Orange peel

[Robert W.]

How much orange peel is acceptable on a 1960 Corvette in order to prevent points from being deducted?

[Paul J.]

Re: Orange peel

Robert,

I plugged "orange peel" into the search engine for the archives and got over 5 pages of threads. I started to read them to find the best one for your question but there are just too many. The answer you seek is in one or more of those threads. Good luck.

Paul

[Jack H.]

Re: Orange peel

Basically, it's the opposite issue in terms of judging...how much orange peel is acceptable...

Most painters want to execute a Concours d'Elegance paint job leaving the exterior surfaces MIRROR flat to the point you can comb your hair in your reflection... That was NOT the way a typical production car left the assy line. And, we judge according to a Factory Concours philosophy.

These cars were the product of UAW labor, built in a hurry, to get them out the door and go cash to cash. Paint and exterior surface quality were well KNOWN quality write-up issues both in-plant and via warranty tickets paid at delivering dealerships. A VARIABLE degree of 'orange peel' WAS known to be typical of factory production.

The better question is how much orange peel do judges expect/want to see in order NOT to deduct on the car's score? Well, this is a subjective area, but it's not that hard to explain as there IS an NCRS judge training DVD that's used as a schooling tool!

Basically, one key is reflection. Can you see your face clearly enough in the surface to mimic a mirror? Typically, one would expect the reflection to be distorted to the extent that only a vauge reflected outline appears.

Next, is the final buff out typical of factory production or not? Cars weren't buffed on 'non-cosmetic' surfaces. That includes the door jamb area and outer surfaces below the belt line. These non-cosmetic surfaces ought to appear 'rougher' than the upper/outer primary surface panels.

Last, few restorers can actually bring themselves to recreate a truly factory concours paint job! Most, get 'baby' too perfect making it noticeably better than typical factory production. The general deduction for this is a 25% deduction on orginality for paint.

It's very common for a restorer to live with that knowing he/she executed the restoration job the way THEY wanted it done...

[Rich P.]

Re: Orange peel

A true untouched original paint car tends to have much less orange peel than when it left the factory because of having been polished and waxed by hand many many times since new. The factory lacquer would "Flatten" out each time the car was waxed UNLESS the wax was 100% pure wax with no polising/cleaning agents.
If you reduce and spray with the right pattern you can perfectly replicate the factory peel. I think what most people tink of when peel is mentiond is heavy ugly thick looking enamel paint peel. Lacquer peel is very fine and much flatter than enamel or urethane, however you can also replicat the factory peel with todays urethanes. It is a matter of technique, chemistry and knowlade of factory correct looking peel.

The paint process was different on the fiberglass bodies as it was for the steel cars. The steel cars were able to be baked at close to 300 degrees to "reflow the paint. The fiberglass cars could only be baked at 185 degrees not enough to reflow but just enough to flattent the top surfaces out just a little. Then the cars would have a buffer run over them from the belt line up again flattening tthe tp surfaces while leaving the sides with alot more peel.

So sorry I cant tell you what is acceptable it is something you need to see from observing original cars and I mean many because not all " original" cars have untouched paint.

Hope this helps you understand a little better what you are trying to replicate.

Rich

[John S.]

Re: Orange peel

different buffing wheels were used, the ones giving the best finish were used on the top of car. top of car will be well buffed because that was the part of the car most viewed by the customer. upper sides of fenders and doors will not be buffed as smooth or glossy as top of car and will show some orange peel. i believe the proper buffing direction is up and down in this area. lower part of car might never have seen a buffer and will show the most orange peel.

[Rob M.]

Re: Orange peel

Question: was orange peel option also available in other colors then orange???

[Gene M.]

Re: Orange peel

.................. If you reduce and spray with the right pattern you can perfectly replicate the factory peel. I think what most people tink of when peel is mentiond is heavy ugly thick looking enamel paint peel. Lacquer peel is very fine and much flatter than enamel or urethane, however you can also replicat the factory peel with todays urethanes. It is a matter of technique, chemistry and knowlade of factory correct looking peel..........

Rich

Well defined, You said things that the NCRS guide lines never addresses. The "peel" replication of original lacquer and urethane or enamel are as different as night and day. Thank you for spelling this out.

"Most" cars on the flight field do not exhibit any attempts to replicate the thinned out look of orange peel that lacquer exhibits with the urethanes they have applied.

Making the smaller peel look is not as easy as one would think. The big peel of enamel and urethane is character of the paint. Most painters and restorers do not deal with it at all.

[Rich P.]

Re: Orange peel

Gene,

thanks for the kind words. In the next 3 months I am going to be painting 3 cars. 1 a 66 corvette in lacquer, 2 a 61 in urethane and 3 a 69 camaro in urethane. On all 3 cars I will be replicating original lacquer applied peel. I will be postting the procedure as well as pictures of the results as I do them.

On a side note it might be benificial to have several sets of paint test panels with different paints and thier peel so at a judged show the body judges could use these to show owners of judged cars what they are talking about. Also this might be benificial in judging seminars to help new judges ID diffetent paints as well as peel.

Rich

[Jack H.]

Re: Orange peel

Yes, it was available in yellow and known as lemon peel on those VERY defective factory delivered cars from the Detroit based automakers...