Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

[Roger P.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Hi guys,
Needed a winter fix, so I'm in NC skiing with the family. This is what happens when you live in South Florida . Before we left, I noticed that my accelerator nozzles were not squirting on time, and the shot was very weak. My old pump worked perfectly, but I replaced it while the carb was open just to be proactive. Obviously, something is wrong with the pump or .043 nozzle. Even with the near nonexistent pump shot, the hesitation is not as bad as it was before. When I return next week, I will replace the nozzle for the .024 and see what's up with the pump. The original nozzle was a .033, so I think a good pump shot with the smaller nozzle might solve the problem. I will also try to adjust the throttle plates to the recommended .020 transfer slot exposure so the passenger side A/F emulsion screw works properly. Stay tuned...

Hitting the slopes,
Roger (50141)

[Clem Z.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Hi guys,
Needed a winter fix, so I'm in NC skiing with the family. This is what happens when you live in South Florida . Before we left, I noticed that my accelerator nozzles were not squirting on time, and the shot was very weak. My old pump worked perfectly, but I replaced it while the carb was open just to be proactive. Obviously, something is wrong with the pump or .043 nozzle. Even with the near nonexistent pump shot, the hesitation is not as bad as it was before. When I return next week, I will replace the nozzle for the .024 and see what's up with the pump. The original nozzle was a .033, so I think a good pump shot with the smaller nozzle might solve the problem. I will also try to adjust the throttle plates to the recommended .020 transfer slot exposure so the passenger side A/F emulsion screw works properly. Stay tuned...

Hitting the slopes,
Roger (50141)

make sure the check valve in the pump well is working correctly so no fuel is being forced back into the float bowl instead of out the nozzles. is the check valve right under the squirters in place ???.

[Roger P.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

make sure the check valve in the pump well is working correctly so no fuel is being forced back into the float bowl instead of out the nozzles. is the check valve right under the squirters in place ???.

Clem,
After I remove the top of the carb, how do I make sure the check valve in the pump well is working correctly? Also, when I replaced the squirter nozzle, I saw a "chrome ball" below the nozzle. Is that another check valve? I thought it would move/roll, but it appeared to be fixed in place. Is that right?

Roger (50141)

[Clem Z.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Clem,
After I remove the top of the carb, how do I make sure the check valve in the pump well is working correctly? Also, when I replaced the squirter nozzle, I saw a "chrome ball" below the nozzle. Is that another check valve? I thought it would move/roll, but it appeared to be fixed in place. Is that right?

Roger (50141)

put some non flammable fluid into the float bowl with the top off and use the pump plunger by hand to push the fluid. watch in the float bowl for bubbles at the check valve. that "chrome ball" should be free in its cavity.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger;

There are a number of ways to check out the check valves/balls/needles; usually, it is best to have the carb off the car and on a bench with the top removed. With some fuel in the bowl, you can do a simple pump check valve test by pushing the pump down with check and squirter in place to see if any bubbles comes up from the check valve (Note: it is not common to see a check valve itself malfunction due to the fact they are so simple in nature. However, if the carb is gummed up with lots of sediment, then it's a different story). This test can be done with water for that matter if you are in the process of cleaning the entire carb, and often times a source of compressed air may be employed to assist in the testing.

The check ball or needle under the squirter is there I suppose to keep air from being drawn back into the accelerator circuit and make it work more positively. The ball or needle usually will only come out when the carb is upside down, and even then it may need a little encouragement. It is just in there loose.

Stu Fox

[Roger P.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Stu and Clem,
Is the check ball/valve under the pump the same type of ball as the one under the squirter? Do you think they can be removed with a magnet? If so, I will spray some carb cleaner in the cavities before putting the top back on.

Roger (50141)

[Clem Z.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Stu and Clem,
Is the check ball/valve under the pump the same type of ball as the one under the squirter? Do you think they can be removed with a magnet? If so, I will spray some carb cleaner in the cavities before putting the top back on.

Roger (50141)

the ball bearings are stainless steel or aluminum so they are not magnetic

[Stuart F.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger;

I can't speak with any authority on the Edelbrock version of the AFB, but my two older Carter versions used a captive check ball valve to the pump chamber. It was a brass body containing the ball and screwed into the main body just like a jet. The squirter ball/needle just sits below the squirter head in the cavity and usually comes out when you turn the carb upside down. I believe it to be made of a non-ferrous metal and therefore non magnetic. You could probably push it out with compressed air, but good luck finding it (not good). Again, if you are careful, you may be able to hand operate the pump to see if it moves, but hold your finger partially over the passage so that it doesn't escape on you, or use some clear tape. If all you want to do is verify it's operation, try this but be careful.
It would probably be a good idea to give it a shot of solvent anyway to free it from any gas contaminents.

Stu Fox

[Clem Z.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger;

I can't speak with any authority on the Edelbrock version of the AFB, but my two older Carter versions used a captive check ball valve to the pump chamber. It was a brass body containing the ball and screwed into the main body just like a jet. The squirter ball/needle just sits below the squirter head in the cavity and usually comes out when you turn the carb upside down. I believe it to be made of a non-ferrous metal and therefore non magnetic. You could probably push it out with compressed air, but good luck finding it (not good). Again, if you are careful, you may be able to hand operate the pump to see if it moves, but hold your finger partially over the passage so that it doesn't escape on you, or use some clear tape. If all you want to do is verify it's operation, try this but be careful.
It would probably be a good idea to give it a shot of solvent anyway to free it from any gas contaminents.

Stu Fox

to check the check valve which is spring loaded remove the squirter and put you finger over the squirer hole in the carb body while you push down on the pump plunger and if the check valve is leaking it will show up them. if the check ball bearing under the squirter is stuck you can use air pressure into the outlet opening in the bottom of the pump well while holding your finger over the ball bearing to prevent it from disappearing under the work bench.

[Roger P.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Since the pump and squirter worked correctly before I changed those parts, I can assume the check valves are OK. However, I will use some carb cleaner in there anyway while the top is off. Not sure why the new pump is lame, but I assume it isn't anything too serious. Going to get in some more skiing now , but I know what to do when I return home next week!

Thank you,
Roger (50141)

[Timothy B.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger,

To add to what Clem say's, the Edelbrock directions I sent you show a weight above the pump discharge ball, part # 37. If your carburetor is supposed to have this and it's missing, the pump will suck air instead of fuel when refilling.

The purpose of the discharge check is to prevent this and also keep the air flowing by the nozzles from sucking fuel from the pump circuit.

Make sure the accelerator pump is adjusted per the directions, pump rod height, etc.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

There you go Roger. Forget the Vette for now and go have some fun in the frigid north. While you're skying, I'll be at my sons watching the Bears eat the Packers, and the Jets jettison the Steelers.

Don't forget the Winter Meet next week.

Stu Fox

[Roger P.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Well, it's been a long road and I find myself pretty much back where I started. I initially thought my stumble/hesitation problem was the electric choke, but when replacing & adjusting the choke didn't resolve the issue, I moved on from there. As it has been documented in this long thread, I have replaced a few ignition parts, changed the accelerator pump & squirters, adjusted the throttle plates & idle mixture screws, replaced gaskets, etc. After reading several suggestions online and via the TBD, I have tried everything that I am capable of doing; including playing with various metering rod & spring combinations. Hours have been spent, but unfortunately I haven't been able to correct the issue. One thing that I lost sight of was that nearly all the stumble disappears once the engine warms up. As it was previously pointed out, my GM Performance ZZZ engine doesn't have a manifold heat crossover valve, so I am unable to get engine heat to the intake manifold and under the carb until the engine warms up. Perhaps I am wrong, but I believe that is the problem. If so, the only thing I can do is to install a heat sensor connected to the choke like Stu did on his car. This will keep the choke coil from heating until the engine is warm enough to allow the 12 volts to flow. The fast idle cam would then remain on for a much longer time, thus "covering" the stumble when starting from a stop. I am also going to replace the fuel filter, however I doubt that it has anything to do with my stumble problem.

Stu, please send me a photo of your engine with the heat sensor so I can get an idea of how it should be set up on my engine. Also, please let me know if you have a brand, model #, or place to purchase the sensor. I'm sorry that I couldn't get to Kissimmee this weekend, but I will make plans to attend next year. I may be visiting a friend in the Tampa area this Spring or Summer and will contact you then. Gentlemen, I truly appreciate all of your assistance!! If you have any other suggestions, please let me know as I am still willing to try other ideas.

Thank you again,
Roger (50141)

[Timothy B.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger,

Try to adjust the choke coil a different way to see if it helps by slowing the choke opening some.

After the engine warms to operating temperature, loosen the three screws on the coil cover and turn the coil to the rich until the choke starts to close then back it off just until it's just full open.

This will ensure it's opening as slow as possible and may help.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Edelbrock Electric Choke Issue

Roger;

I agree with Tim. There's not much you can do with the given condition of no heat riser for manifold heat. Really, your warm up period should not be all that great and, as you say, it runs well when it is warm. What degree thermostat are you running? Do you have a fan clutch and is it operating properly? The point being, you may want to look into what you can do to improve/quicken your warm up cycle.

Ironically, you could probably benefit by having a standard mechanical choke with hot air tube. However, converting your Edelbrock would probably be difficult and an expensive proposition as I doubt it is drilled for a hot air bleed and may not accept a standard AFB choke housing. Best to try what Tim sugested to get a better adjustment on your electric for your conditions.

Stu Fox