B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

[Michael F.]

After much searching on the intertubes, I found another source for the elusive B28 Vacuum Advance Canister. I'm posting this mainly for documentation purposes in case someone needs one of these. I found it as an Airtex 4V1053 and it can be found everywhere on the web. Just Google Airtex 4V1053 Here's a couple links. http://www.amazon.com/Airtex-Distrib.../dp/B000C1ES7I http://www.rockauto.com/dbphp/x,cata...EX_4V1053.html Alternate Part Numbers: NAPA/Echlin VC-1810 Niehoff DR-305 Borg-Warner V329 BWD V329 Standard Motor Products VC-177 Standard Motor Products Hygrade VC177 AC/Delco part number D1312C GM part number is 88924985 Wells DV1810 Specs: B28 High Perf. 3-5 8 @ 5.75-8 I was skeptical when I ordered it that it would not be a real B28, but when it arrive it is indeed a B28 with the correct stamp. It even tests out pretty close to spec. I also purchased a BWD B26 and the two look identical, so I would guess they are both made by Standard Motor Products.

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Good bit of research! Now everyone can order a handful of the Airtex number and run those out of stock.

All the B-number VACs are conmanufactured by Standard Motor Products regardless of the brand, and this has been the case for about 20 years. I think you covered all the brands, but, who knows, maybe there are other brands (Wells?) out there that sell these SMP-manufactured B-number VACs under their own part numbers.

If you have a B28, B20/B26, and a B22, you have a complete set of appropriate VACs for all OE vintage engines with single-point or TI ignition - both pre emission and post emission converted to full time vacuum advance. One of those three has the "best fit" technical specs (best match to the Two-Inch Rule), but in some cases (like '63 L-76, '65 L-78 and most OE ported advance configurations converted to full time) the best fit B-number has different specs than the original VAC.

This simple ten dollar part is critical to achieving best engine performance - idle stability, detonation resistance - and fuel economy. If the specs don't match the engine's manifold vacuum characteristics, all of the above may be compromised. If you apply the Two-Inch Rule to the engine's manifold vacuum at typical idle speed (in neutral for manual transmissions and Drive for automatics) for full time advance (either OE or converted from OE ported advance) and choose the least aggressive of the three that meets the rule, you have the best fit VAC.

Ideally we should have four VACs - 8", 10", 12", and 16", but we have to make-do with an 8" (B28), 12" (B20 or B26) and 15" (B28). The only engines that absolutely need an 8" are the 365/375 HP small blocks because the 30-30 cam only pulls about 10" @ 900. Other SB mechanical lifter cams pull about 12" so a 10" would do, but is not available so the B28 is the only one that meets the Two-Inch Rule. L-82/autos also need the B28 to meet the Two-Inch rule.

Base cam small blocks with manuals need a 15" (B22) and 12" (B20/B26) for autos. The B20/B26 is also the best fit for all big blocks with manuals. I'm not sure about autos because I've never seen any reliable idle vacuum data for these configurations.

The 12" (B20/B26)is also the best fit for L-79, L-46, and L-82/manual.

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Second from last paragraph 15" (B28) should be 15" (B22).

Duke

[Carmen R.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Hi Michael:

Thanks for sharing this source with every one. I may have come a cross another source by accident. I checked out Rock auto's website and they had this unit listed for $5.50 plus $26.17 shipping to Canada. I'm not sure if this even includes brokerage fees, duties or whatever. Any way, I contacted Airtex Vehicle Electronics (Airtex Wells) and inquired if they had any Canadian distributors (no pun intended). Apparently Car quest carries their line of products.

I called my friendly local Carquest store and at first 4V1053 didn't mean anything to the kid behind the parts counter. After a bit of searching this number cross referenced to Carquest # ECC 57-7537. Just to be on the safe side I gave him the list of alternate part numbers in your post and it cross referenced with SMP VC-177. They sell for $12.94 list price and $8.79 net price. I'm sure U.S prices will be slightly lower. You just can't be in a hurry. Of course they weren't stocked and I had to wait a week to get them. Of course the day after I installed it, I got the correct 201 MS 15 from Don Baker. I'm going to hold on to it in case I decide to get my car judged. The unit looks exactly like yours. It's stamped "B28" and has a small vent hole on the bottom. I tested it with a Mighty Vac and was pleasantly surprised at it's accuracy. It started to advance @4" Hg and maxed out @8" Hg.

I'll try to post a few 022.jpg023.jpg024.jpgpictures, if I can figure it out.

[Ed S.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

I am resurrecting this old thread in search of some feedback from Michael Fitzpatrick and Duke Williams on the performance of the B28 VA can found and discussed in this thread.

I have a '64 L76 and discovered that the VA can on my distributor is a B 10! Have spent the last 3 hours searching Forum treads for this one and another one that is very similar.

I checked Rock Auto.com website, they still carry the B28 under their part # 4V1053, about $5.00! Michael, I assume that you installed this VA on your car, may I ask how has it worked for you?


I pose the same question to others that commented on this VA can in the following thread.
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...ht=1964+vacuum

Subject to your feedback, I think I will buy several and hold on to them for future use as needed.

Duke - I know you have said a lot about VA cans and especially the B28 for the 365HP SB. If you have any new or updated thoughts on the subject please share with us now.

Thanks to all. (I feel like I have found the holy grail...... of Vacuum Advance cans!)

[Justin S.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Duke,
Would the B26 VAC work on a 70 LS5 with HEI?

[Mark E.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

The B20/B26 is also the best fit for all big blocks with manuals. I'm not sure about autos because I've never seen any reliable idle vacuum data for these configurations.

Big blocks with oval port heads, hydraulic cams (e.g. L36, LS4, LS5) usually pull well over 17" at idle, even with an automatic. Should they use B28?

I suspect the vacuum for large port/ mechanical cam engines is much less.

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

I am resurrecting this old thread in search of some feedback from Michael Fitzpatrick and Duke Williams on the performance of the B28 VA can found and discussed in this thread.

I have a '64 L76 and discovered that the VA can on my distributor is a B 10! Have spent the last 3 hours searching Forum treads for this one and another one that is very similar.

I checked Rock Auto.com website, they still carry the B28 under their part # 4V1053, about $5.00! Michael, I assume that you installed this VA on your car, may I ask how has it worked for you?


I pose the same question to others that commented on this VA can in the following thread.
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...ht=1964+vacuum

Subject to your feedback, I think I will buy several and hold on to them for future use as needed.

Duke - I know you have said a lot about VA cans and especially the B28 for the 365HP SB. If you have any new or updated thoughts on the subject please share with us now.

Thanks to all. (I feel like I have found the holy grail...... of Vacuum Advance cans!)

I believe the B10 (long out of production) is equivalent to GM 1115360 (0 @ 7", 12 @ 12"), and when available the NAPA/Echlin number was VC-1765SB. The only Corvette application I know to for this VAC is '66 L-72, but since it's out of production I recommend the B22 for L-72, which provides four more degrees at 12", but AFAIK it works fine for L-72 and it is the best fit for both the OE ported vacuum advance or if converted to full time. It does not meet the Two-Inch Rule for any small block mechanical lifter cam engines, so the B28 is required which is equivalent to the 236 16 that was OE on 30-30 cam engines.. It should also be used on Duntov cam engines.

All Gen I LT-1s were emission controlled engines so they have ported vacuum advance, but a B28 should be installed if converted to full time vacuum advance.

I always recommend that you take a Mighty Vac to the parts store when you pick up any new VAC and check that the start and stop points are within 1" Hg of the nominal spec.

It seems that the only available "brand" for the B28 is the Airtex 4V1053, but as with most VACs it is manufactured by Standard Motor Products.

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Duke,
Would the B26 VAC work on a 70 LS5 with HEI?

HEI VACs have a different physical design than single point/TI VACs so they are not interchangeable.

One of the problems with HEI VACs is that they are all setup for emission control, so finding one that is suitable for a non emission controlled engine can be a challenge. They usually have too much advance because they are designed for the accompanying short and very lazy centrifugal curves.

It also depends on whether you still have the OE ported vacuum advance or have converted to full time. A LS5 should pull about the same vacuum at any given idle speed as a L-36.

Bottom line is that you haven't given me enough information to make a recommendation.

Duke

[Joe L.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

I believe the B10 (long out of production) is equivalent to GM 1115360 (0 @ 7", 12 @ 12"), and when available the NAPA/Echlin number was VC-1765VC. The only Corvette application I know to for this VAC is '66 L-72, but since it's out of production I recommend the B22 for L-72, which provides four more degree at 12", but AFAIK it works fine for L-72 and it is the best fit for both the OE ported vacuum advance or if converted to full time. It does not meet the Two-Inch Rule for any small block mechanical lifter cam engines, so the B28 is required which is equivalent to the 236 15 that was OE on 30-30 cam engilnes.. It should also be used on Duntov cam engines.

All Gen I LT-1s were emission controlled engines so they have ported vacuum advance, but a B28 should be installed if converted to full time vacuum advance.

I always recommend that you take a Mighty Vac to the parts store when you pick up any new VAC and check that the start and stop points are within 1" Hg of the nominal spec.

It seems that the only available "brand" for the B28 is the Airtex 4V1053, but as with most VACs it is manufactured by Standard Motor Products.

Duke

Duke-------


It's very possible that while SMP has discontinued sale of the B28 under their part number and most of the other brands have done so, too, that SMP continues to manufacture them for Airtex. The absolute only reason that SMP and most of the others would discontinue the B28 is poor sales. That's very understandable considering the vast majority of the applications for this part are in junkyards or melted down as scrap by now. Perhaps Airtex figures, as the sole source, they're willing to continue offering the part. I'm quite sure that SMP would manufacture them for any brand as long as that brand was willing to place a minimum order.

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Big blocks with oval port heads, hydraulic cams (e.g. L36, LS4, LS5) usually pull well over 17" at idle, even with an automatic. Should they use B28?

I suspect the vacuum for large port/ mechanical cam engines is much less.

Stating manifold vacuum without specifying the exact idle speed it was measured at is meaningless because manifold vacuum is highly dependent on actual idle speed... the higher the idle speed, the higher the manifold vacuum.

Most reports I have for hydraulic lifter big blocks (non-emission controlled) used in Corvettes is about 14-15" @ 600 for a manual idling in neutral. I have no reports for automatics idling in Drive.

Google my name, San Diego, and Corvette and download my 2012 national convention presentation. It explains the Two-Inch Rule and gives starting point guidance for an optimum spark advance map and explains how to determine what you have by measurements and comparison with OE specs.

If you have an emission controlled engine be sure to read and understand the chart on emission controlled engines.

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Duke-------


It's very possible that while SMP has discontinued sale of the B28 under their part number and most of the other brands have done so, too, that SMP continues to manufacture them for Airtex. The absolute only reason that SMP and most of the others would discontinue the B28 is poor sales. That's very understandable considering the vast majority of the applications for this part are in junkyards or melted down as scrap by now. Perhaps Airtex figures, as the sole source, they're willing to continue offering the part. I'm quite sure that SMP would manufacture them for any brand as long as that brand was willing to place a minimum order.

Lets hope that's the case, Joe. The only OE replacement applications I know of for the B28 are the '64-'65 365/375 HP engines, and less than 14,000 were installed at St. Louis.

But there are also a lot of "custom applications" for the B28 like any SB emission controlled mechanical lifter engine (LT-1) that is converted to full time vacuum advance and any aftermarket cam in any engine that generates less than about 13" vacuum at the selected idle speed in neutral with a manual trans and Drive with an automatic. It should also be used on the '63 340 HP engine and '63 FI engine if it's converted to full time vacuum advance (that I highly recommend).

Given the low price of the Airtex 4V1053 (B28), if one is in need, buy two. Then you have a spare and the shelf life should be at least several decades.

Buying a spare increases current demand and may help keep this part around in the longer run.

Duke

[Justin S.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Thanks Duke. Just trying to plan ahead. My engine still needs reassembled.

[Mark E.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

Stating manifold vacuum without specifying the exact idle speed it was measured at is meaningless because manifold vacuum is highly dependent on actual idle speed... the higher the idle speed, the higher the manifold vacuum.

Most reports I have for hydraulic lifter big blocks (non-emission controlled) used in Corvettes is about 14-15" @ 600 for a manual idling in neutral. I have no reports for automatics idling in Drive.
Duke

Thanks Duke. I'm assuming idle speed is set to specs (and the rest of the engine is stock and in good tune).

The idle speed spec for a '70 LS5 is 700 RPM with manual, 600 RPM with auto. I've owned two of these with a 4 speed in my lifetime, and each pulled 17" or more at idle. (Disclaimer- this was with static timing set more advanced than spec to match a recurved advance, and TCS bypassed with the VAC connected to manifold (not ported) vacuum.)

However, I usually set idle at 780-800 RPM to compensate for the RPM drop when AC is on. At 800 RPM, I get 18-19" of vacuum when everything is tuned properly.

So given this information, is B28 the better choice?

I understand idle vacuum is probably less with an automatic in drive because of the lower idle speed and load from the converter.

[Duke W.]

Re: B28 Vacuum Adv. Canister Source

All other things equal, the higher the idle speed, the higher the manifold vacuum. Also, increasing total idle advance to get it into the optimum range of low twenties to low thirties will increase idle vacuum at any given idle speed, so converting a ported vacuum advance to full time will increase idle vacuum at the same idle speed compared to ported vacuum advance.

Also, all other things equal, a longer stroke engine will pull more idle vacuum at a given idle speed than the shorter stroke engine. The LS5 is basicallly a longer stroke L-36, so all other things equal (including total idle advance), it should pull more vacuum at any idle speed than L-36.

The greater the valve overlap the higher the total idle spark advance needs to be to get it into the optimum range. For the hydraulic lifter camshafts used on big block Corvette engines, mid-twenties is in the correct range.

The "worst case" would be an automatic idling in Drive with the AC compressor engaged. Then you take that worst case (lowest manifold vacuum) and apply the Two-Inch Rule to select the least aggressive VAC that passes the rule.

Based on your worst case data for a manual transmission configuration, 17" @ 700 in neutral with the AC compressor engaged that would be the 15" B22.

Duke