Mid-year Balls Joints

[Peter L.]

Has anyone had experience with America's Finest Corvettes' 1963-1983 upper & lower ball joints from both a judging and driving performance perspective?
Pete

[Don H.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

I have them on my 65 but bought them through Long Island. They were not on the car when it was judged but it drives fine. I know they came from A.F.C. because L.I. refered me to them when one set (I think upper) would not take grease. Turns out they were "permanently lubed" type & the grease zert was for looks. Don H.

[Joe L.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

I have them on my 65 but bought them through Long Island. They were not on the car when it was judged but it drives fine. I know they came from A.F.C. because L.I. refered me to them when one set (I think upper) would not take grease. Turns out they were "permanently lubed" type & the grease zert was for looks. Don H.

Don------


Was there any information on these as to where they were manufactured and/or by what company? I believe that these are reproduced for America's Finest Corvettes by some manufacturing entity and they then wholesale them to any of the other vendors wanting to carry them.

With reproduction parts I am often concerned that more attention is given to appearance than to quality/durability/functionality. They often don't even get the appearance 100% correct, so that makes me wonder even more about the more important factors.

Of course, there is always the "product liability" incentive for the suppliers. However, I don't know if the liability resides with America's Finest Corvettes or the firm that manufactures them. And, if that firm is "off-shore", just how much incentive do they have for "product liability"?

One more very important thing that's an "axiom" with me: cheap tooling makes inferior parts. I just don't understand how any firm can afford high quality, EXPENSIVE tooling to manufacture a very low volume reproduction part---even "offshore" manufacturers.

[Tony S.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Pete. I had the AFC ball joints installed on my '65 396 car. They LOOK the closest to originals than any other modern made ball joint out there. That said, I understand that they are made in China, so I'm not sure about the quality as Joe L. writes above. When I later did my '65 L79 car, I chose some American made ball joints that don't look perfect, but I'm more confident in their durability. Since I drive my '65 small block car, I was willing to take a small hit on the ball joints just to feel comfortable with their reliability.

I'd say that if a car is going to be driven very little, the AFC ball joints are fine. If you are wanting to put some real miles on your car, I'd go with either NOS originals or new American made high quality ball joints that can stand up to those bumpy NM roads...

Tony

[Paul O.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Pete on the judging side some of the finishes are different then the originals. There are also some small configuration issues. In my opinion and I am just one Chassis judge the only deduction would be for the finish issues 20% the other items just a notation to help the owner.

As far as driving with these joints installed for me to the trailer and back. With out information on how the items were produced, what materials were used fatigue testing and quality control one can not make an informed decisions on whether they are up to the original GM standards for safety.

Just my opinion.

Paul 18046

[Terry M.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Has anyone had experience with America's Finest Corvettes' 1963-1983 upper & lower ball joints from both a judging and driving performance perspective?
Pete

And no one has yet mentioned the fastener issue. To look original they have to be riveted. Are these ball studs (GMs term, not mine ) drilled for rivets or bolts? The OEM ball studs have smaller holes for the rivet, which when headed expands on the diameter of the shaft to fill the holes in the control arm and ball stud. In general replacement ball studs are produced with a slightly larger hole so a screw can be installed. If riveted it is questionable if the rivet shaft will expand to fill this larger hole, and it probably will not expand properly if the hole in the control arm is the smaller diameter and the ball stud hole is the larger diameter.

Show field to trailer ought to be no issue regardless, but if anyone were to drive their Corvette as the engineers intended (perish the thought) there are some issues to think about here. I only wish I had answers to them.

[Tracy C.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Terry,

I riveted the AFC ball joints on my 63. The uppers are correctly sized for the 1/4" rivets and the lowers are correctly sized for the 5/16" rivets.

I experienced no problems with the ball joints taking grease nor do I find any "finish" issues after stripping the paint from the upper ball joints. No miles driven yet, but I don't expect any problems.

tc

[Terry M.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Glad to hear about the size of the rivet hole Tracy. That is one less thing to be concerned about.

[Joe L.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

And no one has yet mentioned the fastener issue. To look original they have to be riveted. Are these ball studs (GMs term, not mine ) drilled for rivets or bolts? The OEM ball studs have smaller holes for the rivet, which when headed expands on the diameter of the shaft to fill the holes in the control arm and ball stud. In general replacement ball studs are produced with a slightly larger hole so a screw can be installed. If riveted it is questionable if the rivet shaft will expand to fill this larger hole, and it probably will not expand properly if the hole in the control arm is the smaller diameter and the ball stud hole is the larger diameter.

Show field to trailer ought to be no issue regardless, but if anyone were to drive their Corvette as the engineers intended (perish the thought) there are some issues to think about here. I only wish I had answers to them.

Terry------

The fastener holes in the GM UPPER ball joints were 17/64" (for 1/4" rivets) for PRODUCTION and 21/64" (for 5/16" bolts) for SERVICE. However, the lower ball joints for BOTH PRODUCTION and SERVICE had 21/64" holes for either 5/16" rivets or 5/16" bolts.

[Joe L.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Pete. I had the AFC ball joints installed on my '65 396 car. They LOOK the closest to originals than any other modern made ball joint out there. That said, I understand that they are made in China, so I'm not sure about the quality as Joe L. writes above. When I later did my '65 L79 car, I chose some American made ball joints that don't look perfect, but I'm more confident in their durability. Since I drive my '65 small block car, I was willing to take a small hit on the ball joints just to feel comfortable with their reliability.

I'd say that if a car is going to be driven very little, the AFC ball joints are fine. If you are wanting to put some real miles on your car, I'd go with either NOS originals or new American made high quality ball joints that can stand up to those bumpy NM roads...

Tony

Tony------


Keep in mind that just because the ball joints are made in China does not necessarily make them bad. It just adds a certain "question mark" to them. Even if they were made in the USA with cheap tooling, they might not be up-to-snuff.

Contrary to what we'd all like to believe, there is some pretty good stuff coming out of China these days. In fact, our new eastern span of the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge is being built from steel manufactured and fabricated in China. There are also a lot of very high quality electronics coming out of China.

[Gene M.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Tony------


Keep in mind that just because the ball joints are made in China does not necessarily make them bad. It just adds a certain "question mark" to them. Even if they were made in the USA with cheap tooling, they might not be up-to-snuff.

Contrary to what we'd all like to believe, there is some pretty good stuff coming out of China these days. In fact, our new eastern span of the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge is being built from steel manufactured and fabricated in China. There are also a lot of very high quality electronics coming out of China.

It is a well known fact in the world of industry that china steel is inferior to what the USA has been accustomed to. Many industries had to widen the spec's to allow china steel to be used. sad..............

[Edward J.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Tony------


Keep in mind that just because the ball joints are made in China does not necessarily make them bad. It just adds a certain "question mark" to them. Even if they were made in the USA with cheap tooling, they might not be up-to-snuff.

Contrary to what we'd all like to believe, there is some pretty good stuff coming out of China these days. In fact, our new eastern span of the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge is being built from steel manufactured and fabricated in China. There are also a lot of very high quality electronics coming out of China.

Joe, Being in the automotive repair business there seems to be not much of Anything made in the USA these days, China is a going to be another Japan, The biggest problem I see is there quality control still needs to get better, Today I was working on a 80 corvette rebuilding the interior with parts supplyed by the owner and most of the packages where clearly marked made in china, made in tawian, The quality is no wheres near the O. E. stuff. But what other choices do we have? I am seeing improvements in there stuff but, I Equate the parts made in China to Hyundai cars of the 80's, Throw away cars at 50/60k.

[Joe L.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Joe, Being in the automotive repair business there seems to be not much of Anything made in the USA these days, China is a going to be another Japan, The biggest problem I see is there quality control still needs to get better, Today I was working on a 80 corvette rebuilding the interior with parts supplyed by the owner and most of the packages where clearly marked made in china, made in tawian, The quality is no wheres near the O. E. stuff. But what other choices do we have? I am seeing improvements in there stuff but, I Equate the parts made in China to Hyundai cars of the 80's, Throw away cars at 50/60k.

Edward-----


Stuff made in Japan used to be a laughing stock 40 years ago and the butt of all sorts of jokes. Now, stuff made in Japan is the quality standard of the world. If one wants something that's REALLY high quality, one looks for the made in Japan label. You won't find it very much anymore, though, unless you buy REALLY high end stuff. For example, if you buy a Nikon D50 camera, I expect you'll find it made in China or somewhere similar. But, if you buy a Nikon D3, I expect (but don't actually know) you'd find it was made in Japan. If you buy a low end Sony receiver, I expect you'd find it made in China. Buy one of their high-end units ($1,000+) and I expect it will be made in Japan.

I figure China will follow the same pattern; they're already half-way there. One of these days, if not right now, folks in the USA are going to be saying..."Chairman Mao, where are you when we need you"?

[Edward J.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Edward-----


Stuff made in Japan used to be a laughing stock 40 years ago and the butt of all sorts of jokes. Now, stuff made in Japan is the quality standard of the world. If one wants something that's REALLY high quality, one looks for the made in Japan label. You won't find it very much anymore, though, unless you buy REALLY high end stuff. For example, if you buy a Nikon D50 camera, I expect you'll find it made in China or somewhere similar. But, if you buy a Nikon D3, I expect (but don't actually know) you'd find it was made in Japan. If you buy a low end Sony receiver, I expect you'd find it made in China. Buy one of their high-end units ($1,000+) and I expect it will be made in Japan.

I figure China will follow the same pattern; they're already half-way there. One of these days, if not right now, folks in the USA are going to be saying..."Chairman Mao, where are you when we need you"?

Joe, the problem with stuff made in china is too much american infulence, and poor quality control. its sad to say but this is just a small reason we are in one tough recession,once the comptition started we looked for cheaper ways to make those computer chips and everything else was to follow inc. Automotive parts which is very big in china. Once china is on its feet there will be big changes.

[Jim D.]

Re: Mid-year Balls Joints

Edward-----


Stuff made in Japan used to be a laughing stock 40 years ago and the butt of all sorts of jokes. Now, stuff made in Japan is the quality standard of the world. If one wants something that's REALLY high quality, one looks for the made in Japan label. You won't find it very much anymore, though, unless you buy REALLY high end stuff. For example, if you buy a Nikon D50 camera, I expect you'll find it made in China or somewhere similar. But, if you buy a Nikon D3, I expect (but don't actually know) you'd find it was made in Japan. If you buy a low end Sony receiver, I expect you'd find it made in China. Buy one of their high-end units ($1,000+) and I expect it will be made in Japan.

I figure China will follow the same pattern; they're already half-way there. One of these days, if not right now, folks in the USA are going to be saying..."Chairman Mao, where are you when we need you"?

No truer words have been spoken. You forgot about Korea. They fit between Japan & China. Their products have already skyrocketed in quality. China won't be too far behind.