Q-jet starting issues - NCRS Discussion Boards

Q-jet starting issues

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  • Terry M.
    Beyond Control Poster
    • September 30, 1980
    • 15569

    #16
    Re: Q-jet starting issues

    Originally posted by Russ Steinhaus (5540)
    Terry, If I interpret you correctly you are saying that it isn't a ops failure if the engine quits and has to be re-started?
    It depends on why the engine quits. If it quits because the throttle is "blipped" when the engine was just started that is not a failure in my mind. It is improper operation, but we should be testing the car -- not the owner. On most carbureted cars one can force the fast idle cam to come off shortly after engine start if one "blipps" the throttle. There is no need in my mind to prove that function.

    On the other hand if the engine dies of its own accord -- perhaps because of improper adjustment or no fast idle function -- that is a failure.

    Every engine has its own quirks. When I did PVs I told the owners to pump the gas as often as they usually did to start the car. That is the instructions that should be given during operations checks as well. I know of no place in Chevrolet documentation that says one needs pump the gas only once or any other specific number of times. My challenge to someone who takes that position is to prove it with Chevrolet documentation. I would begin to question the function of the fuel delivery system if it took more than say four or five pumps to get the engine stared regardless the brand of carburetor it was equipped with. At some point one has to wonder if everything is functioning properly if excessive throttle manipulation is necessary.

    While I wish everyone else would take that position, I know better than to expect everyone in the world (even our small world) to agree with me. These kinds of decisions ought to be made by the National Team Leader. Those people can't be everywhere, and there are many meets that will take place without the NTL present and someone has to give instructions for Operations checks at each of them. There is an Operations section in the TIM&JG -- or at least there is in the recently revised ones. It should be consulted because that wording should have been approved by the NTL for that division.

    Sorry for so many words for what seems like a short and simple question, but you did ask.
    Terry

    Comment

    • Russ S.
      Extremely Frequent Poster
      • April 30, 1982
      • 2160

      #17
      Re: Q-jet starting issues

      Originally posted by Terry McManmon (3966)
      It depends on why the engine quits. If it quits because the throttle is "blipped" when the engine was just started that is not a failure in my mind. It is improper operation, but we should be testing the car -- not the owner. On most carbureted cars one can force the fast idle cam to come off shortly after engine start if one "blipps" the throttle. There is no need in my mind to prove that function.

      On the other hand if the engine dies of its own accord -- perhaps because of improper adjustment or no fast idle function -- that is a failure.

      Every engine has its own quirks. When I did PVs I told the owners to pump the gas as often as they usually did to start the car. That is the instructions that should be given during operations checks as well. I know of no place in Chevrolet documentation that says one needs pump the gas only once or any other specific number of times. My challenge to someone who takes that position is to prove it with Chevrolet documentation. I would begin to question the function of the fuel delivery system if it took more than say four or five pumps to get the engine stared regardless the brand of carburetor it was equipped with. At some point one has to wonder if everything is functioning properly if excessive throttle manipulation is necessary.

      While I wish everyone else would take that position, I know better than to expect everyone in the world (even our small world) to agree with me. These kinds of decisions ought to be made by the National Team Leader. Those people can't be everywhere, and there are many meets that will take place without the NTL present and someone has to give instructions for Operations checks at each of them. There is an Operations section in the TIM&JG -- or at least there is in the recently revised ones. It should be consulted because that wording should have been approved by the NTL for that division.

      Sorry for so many words for what seems like a short and simple question, but you did ask.
      I think I understand what you are saying. If an engine needs more than one pump to get it to start, that is ok but then after those 1,2,3,or so pumps (without cranking it over in between those pumps) if it then is started and stops on its own accord it then is a failure. Does that sound right? Thanks

      Comment

      • Don L.
        Extremely Frequent Poster
        • August 31, 2005
        • 1004

        #18
        Re: Q-jet starting issues

        FWIW, both the ops section in at least the 4th edition '70-'72 TIM&JG and PV Test Guide states "The owner may depress the throttle as many times as necessary to start the engine, then crank the starter and start the engine".
        Don Lowe
        NCRS #44382
        Carolinas Chapter

        Comment

        • Terry M.
          Beyond Control Poster
          • September 30, 1980
          • 15569

          #19
          Re: Q-jet starting issues

          Originally posted by Russ Steinhaus (5540)
          I think I understand what you are saying. If an engine needs more than one pump to get it to start, that is ok but then after those 1,2,3,or so pumps (without cranking it over in between those pumps) if it then is started and stops on its own accord it then is a failure. Does that sound right? Thanks
          If you need to simplify it that much -- fine Russ. I will buy into your parameters. I look at it as less black & white than that, but yes one needs at least one pump to set the choke and another 2 or 3 is OK by me. Crank and start, but immediately stop is a fail in my book. I would support an operations check along those lines. After that much prompting the engine should go up on the high-idle unless the ambient temperature is above 80* F. At most summer temperatures there is a whole other set of issues on the table. Of course, that is when we usually hold meets.
          Terry

          Comment

          • Terry M.
            Beyond Control Poster
            • September 30, 1980
            • 15569

            #20
            Re: Q-jet starting issues

            Originally posted by Don Lowe (44382)
            FWIW, both the ops section in at least the 4th edition '70-'72 TIM&JG and PV Test Guide states "The owner may depress the throttle as many times as necessary to start the engine, then crank the starter and start the engine".
            I guess there still are some reminents of my term as NTL.

            I think I know how Stan would look at thsi issue as well.
            Terry

            Comment

            • Clem Z.
              Expired
              • December 31, 2005
              • 9427

              #21
              Re: Q-jet starting issues

              if you want the engine to fast idle at the speed in the manuals put some dry ice on the divorce choke cover to cool it down all the way.

              Comment

              • Stephen B.
                Expired
                • July 2, 2009
                • 31

                #22
                Re: Q-jet starting issues

                i have a 1976 stingray with q-jet carb - i dont start it every day - i have to pump it several times before it fires - im just used to it (40,00 actual miles) it seems when i drive it regularly it seems to start fairly easy every morning - nothing done to carb-steve benson(50586)

                Comment

                • Scott K.
                  Expired
                  • September 30, 2010
                  • 85

                  #23
                  Re: Q-jet starting issues

                  Originally posted by Lyndon Sharpton (12791)
                  I had my Q-jet completely went through re color the whole nine yards. Yet I still have starting issues, I have to pump the accelerator to get it to crank. Even if I start it every day I still have to pump it some. The gas where I live is all got about 10% ethanol in it now, could that be the problem? It has all new fuel pump also on it. Seems like someone said that is the way it is now with the fuel we have, that we should get used to having to be pumped and turned over a few times before it will now crank. Is that the experiences of most people with carburetors are now?
                  Once it cranks, I get a fast idle then the after it warms, the choke works like it should, it is that I just need to pump in order for it to crank. And when I first set the choke it gives it a shot of gas, but it will not crank with out pumping.
                  On my 72 I just changed out the carb to a date correct, fully rebuilt unit. Before and after the change, 2 pumps on the accelerator and it starts right up. Maybe sometimes a third pump.

                  Working on dialing in my choke... After it opens it idles down but still needs time to warm up before going in gear or it will stall. Has been cold here in philly though.

                  Scott

                  Comment

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