58 to 62 Vin # number ?

[Roy B.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

All 54 to 57 that I have had were all stamps twice and belieave all C1's were.

[Norbert R.]

Re: 58 to 62 Vin # number ?

Yes, we are out here, I have had my 60' for 20 years. I read the forum every week and learn from it every week. Great data. Keep sending in the little things. They do help.

[Clare Carpenter]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

Roy, your explanation was exactly what I was thinking. I know of a '61 (one owner) currently undergoing resto by the original owner, that needed a new frame. It's getting a really nice used one stamped with a differant VIN. I have no idea why that frame is separated from it's body or what happened to the rest of the car or the matching title. It would make sense to restamp the frame in this case or in the case of any frame replacement, just to avoid any possibility of problems. If it were me, I'd want the frame ID to match the rest of the vehicle.

I bought a 1969 SS 396/375 Chevelle back in 71 from the original owner who'd just had the short block replaced under warranty. I was stoked because I was getting a fresh lower end. I don't know if the replacement block was stamped with the VIN by the service dept. or not. I never thought to check it back then but have often wondered since getting involved with Corvettes. If this was a common practice in the service dept., there must be a lot of "correct" stamping sets floating around out there.

By the way, I'm guessing a "pink" is the title, as in "racing for pink slips"? Did anyone ever actually do that?

[Roy B.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

A pink in Ca. is a title , and yes I and others know of a few Corvettes using the same ID number from different states. Many members may have for gotten that #03 corvette 1953 frame was found under a 1955 Corvette years ago by the person doing a body off. It was wrote up in the Drive Line. What happened to it I don't know. But like I said , if your in the right State you can register a Corvette using just the frame number or tag number. So then you can have two Corvettes using the same Serial numbers.

[mike cobine]

More common than you would think in the

Vintage Race Car world. There have been several old and very special race cars that are essentially clones of each other, using the real definition of clone. A piece of the original car is built into a car, another piece of the original car is built into another car, and so on. Each claims to be "original".

What stops it somewhat with street cars is that you need the serial number on something, so you basically have to have a car with no serial number plate in order to use the frame stamping or engine stamping. So you have 3 potential cars from one serial number.

Many states allow titling a car with no title through bill of sale and surety bond.

No proof, but I'd bet it has been done.

[John H.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

The frame-stamper was made by the George T. Schmidt Co. (Chicago), which is still in business; it used an egg-shaped imprinting head, which was "sliced" into indexing rotating segments with numbers/letters on them. It was mounted on an overhead balancer, and its "rolling" motion was powered by an air cylinder. It had an anvil on the bottom, which was hooked on the bottom of the frame rail, and the "egg" was clamped against the top of the frame rail with an air-clamp; when the operator hit the valve, another cylinder "rolled" the "egg" longitudinally on the frame rail, and released the clamp. The operator then relocated the tool and actuated it again, which rolled the "egg" back in the opposite direction, stamping the number a second time and "parking" the egg in its original starting position. The operator then pushed a lever on the "egg", which indexed the last segment to the next number and it was ready to stamp the next frame. This same device was used in all Chevrolet assembly plants to stamp frames and the hidden VIN derivatives on steel bodies. It always stamped the same number twice in each cycle (once one way, and again the other way).

[Larry S.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

This 2 cars using the same vin is a fear of mine.

I have been in the market for a 61 or a 62 to do a tube frame convertion on (as was discussed in a previous post this week)and I have found an absolute perfect candidate for the project car 4 state south of me and the present owner only wants to sell the body and all other componets and keep the drive train and frame he has 2 other project vettes one needs a frame and the other a motor and trans He actually purchase the car I want for the reason stated above)So this is a perfect car for my project because I am planning on a tube frame and a big block motor and auto trans.So none of the components he wants are needed for my project.He will not sell me the entire car.

The problem we are having is that I want to torch or grind destroy the vin number on the frame (I am not concerned with the motor in antway) because I am afraid that this fellow will never complete his projects and some one 10 year or so from now will be purchasing these other vettes and a frame with a number matching motor from his estate and build a numbers matching vette from the frame and motor.

And I am afraid that allthough I will have the pink slip or correct registration and the vin tag from the steering coloum some one someday will have this frame with a vin on it and a motor with the correct vin on it and get a regestation for it and we will have 2 cars with the same vin.in 2 different states I have gone over my estimated budjet for the car and when I am complete I belive I will have a vette that will be more exspensive then my 66-427/425 car So I am afraid to take chances.And allthought he will give me a noterized letter describing the sale Or stating anything I want it to state as long as its the truth I dont want to have to defend my self or my car some twenty`years from now if the 2 vins catch up with each other.

I know cars move around the country often my 66 is from texas.The new owner of a Mustang I restored in 1995 who now has the car in california just contacted me thru my name being on the recipts that I had but in a binder along with all of the restoration photos and gave to the fellow who purchased the car from me to gather some information on his new car.(I was the secound owner and actually put him in touch with the first owner of the car)So theoredictly if a secound car was built from the frame and motor they could end up being in the same stae some time in there lifes

I know this fellow is a straight up hobby guy and when he assures me he would not sell it as such I know he is being truthfull but I am afraid of what the next guy will do with it because he has had these cars at least 20 to 30 years and I feel if he hasnt started these projects he never will(I am sure you have met other people like this that are just waiting to start a project and the cars are rotting away because of funds or motivation)Any ways He will not allow me to destroy the vin on the frame because he is afraid some one will think its stolen.

And I am also afraid because I plan on installing a new flaming river steering coloum and then re-attching the vin plate to it.So allthought I will have the paper on the car,the frame and motor actually have more markings then the tag off the collum that I would have.So this is the perfect car but I am afraid to purchase it.I dont want to discuss price but what the fellow is offering the body and all of its componets except for the frame/Suspention/Motor/Trans/Rear to me Is about 19,000.00 or so less then what my budject was to aquire a donor car for the project I have seen front clips go for about what I can aquire the body for but I feel its not worth the gamble latter on when the car is completed. Now there is a slight chance that the frame is rusted and the vin is unreadable but he cant see it and he is a 11 hour drive or a flight to determine if I can read it if it can even bee seen with the body still attached to the frame.I have had another freind from anothe corvette forum offer to inspect the car to see if he can read the vin but the seller does not want stanger at his home.All thought I have never met the seller I found the car thru a mutual buesness associate and he is comfortable with me coming out.Part of our deal is that I will seperated the body from the car at his garage.

So allthough one of my other hobbies is gambeling this is not something I want to take a gamble on.

I just thought I would share this with you guys and gasl to get some options

Thanks Larry

[Larry S.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

John I now under stand how this was done but now I am wondering why it was done

[Roy B.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice SWEET

I have talked about this problem for years having few people ever showing a concerned about this? Daaa. You know ! that all states are going to a central data base. In the future I see two people in court fighting over ownership of the same Corvette. I have over the years sold frames to one person, then sold a Ca. pink and ID plate to others that were building a parts car original needing a ID plate so as to register it. A frame having the numbers can be worked out and restamped, but using the ID plate only ??? Then years ago some one was reproing the ID plates for C1's.
Even to day C2 trim and other plates and papers are being repro'ed. ( ISN"T IT GREAT ). Did You know owners are worried about G.M coming out with info telling what was what ( Original and options) on the Corvettes. ( pretty made up Corvettes) . But haven't thought about owner ship papers. (ISN"T LIFE SWEET).

[John H.]

Re: My '62 was stamped twice

Bringing this back to the top - the frame was stamped (and the body, in two places, on conventional steel-bodied cars) due to Federal requirements for ID'ing stolen cars. Every year we had to supply confidential drawings to the FBI showing the location of "hidden" VIN derivatives so they'd know where to look for them on each type of car. Each year (sometimes twice a year) the FBI makes unannounced visits to each assembly plant to inspect and audit the security controls in effect for the process of creating and installing VIN plates and they also inspect/audit the actual stamping process on the line for the confidential VIN derivatives to make sure it's being done in accordance with the drawings supplied to them by the manufacturer.