and had started to rust. The dealer bodyshop at Merollis Chevrolet never fixed it right, just dapping touch up paint over it. I had them do it three times, and finally gave up on them.

Front fenders in front of the door and the rocker panels began rusting through at about 5 years, mainly due to the 60s series tires and rocks thrown up. Cleaned and repainted this area several times but eventually lost.

Then again, it was never driven like a collector.

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

In stock form, I never found the Cosworth so amazing. A friend had #0816. Off the line it wouldn't take my GT but would at top end. However, after I put on the Blackjack aluminized header and rejected the two-barrel, the Cosworth was never a threat.

Now a Cosworth with a pair of sidedraft Webers was another thing. But the stock EFI was not one of Chevy's shining moments.

[GL Anderson]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

I think your friends car may have been a problem child. The fuel injection system was as good as it got for the time. Infact you could actually change the low and high speed rich and lean settings in the computer with a small screw driver if you had the instructions. Also the stock muffler was a restriction, Bill Howell told me to replace mine with a Corvair turbo muffler and gain 22hp. I have beaten great number of all types of muscle cars and sports cars with mine, but only about a dozen of regular Vegas when we were in the same class. But thats just my experience. GL

[Duke W.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

Like most CV owners, you've got it all wrong. The CV EFI is much less restrictive and makes more power than Webers. The biggest problem with the CV was the very restrictive exhaust system and too much valve overlap to kill NOx. I developed a reindexing scheme to retard the inlet cam 8 degrees and advance the exhaust cam 8 degrees, The result is essentially the L-79 cam, and it still easily meets emission test limits. Go to www.cosworthvega.com From the home page click on dyno pulls and my analysis from the June Roundup. There are lots of photos, too.

Compare my car with the Weber equipped car. Even the one that was showroom stock except reindexed cams made better peak power and torque bandwidth than the Weber equipped car. How many other emission legal mid-seventies cars will make one HP per cubic inch at the rear wheels at 7000 and 80 percent torque bandwidth from 1900 to 7200 on 8:1 compression and regular unleaded?

The biggest problem with the '75 was the gearing. The four-speed ratios were totally unsuited to the engine's torque curve. I drove one and decided to keep my '72 GT. I bought a '76 with a five speed and 4.10 axle without even driving it. All I had to do was look at the gear ratios to realize they finally got it right!

Duke

[Terry M.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

I didn't want to add to the off topic comments, but this thread has gone all kinds of interesting places, so I'll give in.

I have noted that CORSA has had Mr. Nader at their convention, I think more than once, when he was NOT running for office. The club (as an organization) seems to not bear any hard feelings toward him.

I know I haven't learned much about driving since I did loop-the-loops in a 1960 Corvair. I was lucky to survive those (note the plural) experiences, but I was young enough to think that was fun. I understand the later Corvairs had much improved suspension, but the early ones had sudden brake-away of the rear that could put your vital organs in an advanced state of excitement. I know missed out on that go-cart experience.

[GL Anderson]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

Duke I agree about the gearing on the 75 CV. Mine is a 75 but has the 3.50 low gear Saginaw that Chevrolet intended to build the cars with. Works very well with the 3.73 rear axle. Also have the quick steering gearbox. Makes it very hard to park but again works great for autocrossing etc. GL

[Dave Suesz]

We did just that...

Had a 71 notchback, from almost new (I guess the original owner was a fortunteller) just a couple thousand miles. Sold it at 48,000. Replaced the distributor, three head gaskets, two sets of rear wheel bearings, alternator, and timing belt. This after maintaining at better intervals than factory recommendations. Got too close to a pickup truck that slammed on its brakes for a dog, found out a) why Vegas were so cheap b) why they rusted out so bad- The RF fender and the panel above the grille had no paint, undercoating, primer, NOTHING inside! Absolutely bare metal exposed to road soil, salt, etc.! I still remember the fender was $41 - That's $172 today.

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

My experience with the Cosworths is limited. But of the ones I saw autocrossing and hillclimbing, the ones with the Webers produced much lower times than the EFI Cosworths. It could well be that while switching the EFI for Webers, they also changed the exhaust, but I don't know.

The '75 CV had a 3.73 rear and I thought a close ratio 4 speed (could be wrong on that). The GT had a 2.95 rear (ugh!) but had a wide ratio 4 speed and gearign was close to the same when in first, but the longer stroke 2300 cc had more bottom end than the 2000 cc CV.

With the Blackjack header, a 2-1/2 inch exhaust, and a Corvair Turbo muffler from GM, the GT performed much better than that particular CV and any others it ran across autocrossing.

But then, the GT cost $4000 and the CV was $6500, nearly the price of a new Corvette.

[Duke W.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

The shorter tranmission gearing scheduled for the '75 CV as listed in the '75 CV brochure did not make production, so the transmission gears were the same as the standard Vega (3.10.2.20, 1.47, 1.00:1). The 3.73 axle was not enough to make up for the additional 200 pounds of equipment (like 5 MPH bumpers) relative to early Vegas and a the combination of high valve overlap and high exhaust backpressure is guaranteed to just KILL the torque curve.

The Borg-Warner T-50 gearing is 3.41, 2.16, 1.40, 1.00, 0.80:1 driving a 4.10 axle, so you got a 20 percent shorter starting gear and a ten percent taller cruise gear.

Look at the dyno pulls at www.cosworthvega.com

Duke

[John H.]

Re: Retro tires

Mike, the coolant recovery system started in '73 on the Vega (accompanied by a patent infringement lawsuit from the outside guy who actually invented it, which was settled with big GM $$$). The base 12" x 12" radiator was a big improvement over the original pre-prototype design, which had no radiator at all; the heater core provided the only cooling, with cowl intake air ducted through it and exhausted under the floor pan (at Ed Cole's direction).

[Duke W.]

Re: Only need to change one thing.....

Swing axles like the early Corvairs are probably one of the WORST rear suspension designs ever devised. BTW, the design was conceived by Dr. Ferry Porsche! The issue I always had with Nader is that he crucified the Corvair without even mentioning the VW Beetle and Microbus, which also had swing axles. I guess he didn't want to destroy the hippie cult car, which was and still is his primary constituency.

I've probably lived through more spins in Beetles than Corvairs, including one in a Microbus that nearly sent us over a mountain cliff!

The second design Corvair had double u-jointed half-shafts. In fact the basic suspension architecture was an adaptation of Zora's three link design that lived a happy life for 20 years of Corvette production, but it's not without it's own flaws!

Duke