White Rain Hairspray

[Dick W.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

[QUOTE=Tom Ames (9906);618096]I doubt there are many "quick fixes' I haven't seen over the years I've been judging. On the up side if the exterior is within reason what it should be, no one even looks at the jambs. The problem is when someone has done a "quick fix" then wants to argue with the judge over why they think it should pass. If it appears like original then there is no issue. If you try and it doesn't fly please don't waste the judges time arguing, they have a lot to get done in a limited time frame./QUOTE

AMEN! TOM

I have played the "game" for over 30 years. There are rules in the Judging Reference Manual that could be called the Dick Whittington rule. There are not many tricks that I have not pulled or seen. When your judge paints or restores for his/her vocation, there ain't much use in a arguin' with them. They's been that, done that, an' got the T shirt.

It's hard to s*** an ole s****er

[William F.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Ashamed so much attention and effort is paid to making paint look crappy to get it 'judged."Same can be said for bias tires, tar top batteriies and other items where comon sense should prevail over what looked EXACTly like back in the day at the expense of what keeps paints preserved and what works safely if you actually drive the car (as intended).Not talking about restorods,Boyd Coddington wheels, etc,. just practical things.We NCRS members need to address these issues if we are to keep people interested( over 100 posts in a previous thread on what we need to do to find new members-younger people interested in vintage Corvettes). Ya'll think about it.

[David H.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Ashamed so much attention and effort is paid to making paint look crappy to get it 'judged."Same can be said for bias tires, tar top batteriies and other items where comon sense should prevail over what looked EXACTly like back in the day at the expense of what keeps paints preserved and what works safely if you actually drive the car (as intended).Not talking about restorods,Boyd Coddington wheels, etc,. just practical things.We NCRS members need to address these issues if we are to keep people interested( over 100 posts in a previous thread on what we need to do to find new members-younger people interested in vintage Corvettes). Ya'll think about it.

Nothing wrong with a Second or Third Flight Award on a car that's been kept mostly original. You may have more fun with that car than if it was "Top Flight".

[Patrick H.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Ashamed so much attention and effort is paid to making paint look crappy to get it 'judged."Same can be said for bias tires, tar top batteriies and other items where comon sense should prevail over what looked EXACTly like back in the day at the expense of what keeps paints preserved and what works safely if you actually drive the car (as intended).

And that's why we award Driving Points for driving your car to a meet. You can often easily offset the points loss for tires, batteries and the like by driving your car to the meet.
Been there, done that.

Oh, and the car later went on to receive the Bowtie Award, so apparently it's been preserved quite well.

[Roy S.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Ashamed so much attention and effort is paid to making paint look crappy to get it 'judged."Same can be said for bias tires, tar top batteriies and other items where comon sense should prevail over what looked EXACTly like back in the day at the expense of what keeps paints preserved and what works safely if you actually drive the car (as intended).Not talking about restorods,Boyd Coddington wheels, etc,. just practical things.We NCRS members need to address these issues if we are to keep people interested( over 100 posts in a previous thread on what we need to do to find new members-younger people interested in vintage Corvettes). Ya'll think about it.

[James W.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

And that's why we award Driving Points for driving your car to a meet. You can often easily offset the points loss for tires, batteries and the like by driving your car to the meet.
Been there, done that.

Oh, and the car later went on to receive the Bowtie Award, so apparently it's been preserved quite well.

Patrick,

Great comments regarding the mileage points.

I recently drove my '64 convertible to the NCRS North Central Regional Meet, just a little over 800 miles round trip. The weather was beautiful and it was great to be out in the Corvette with the top down which is what these cars were meant for. My goal was to get an NCRS Regional Top Flight award without using the mileage points to fall back on. I accomplished my goal by a fairly wide margin even though my paint took a minimal deduct, I have an AC Delco service replacement battery, reproduction knock-off wheels, run non-OEM brand Michelin black wall radial tires for comfort/safety reasons, have an aluminized exhaust system, incorrect tinting band on the windshield, etc., the list could go on and on. As long as you do your homework by studying the TGJM and make sure your operations passes at 100% you should do just fine in flight judging. I wish there were more members that actually drove their cars to the regional and national level meets to have them judged. I spoiled myself by buying a new Z06 a few years back since it's easier to jump in that Corvette and drive several hundred miles and not think twice about doing it. I can tell you that I get a lot of satisfaction out of knowing that my C2's are road worthy enough to go the distance and still be able to judge well enough to earn a top flight. My plans are to take my '64 to the 2014 National Convention in Overland Park, KS and achieve a national level Top Flight. I am looking forward to doing so and plan to bring my 8 year old son along who is staring to get interested in the Corvette hobby just as I did with my father 40 years ago. This is part of keep the Corvette/NCRS passion going.


Regards,

James West
Omaha, NE.

[Douglas C.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

This paint discussion raises a question I have always had. I am 62 and worked in a Chevy dealer body shop in the late 60's early 70's. I'm sure you all know factory lacquer was not durable like today's paints, but is was fairly soft, meaning an owner back in the day who loved to polish his car many times did the following:


1. Hand rub with DuPont No. 7, and that gave you a real nice gloss and smoothed out some of the peel.

2. Follow that with the two step Blue Coral, a polish then a wax. And, man, this was hard work.

Well, after a few years of this and if garage kept I can say those GM cars had a very nice finish.

So, does the NCRS take into account, say a really nice driver car, that in the real world can have a very nice finish, and maybe the owner even hand polished the door jambs. Because I do remember some customer cars that were a few years old were just terrific looking.

Thanks, we now return control of your TV set back to you.

Doug

[Roy S.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

A paint job that is determined to appear as factory applied material but be over restored is a 9 point deduction, never heard a single sole complain about losing 9 points because his paint was to nice.

[Terry M.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

I always wonder when the lack of durability of the original lacquer is addressed. I regularly see Corvettes that are 40 and 50 years old with their original finish. I guess those cars missed the lack of durability application at St Louis. I know there are many more Corvettes that have been repainted or restored than those still wearing their factory applied paint, but I suspect (especially when I visit my garage) the lack of durability of the original lacquer is overblown.

[William F.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Roy,
Nothing personal here either. But, how can you say someone is cheating if he uses White Rain or whatever to make areas of paint achieve desired crappy look, so he can remove product and have an awsome paint appearance back when judging is finished when NCRS now tiptoes around whether engine, the heart of a Corvette is original or just "appears" to be, but at same time places restampers in category with chil molesters when subject is broached in these threads?(My cars have original to car engines, by the way;so I'm not "protesting too much") Not going to mention it again, but I think requiring paint to look like it was applied on a Mon. by a hung over GM employee is costing us some participation in NCRS, especially in the future.

[Patrick H.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

Not going to mention it again, but I think requiring paint to look like it was applied on a Mon. by a hung over GM employee is costing us some participation in NCRS, especially in the future.

Other than requiring the car be a Chevrolet Corvette there are very few requirements for a car entering Flight judging. And, having recently read the rule book for a presentation I gave to our Chapter I'm quite sure that there is no requirement regarding paint in the manner you describe. There is a standard which has been present in many ways since about 1981 (if not 1974) but no requirement.

Note that the original poster did receive a Top Flight with his car despite his overly perfect paint. Others have even received Duntov Awards with overly perfect paint.
No requirement is present.

[Michael J.]

Re: White Rain Hairspray

A paint job that is determined to appear as factory applied material but be over restored is a 9 point deduction, never heard a single sole complain about losing 9 points because his paint was to nice.

Agreed, no one is worried about 9 points, the original poster was worried about 85 points, and how to mitigate that for a super-nice, deep paint job. My extremely nice glossy lacquer paint job lost 22 points the first time through as being over-restored and having improper build-ups on edges, valley, door jam drip edge gloss, etc. The second time through after some, er adjustments, it was only 9 points. I'm not complaining about that