Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Has anyone had any luck or experience using speed bleeders (with check valve) along with Motive pressure bleeder tool, DOT 5 fluid? If so, please relate any techniques or if this is a bad idea. I understand that lower pressures such as ~5 psi are recommended when employing DOT 5 and the Motive pressure bleeder -- not sure what psi it takes to open the Speed Bleeder check valve. Thanks. Jeff
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Hey Jeff, I have been having a heck of a time getting the air out of my braking system, too. I tried doing everything the old fashioned way- using the pedal (that is my wife was working the pedal). I installed all new lines, hoses, MC, calipers, safety switch and DOT 5 silicone fluid. Thought I had it, then 3-4 weeks later after sitting there, the pedal went to the floor. The 2nd time around, I purchased a vacuum bleeder. I think this was worse than before as I could not get the system to build up any pressure. I can find no evidence of leaks anywhere in the system. So, last week at the recommendation of those on the Forum, I ordered a Motive Pressure Bleeder. It will be in later this week. I am trying to make an adapter to fit on top of the MC. I have the steel cut to shape, but will have to drill and tap for a fitting when it arrives and I can find out the correct size fitting to install for the pressure line. I still plan on using the original bleeders, though, so I can't help you on that. Have you got an adapter yet? If so, what size fitting did you use for the pressure line? -
Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Jeff, I rebuilt my entire brake system on my 1962, ie wheel cylinders, all lines, master cylinder etc around 14 months ago. I had a issue with getting all the air out of my system until I used the speed bleeders. They worked real well for me. However, watch your reselvoir and do not let it run too low, the c1"s have a very small master cylinder. When I new all the air was finally out of the lines/system I replaced the speed bleeders with the original style bleeders and rebled the system again. I do know that speed bleeders can remain in place and serve as a normal bleeder but I decide not to do this. My brake system works fantastic now. I hope this helps.Comment
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Al -- I have had the Motive for awhile & it has the standard #0105 'early American' adaptor configuration. This adaptor is for the '67 & later m/cyl with the bail & cover, but it will fit over the two bosses on the '65-'66 p/b m/cyl casting. I use a C-clamp over each chamber & it seals well. When bleeding with speed bleeders during last session, I ran 15 psi or so pressure & am not real pleased with the pedal. Next attempt will cut it back to 5 psi to see if perhaps the 15 was creating turbulence/bubbles. My question was with regard to the pressure needed to open & unseat the speed bleeder check valve. Sent an email to their tech support today, but no reply so far. The Motive loses pressure during the bleeding operations & if starting out with only 5 I wondering if the check valve is closing before all air is expelled.Comment
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Thanks Jeff, be sure to post what the rep says to help me and others out also. I too, wondered if the higher pressures would create bubbles in the fluid and that was 1 consideration for staying with the original bleeders, if possible. Maybe someone else will reply shortly that has done this with the 66-67.Comment
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Not that it will answer your questions directly but I use just the motive bleeder, DOT3, lip seals in the calipers and 001-002 rotor & bearing runout - works great.Comment
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
Jeff, I was reading over on the CF to a question I posed on my brake issues, and was told by 1 person to use 5 PSI to prevent possible bubbles in the fluid. I'm assuming you would really have to keep constant check on this.Comment
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Re: Speed bleeders + Motive pressure bleeder + DOT 5
I replaced my entire brake system and changed it from standard disk to power brakes this Spring. I had no luck using my Motive power bleeder with DOT 5 brake fluid, even at 5 PSI. I kept seeing tiny bubbles in the brake fluid flow every time I opened the bleeders, which is attributable to the Motive power bleeder aerating the DOT 5. The comments I got from my post earlier this Spring, is my experience was normal. No one reported they had been successful using a Motive Power bleeder with DOT5. See the thread here: https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...-5-Brake-Fluid
I ended up using gravity bleeding and two man method to get the air out. As an aside (and it's a long story) I am in the process of converting back to DOT 4 brake fluid. I had purchased new calipers, lines, master cylinder and booster from CSSB and I could not get the right front caliper to stop seeping brake fluid at the brake hose connection. CSSB replaced the right front caliper once, and when I called them this week to report the seeping continued, and the master cylinder was now leaking fluid down the back, they said return everything and we'll give you your money back. Not exactly an optimal solution for me. I'm not being hyper critical of CSSB but I'm beginning to wonder whether the new calipers, master cylinder castings/gaskets are up to the DOT 5 any more.
I cannot explain why I could never get the right front caliper to quit seeping fluid--I can tell you the left front was dry as a bone, and the hose was not inordinately tight on the left--as I knew the recommended torque is only 80-115 inch pounds. Initially CSSB instructed me to put the brake hose on as tight as I could get it when I called the first time to report seeping (literally told me to tighten the SH** out of it with the largest crescent wrench you can get on it) which I did and it did not solve the seeping issue. They swear up and down their castings are good and they don't see this problem. All I know is through 2 calipers on the right, they both kept on seeping fluid at the hose fitting. And CSSB wouldn't even discuss solutions for why the master cylinder now is leaking fluid down the back (even when the brake fluid level was down to 1/2" from the top edge at its highest point), which I'm guessing is a problem with the cap gasket material not working well with DOT 5 because it took a couple of months for that symptom to arise.
So I figured I've had enough fun with DOT 5 brake fluid to last the rest of my life, and am going back to DOT 4 as part of tearing off all CSSB's stuff and starting over--the amount of time the DOT 5 fluid has cost me doing manual bleeding with a partner, removing and replacing the right front caliper, and bleeding all over again, is more total time then I would spend bleeding DOT 4 with the Motive power bleeder for the next 15 + years (figuring flushing the fluid every 3 years).
On speed bleeders those are more handy when doing periodic bleeding after the system has been purged of all air--to me the problem is that without eyes on the tubing attached to the bleeder, how do you know you've gotten all the air out? And it helps when bleeding to pound on the calipers with a rubber mallet to force the air out. If you're using DOT 3 or 4 the Motive power bleeder is great--I've been using one for years on my Porsches, and the 1105 adapter works well on the 67 (provided you clamp it down with a C clamp). If your heart is set on DOT 5, don't bother with the Motive power bleeder. Resign yourself to doing gravity bleeding and the two man method unless you want to buy a bladder tank brake bleeder which cost more than $300. I actually considered just that, until common sense took over.Comment
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