early, mid and late breakdown

[John S.]

What months are included to be considered an early car, or a late car? I have a 65 with a date of June 23, 1965 is this an early or late car? I say late but is there a mid car?

[Terry M.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

These terms do not always apply to the whole car, but rather certain parts of it. However certainly a car built in the first or last month of production could usually be considered early or late respectively. Looks like yours might be late.

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

terry
I have seen this issue of changes to various parts of a car happening all the time through out production taken to mean that there is no way to call a whole car early, mid or late production. I do not understand the theory behind it. It seems to me you look at VINs, and where they fall in a production year. In this instance the car was built in late June 1965. That is less than 2 1/2 months from the end of the model year. How this car could be called anything but a late production 1965 eludes me when production of 1965 cars spanned from August 64 through Aug 65. To me, 65 cars built in Summer/ Fall 64 are early production 65s, and cars built in Summer of 65 are late production cars. No?
Can you please enlighten me. I learn something new about these cars everyday. This will be today's thing.

[Michael W.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

The mistake is attempting to label the entire car early or late rather than referring just to individual components. Even then, first design, second design or third design as nomenclature would be more appropriate

Some changeovers did not occur until almost the very end of the production year- two of which appear on my car that was built with less than a month to go in the model year. Cars built up to time - the first 11 months and one week would therefore be called 'early'.

The same car has component that changed over in the second month of production, so it and the other cars following it down the line would be identified as 'late'.

Labelling an entire car as early or late has no purpose other than to confuse.

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

Mike
I think we argued this and other things on another forum. But here comes another news flash: your analysis is confusing me.
The first question was "My car is a late June 65 build. Can I call that a late, mid or early build car?" I do not see how changing that question to one about individual parts of a car clarifies anything. And I do not see how asking that question is a mistake. Now, you may say the question is meaningless because no one cares if a whole car was built early in a production run, or late in the production run. Because you, and perhaps many other classic corvette owners only care about when various mid year changes occurred. But I don't think that answers the question at issue for me. I still think 1965 model cars built in mid 64 were early build cars, and those built in June, July and August of 65 were late build cars. Call me ignorant, but I guess I just need more schooling, or, I can't see the forest for the trees.

[Michael W.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

Labelling an entire car as early or late has no purpose other than to confuse.

Mike
But here comes another news flash: your analysis is confusing me.

There you go!

Edit: maybe it will help if I add that I've never heard the terms early mid or late used during judging as applied to a car. Instead the month and date built is specified to help judge dated parts.

Maybe it might be easier to pin down a finite meaning of 'numbers matching'.

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

OH, OK, now I see. That makes perfect sense. It applies to judging various aspects of specific year cars.

But I think you make a mistake when you twist a question about early, mid or late production of a model year into one about various components of a car.

I think you should go by where the particular VIN falls during the production run. That will pretty clearly tell you whether a car was an early, mid or late build car. It won't tell you hardly anything at all about various components that were altered through out the production run however.

Do I get an A, a C, or an F ?

come on Terry, you're a teacher, can't you help me out here instead of just sitting there chuckling over this discussion?

[Michael W.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

I think you should go by where the particular VIN falls during the production run. That will pretty clearly tell you whether a car was an early, mid or late build car. It won't tell you hardly anything at all about various components that were altered through out the production run however.

Don,

It's your car so you can categorize it into any group you want if it makes you happy. Since nobody else I've ever run across places any importance on this particular criteria, they'll probably nod and smile and say 'that's nice'. It's the polite thing to do. And they'd probably also avoid discussing the topic any further, like I should have done.

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

You're right on with that one Mike,
I find people nodding and smiling saying "that's nice" to me a lot. They humor me.

[Paul J.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

What months are included to be considered an early car, or a late car? I have a 65 with a date of June 23, 1965 is this an early or late car? I say late but is there a mid car?

John, this is a very generalized term, and even those who were there during production don't have set cut-off dates. It really only matters as a point of conversation.

I tend to think of cars produced within the first two months of productiion as "early" and within the last two months as "late" (there is no "mid"), but this is only my opinion and as you can see, everyone has thier own opinion.

Paul

[Tracy C.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

What months are included to be considered an early car, or a late car? I have a 65 with a date of June 23, 1965 is this an early or late car? I say late but is there a mid car?

John, If you've been following your thread, you can see a clear definition doesn't exist on this topic.

Generally speaking, I would describe a car built withing the first three months of model year production as an "early production" unit. I would also consider cars built within the last 3 months of model year production as a "late production" unit. Those in the gap can be called "mid production" units.

However comma

That does not imply that an "early production" car will not have "late production" parts....

For example.. "early" 63s to VIN 2500 should have frosted wheelcovers. we call those "early" wheelcovers. After VIN 2500, the "late" version of wheelcovers were installed begining with "early production " cars and all the way through the end of the 63 production run.

The terms "early", "mid" and "late" as they apply to parts, must be limited to the various configuration changes of the specific part being considered and should never be confused with installation on "early" "mid" or "late" production cars.

tc

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

Tracy
I call this a fully fleshed out explanation that even a dummy like me can understand. I appreciate that you gave it. And I assume John and others will too.

[Tracy C.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

glad it helped...

[Ridge K.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

come on Terry, you're a teacher, can't you help me out here instead of just sitting there chuckling over this discussion?

I think he's still siting and chuckling..... .....shrewd fellow!

Seriously, I hope you have more of an understanding of the very general terms. My own midyear happens to hit about exactly in the middle of production. Often when discussing my car with fellow members, I'm asked if "it is early or late production". No one has ever asked "middle"...

[Don H.]

Re: early, mid and late breakdown

Yes, Terry's green lights been on, but he has not said a word. I think he may be dozing. His light is on, but no one is home.

I now fully understand early, middle, and late production, and also clearly understand that many aficionados are of the opinion that anyone who asks a question about it in relation to the whole car is a real dummy. They will be sent back to their room to study further, so they can return with a serious question pertaining to some specific aspect of the corvette. I'm cool with it. John Smith never did bother to come back.