Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

[Keith B.]

Advice pls- Have my all original never touched bumpers into the Chrome shop while my 66 TF car is being painted. After 45 yrs the org chrome was losing its shine but rock solid - no rust. Gave the shop owner instructions NOT to round off corners and leave wavy lines in the bumpers. He called me today and all of them are stripped - some of the nicest org cores he has seen in years, however being perfectionists they called me back to the shop to re-confirm if I wanted to keep the imperfections, ie weld lines, sharp corners, and weld dimples and wavy lines on the topside. I'm told, if I leave stock once they are re-chromed the imperfections will really stick out and look like a bad Friday afternoon job from the factory. 2 of 4 bumpers have several waves and weld bracket indentations. They want to smooth them out and fill flat with Copper and make them perfect.

Issue: If I leave them alone and re-chrome I will have super shiney wavy bumpers that really sticks out to the observer. If I restore them they become like repo's and HOW MANY POINTS will I lose on my original factory bumpers if they are corrected but leave the point/sharp edge corners. I want to go for another TF with my car and I also want it to look professionally correct with my new silver Lacquer paint job.

Best advice please.....

[Harry S.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Keith, weren't they super shine wavy bumpers when the car was new? I vote to leave them be and chrome as is!

If I leave them alone and re-chrome I will have super shiney wavy bumpers that really sticks out to the observer.
Best advice please.....

[Russ S.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

He has all ready said they are the nicest cores he has seen so they must not be too bad and you want them to look correct with your new paint job-sounds to me like you should re-plate them as they are.

[Don H.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Hey Keith,
you already traveled down this road last month, unless you are doing a different car also with perfect original old wavy bumpers. Didn't you get this all sorted out in February with this thread ---->
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...hrome&uid=6245

[Keith B.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Don: I guess I could have continued that old thread but my intent of this one was to see how many points I would lose if I smooth out the waves and re-chrome and leave sharp corners. As you noted in one of your messages you appear to be an expert in this area. This is my first go around re-chroming anything on my L-36. Further to my message last month, and as stated the bumpers are now completed stripped. I'm now told by the shop owner and was shown yesterday that I have a few deep indentations where the weld bolt brackets are situated and lots of waves. When its rechromed they tell me that this will aesthetically jump out at you with NEW chrome and look awful. Whereas the 45 yr old thin factory and worn chrome did not highlight these areas -nor draw your eye to them.

Further pursuant to the TIMJG, " The chrome plating has a good reflective quality. Evaluate for poor plating, poor surface prep in grinding scratches under plating. Some waviness may be apparent but should not be excessive. The surface on OEM bumpers tends to be more even with fewer waves, although waviness MAY exist in Orig and replacement bumpers. Chrome on the inside is of poor quality.

Thus in reviewing the judging standard as noted above it appears that their really is no consistency. For example before when I took my originals off the car for the first time in 45 yrs 2 of the 4 bumpers had deep grinding scratches on the underside of the bumper below the plating- this was factory but not perhaps not typical of the standard.

Evaluate for poor surface prep - some waviness maybe apparent but not excessive and more even with fewer waves.

I think the TIMJG does a good job of covering the wide variations of bumper quality as it really just depends if you get really nice ones or poorer quality pieces.

For the restorer though do you smooth the waves out and make them look like GM had a good day at the office or leave a few waves to still show they are original. Or in my case leave a few deep indentations around the welds and get hit for poor surface prep and poor plating.

I'm of the view to leave a few waves, repair the identations and deep scratches from the factory grinder and hope for the best on the judging field. And just to really add another take on this subject, at my last NW Regional where it rec'd a TF award, the original team thought my bumpers were repo's and thought they were too wavy - until Roy Sinor came over and shared with them they were original factory bumpers.

At the end of the day again I guess it comes down to how far does the restorer go...............

[Don H.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Keith
first, I am no expert in anything, but have some knowledge and experience regarding chrome work. I think you are overthinking this thing.
The old original bumpers have some waves on the top, and lots of unfinished appearance things on the underside, still, they were, and still are beautiful bumpers on mid year vettes IMO. If you have them polished and rechromed, with all the original flaws intact, they will look just like they did originally, and should take no deductions for originality or condition. However, if someone docked you a couple points, it would not hurt you any IMO. I think you can absorb loss of points here and there, and still make 97 point + TF. If you want to make your bumpers a little better by smoothing out some of the bumps and lines in the bumpers, go ahead. As for me, I would leave them as they were when new.

[Ridge K.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Keith, one day a couple years ago I was commenting on another thread about the quality of St. Louis factory C3 paint jobs. I had heard over, and over, and over again that the factory paint jobs were so poor, they were almost a joke.

I told the story about a certain brand-new monaco orange 1969 coupe sitting in a showroom, that I had desperately wanted to buy back in 1969. I had gone over every square inch of the car over the course of several days. The paint job was flawless.
My contention in that thread was: "is it fair to give a points hit to someone on the judging field, when a few cars did some out near-perfect". After all, common sense would dictate that a few Corvettes got superb paint coverage (new painter that day,... perfect weather conditions, ...etc.)

A very wise senior judge pointed out to me, that what the judges were looking for, was "TYPICAL factory production condition, ...as delivered to the dealer"

It sounds to me that you bumpers would fit this typical factory production standard plating them, as they now sit. Just my 2 cents.
Ridge

[Russ S.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Don: I guess I could have continued that old thread but my intent of this one was to see how many points I would lose if I smooth out the waves and re-chrome and leave sharp corners. As you noted in one of your messages you appear to be an expert in this area. This is my first go around re-chroming anything on my L-36. Further to my message last month, and as stated the bumpers are now completed stripped. I'm now told by the shop owner and was shown yesterday that I have a few deep indentations where the weld bolt brackets are situated and lots of waves. When its rechromed they tell me that this will aesthetically jump out at you with NEW chrome and look awful. Whereas the 45 yr old thin factory and worn chrome did not highlight these areas -nor draw your eye to them.

Further pursuant to the TIMJG, " The chrome plating has a good reflective quality. Evaluate for poor plating, poor surface prep in grinding scratches under plating. Some waviness may be apparent but should not be excessive. The surface on OEM bumpers tends to be more even with fewer waves, although waviness MAY exist in Orig and replacement bumpers. Chrome on the inside is of poor quality.

Thus in reviewing the judging standard as noted above it appears that their really is no consistency. For example before when I took my originals off the car for the first time in 45 yrs 2 of the 4 bumpers had deep grinding scratches on the underside of the bumper below the plating- this was factory but not perhaps not typical of the standard.

Evaluate for poor surface prep - some waviness maybe apparent but not excessive and more even with fewer waves.

I think the TIMJG does a good job of covering the wide variations of bumper quality as it really just depends if you get really nice ones or poorer quality pieces.

For the restorer though do you smooth the waves out and make them look like GM had a good day at the office or leave a few waves to still show they are original. Or in my case leave a few deep indentations around the welds and get hit for poor surface prep and poor plating.

I'm of the view to leave a few waves, repair the identations and deep scratches from the factory grinder and hope for the best on the judging field. And just to really add another take on this subject, at my last NW Regional where it rec'd a TF award, the original team thought my bumpers were repo's and thought they were too wavy - until Roy Sinor came over and shared with them they were original factory bumpers.

At the end of the day again I guess it comes down to how far does the restorer go...............

Keith, With this new info, I would agree with you. Repair the non typical scratches and indentations but leave a small amount of waviness.

[Mike G.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

most of the points you loose are from the chrome being too nice. the waves help with that. the chrome on originals dont look near as good as what you get done today. you are only looking at a couple of points and the shiny bumpers will look good with the shiny new paint. go for it. i do every car.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

I had my rear bumpers of my 63 rechromed back in 1976 because they had a lot of "Patina", or cob web lines on them - probably from years of lead exposure. The shop knew nothing of Corvette bumpers, so did the best they could. They still look good with the exception that at the weld joints of the curved section (corners) to the main section there are some pits (holes) that in time have exposed the bare metal and show a little rust - real little, but I know it. I have since covered them with NCRS stickers, Ha!

Stu Fox

[Gary S.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Decisions...long term, what will make you sleep better? My last 5 judging assignments have been the exterior section...you know...the fun section, paint, bumpers etc. Many owners (especially body-off restored) struggle with cosmetics vs factory look. Ask yourself if you are trying to reproduce everything to factory. If you are on that anal track, leave the waves. If you are cherry picking what you leave factory, evaluate the importance of those waves due to bumpers having a large presence. For me, I would remove the waves because (1) they will have better chrome than originals anyway and could receive a deduct with a picky judge, (2) those waves look ugly next to nice paint, (3) no waves should not receive a deduct, (4) bumpers have few points assigned anyway and (5) because of their large presence, you will be asked by non-NCRS people what happened.

[Jeff B.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

I agree with Gary, make them perfect. I spend lot more time looking at and playing with my car then getting it judged. Even if you get a deduction for over restoration it will only be a couple of points and that is not going to make or break the judging event. I built my car to top flight and also look stunning. Since it is of almost no consequence in your total score, it really comes down to what you want it to look like.

[Tom L.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Those of us that love the origional look of our cars struggle with this all the time, I know I do. To me the question is; Do I want it to look 'typical', meaning the way they came from the factory (bad) or they way they 'wanted' them to come out of the factory (real nice cars). While costs of manufacturing had an impact on the way they were built, I'm sure none of the designers or engineers 'wanted' them to look bad, they wanted them to look great.

While the NCRS judging system does not care about that what designers and engineers wanted, it is what it is and does a great job of keeping the real history of these cars intact. Like anything in life, it's a compromise. I just think that whatever is done should make the owner happy, not the ones looking at it. Have fun !!

[Paul J.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Keith, the other posters have hit the nail on the head! It's a tough decision to either reproduce poor factory quality or pay the same money for it to be done right. I struggle with this every time I work on my car. Like Lynn said, it's a compromise and you have to decide what makes you happy. It sounds like your goal is to Top Flight again, and your very concerned about the minimal amount of points that you'll lose with concours bumpers. However, if you ever sell the car it will show better and perhaps bring more money with finishes that are better than factory.

Paul

[Keith B.]

Re: Org bumper Re-chroming - Leave the Waves

Thank-you to all who responded - excellent view points from everyone. Tough decision but for $ 350 a bumper making them sub standard really doesn't sit well with me. I spoke to the shop owner and they are leaving the sharp edge pointy corners/ends but taking out the indentations and waves for near perfect show product on a new paint job. I took some big point hits on the 30 yr old paint and body cond and still TF last time, so with a new paint/body work gains in scores, a possible 8 points originality hit I can handle while shining my new chrome on a sunny day.......thanks to everyone and Arland Dower for his personal e-mail and wise/sage advice....cheers/Keith