Penetrating oils

[Michael J.]

This was forwarded to our Corvette club from the state classic car council, very interesting results:

Penetrating Oils

[Ed N.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Interesting post. Thanks for the information.

[Bruce B.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Thanks,
Great info for us guys taking apart old cars.

[Mike E.]

[Domenic T.]

Re: Penetrating oils

I would like to add other test results about ATF.

I have a LARGE collection of model airplane, boat, and car engines. We restore, clean lube, and display them.

We found tha all penetrating oils, marvel mystery oil, 3&1, and every other one would eventually gum up and the miniture engines would not turn over
after about 6 Months.

We tested all these oils on a tin plate and decided to put ATF on the plate also.

All turned to gum after a year in the Palm Springs sun, but the ATF was still red, thin, and looked the same.

I especially use it on piston rings when we rebuild engines as it will not loose it's lubricating quality if the engine is stored for long periods of time.
I also use it as a penetrating oil mixed with diesel fuel. I'll try it with acetone next batch.

DOM

[John D.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Personally I absolutely love Aero Kroil in my fuel injection restorations. It has made life a lot easier in that so far not one fitting or bolt has broken off since I discovered Aero Kroil about 5 years ago. That's the problem. Didn't use it until about 5 years ago.
One step above Aero Kroil is the Sili-Kroil. Top notch.
As far as price goes if you have a business Aero Kroil has/had a promotion of 2 for 1. JD

[Joe L.]

Re: Penetrating oils

This was forwarded to our Corvette club from the state classic car council, very interesting results:

Penetrating Oils

Machinist’s Workshop Mag™ recently published some information on various penetrating oils that I found very interesting. Some of you might appreciate this. The magazine reports they tested penetrates for break out torque on rusted nuts.

They are below, as forwarded by an ex-student and professional machinist. They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrates with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a “scientifically rusted” environment.

*Penetrating oil .......... Average load*
None ........................... 516 pounds
WD-40 ..................... ... 238 pounds
PB Blaster .................... 214 pounds
Liquid Wrench ............... 127 pounds
Kano Kroil .................... 106 pounds
ATF*-Acetone mix...............53 pounds

The ATF-Acetone mix was a “home brew” mix of 50 - 50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone. Note the “home brew” was better than any commercial product in this one particular test.

Our local machinist group mixed up a batch and we all now use it with equally good results.

Note also that “Liquid Wrench” is almost as good as “Kroil” for about 20% of the price.

Steve from Godwin-Singer says that ATF-Acetone mix is the best and you can also use ATF- lacquer thinner 50 - 50 mix.

Michael------


One thing to keep in mind: Acetone is a HIGHLY VOLATILE and FLAMMABLE solvent. The vapors are TOXIC. So, if one uses this "elixer" one needs to use extreme care and use it in a well ventilated environment.

[Michael J.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Yes, I'm aware of that, just look on the warning label for any thinner, they are the same.

[Paul J.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Michael------


One thing to keep in mind: Acetone is a HIGHLY VOLATILE and FLAMMABLE solvent. The vapors are TOXIC. So, if one uses this "elixer" one needs to use extreme care and use it in a well ventilated environment.

I was waiting for this. The warnings are everywhere when this elixer is mentioned, but no one has any technical details about it. In fact, I have been waiting for someone to explain why it's so hazardous! These two compunds are not reactive with each other. Women used to use (and perhaps still do) acetone to remove nail polish. Acetone is an excellent solvent and many of us have it in our shops. ATF is a hydraulic fluid, and I've always thought of these as stable and neither corrosive nor reactive. The warnings are on the label. I have'nt spent any time with this but I will. Most of us have far greater chemical exposures in our own shop than this concoction, or even acetone alone. I think that this is an "old wives tale"!!!!!

Paul

P.S. Joe (or anyone) if you have some evidence that this mixture is worse than say, toluene or even Kroil, please let us know. Prove me wrong and let's put this to rest.

[Bruce B.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Paul,
I agree with you, our society is over the top with "dangerous" stuff.
Lets see:
mercury thermometers, how many have you had stuck in you or broken on the bathroom floor?
In lab we used mesh screens with asbestos pads on them to prevent hot spots on flasks, probably now outlawed.
old oil drained from engines, read the warning on the oil package, it will kill you if you get some on you and don't have a hazmat suit protecting you.
Gas or diesel fuel spilled on the highway in a crash, call the hazmat team and shut down the interstate for hours.
In the home;radon detectors, CO detectors, and so on.
How many times have you used gas to clean parts without using gloves? Have your hands fallen off?

OK I'm done...

[Michael J.]

Re: Penetrating oils

In grad school, I worked on hi-vacuum glass lines in our isotope prep system. Glass blowing, hi-vac mercury vapor pumps, benzene and acetone cleaner baths, hi-vac grease for valves full of toxic chemicals, and of course the asbestos wraps for the mercury vapor pump heating elements. It's a wonder I'm still alive in my '60s with no issues.

[Carnell M.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Heard/read this several times. Haven't tried it yet but all the results I've seen seem very promising

[Michael F.]

Re: Penetrating oils

all that from the "sky is falling" folks who want the govt to tell people how to live there lives and what they need because they think we are to stupid to make our own decisions.....common sense rules govt rules. my 2cents

[John D.]

Re: Penetrating oils

Some time we think we are above having an explosion or fire in our shops. Sometimes we get sloopy and take for grated that we are ammune to the health hazards of chemicals.
Well I for one learned the hard way over the years. One day I went to my MD brothers office and complained of the burning in my nose and throat. He said keep using whatever chemicals you are using in your restorations if you want cancer in a hurry.
Some of the spray can crap we take for granted is lethal you know. For example: Gumout Carb and Choke cleaner in a spray can is nothing to mess with indoors. Use it outdoors only.
Once a year my insurance company sends an agent around to check my shop out. He looks for any fire hazards. He checks to see what chemicals I am using. He checks my fire ext for tags.
Yes acetone is good stuff but not something you want to use on a regular basis.
Look for cleaners that are not a fire hazard gang. Go to Home Depot and look at all the Zep Products. Some of it is good stuff you know and not a hazard.
Don't put chemicals in your ultrasonic cleaner that could cause an explosion. Yes an explosion and of course a fire. How do I know this you ask.
Been there.
Don't use any chemicals near a gas water heater or open flame.
Story: In Sept 63 I practically burnt my parents house down and got burnt big time. I was rebuilding the FI unit on my old hot rod. At that time that were no laws against having a gas water heater in a garage. Well the fumes from the carb cleaner near the gas water heater caused an explosion that blew the garage door into the driveway. I suffered permanent hearing loss in my left ear from that one. And my Dad was not happy with me at all. Then on top of that the fire department went to the wrong address. Whew!!!!!
So be careful before it's too late. Don't be a hero. True story. Old JD

[Paul J.]

Re: Penetrating oils

I hear you JD. I think Michael said it best...it's just a little common sense. The chemicals that most of us have in our shops will not cause physical harm unless you misuse them, like drinking it. Prolonged exposure (defined as almost constant exposure to large amounts of the chemical) can potentially cause health issues, like breathing in solvent vapors every day for most of the day for a long time. I've seen the neuological damage from this over time and have even been involved in a court case about it. Explosive issues (and no one talked about environmental spill potential) are once again just common sense. Although I'm careful about how I store my chemicals, I'll admit that I don't have them in a fireproof cabinet and am in violation of the fire and safety code...ssssshhh. A cabinet would be nice but it's not necessary if you're careful.

I agree that we should'nt tempt the goverment to take these chemicals away from us because we can't be responsible with them.

Ever notice that most of the garage fires/mishaps occur with younger people? Maybe older people just don't do as much, or maybe they've learned.

Paul