Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Dick, Reg is set to 8 volt. Brad
Dick, Reg is set to 8 volt. Brad
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Karl, I will ask him what he did, Brad.Brad,
I asked a simple question about you stating someone rebult your starter.
Was he qualified?? If the end bushings are bad and (other things) this can cause the starter to heat up and drag. After a few cranks could be why starter drags.
As for the solenoid...It snaps the bendix gear into the flywheel while the starter motor turns. When they go bad nothing works. Sometimes the may click
as you turn the Ignition key to start and maybe catch and start the prosess or the starting motor may just hum.
So back to the rebuild of the starter?????? Was it rebuilt all the way or part of the way????
Yes, but maybe I should ask him if he went end to end, seems tight to me, will check other stuff first then have him check starter out, thanks Brad.
Karl.Comment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Roy mentioned in a previous thread to verify the proper gauge of the positive battery cable. From an archived thread on battery cables, NAPA part number 711431 is the proper 1AWG cable that also looks like the original except for the Delco stamp. Reproduction cables are 4AWG.Comment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Will keep you all posted, have not got to it yet, Brad.
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Brad,
If you have a digital voltmeter and someone to help you I can walk you through how to check for voltage drop while the engine is cranking. That will show you where there is a poor connection, if there is one.
The first step, however, is to check the voltage at the starter as has been already described. If that voltage is less than 8 volts, with the battery at 9 volts -- then we can test for voltage drop.
Keep us posted.
As an aside: I come from a heritage of 6-volt operated Cadillacs -- some of which were 16 cylinders. They would start on the first crank, but everything -- fuel and electrical -- has to be spot on. A poor starter rebuild by someone not familiar with what today are low voltage starters can be a killer. The starter armature and bushings have to be as new or the armature will be too far from the field coils or it may not be centered between the field coils or it can drag on the lower coils if the bushings are too loose. Any of those things will kill the torque output of the starter.TerryComment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Ok I'm back. Battery fresh charged to 9.0, put back in car 9 hours later reads 8.33, cranked over starter and reading was 6.2 at starter. Let class begin. Hey, thanks for all the input, that is so cool. Brad.
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Brad that voltage at the starter is low.
There are two possibilities -- the starter is drawing too much current. This could be due to the internal connections of the starter or too much drag of the engine. Using the clamp-on ammeter as described above measure the current going through the cable close to the starter. Your Chevrolet Service Manual may give a current draw number for the starter. If not consult the rebuilder and ask what the number should be. The results of that test should lead you either to the starter/engine or the cables from the battery tot he starter.
For a voltage drop test:
Lots of information here. You will see some different "rules of thumb" for the acceptable voltage drop. I like 0.20 volts, but always remember like golf a low number is good.
TerryComment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
I've never used an 8 volt battery but the 54 I work on voltage drops to 5.2 v while cranking and starts beautifully in about 3-4 rotations.
6.2 volts is more than it would have using a 6v battery when it was brand new.
When was the last good tune up ?
rhump...rhump...rhump...rhump...rhump...rhump...rh ump...rhump...rhump...rhump...Vroom
IMO this is too much cranking before a start.Comment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
If that reading was made between the starter's battery terminal and the case of the starter (as opposed to, say, the engine block or the negative post of the battery), then there is plenty of Voltage available under load.
I see two problems, though.
First, a voltage drop of nearly two Volts, presumably in the cables, is excessive. Confirm that this is actually the case by repeating the cranking test with the Voltmeter connected ONLY and DIRECTLY to the battery posts. Do not let the meter leads contact the cables or the cable clamps.
Second, if the starter cranks slowly with 6.2 Volts applied, something is wrong with the starter.
JimComment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Brad, agree with Jim. It would be good to check the voltage drop and current draw. As other posters have pointed out; good carb settings and tune up plug points, etc. are essential to making a 6 cylinder start easy. You can increase the cable capacity by connecting a good set of jumper cables; one from the battery pos terminal to the starter and the negative to a good bare frame ground. Then see if your cranking's improved or not. If starting's improved then cables are suspect. If not it's the starter. Am repeating my previous post that an induction (slip of the pos cable to starter) amp meter like the KD 2423 current indicator, which you should be able to get from a large auto parts store would help with the diagnosis. JMTCW, Gary....
Last edited by Gary C.; July 1, 2010, 08:31 AM.NCRS Texas Chapter
https://www.ncrstexas.org/
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61565408483631Comment
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off the wall thought.....
Is there any chance that is a 12 Volt starter?
How could a 12 Volt starter get there? I can think of two ways:
'54 6 Volt starters and '55 12 Volt starters (and maybe '56 starters, too) had exposed solenoid armatures and are visually similar. It would be easy to confuse the two. Perhaps someone converted the car to a 12 Volt system at one time.
Alternatively, the rebuild shop could have changed the starter armature or starter field coils and, inadvertently substituted 12 Volt pieces.
What are the odds?
JimLast edited by Jim L.; July 1, 2010, 12:03 PM.Comment
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Car has been adjusted in all areas and just takes that long to start, am I too lean, floats are right, coil new points plugs set right, but then I'm not doing the mechanics. BradBrad, agree with Jim. It would be good to check the voltage drop and current draw. As other posters have pointed out; good carb settings and tune up plug points, etc. are essential to making a 6 cylinder start easy. You can increase the cable capacity by connecting a good set of jumper cables; one from the battery pos terminal to the starter and the negative to a good bare frame ground. Then see if your cranking's improved or not. If starting's improved then cables are suspect. If not it's the starter. Am repeating my previous post that an induction (slip of the pos cable to starter) amp meter like the KD 2423 current indicator, which you should be able to get from a large auto parts store would help with the diagnosis. JMTCW, Gary....
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Re: 54 Slow Cranking
Both cables on battery pass judging for correctness, is it easy to say just take starter and rebuild it from end to end and that is it, how about fan belt being too tight, engine being too tight, yeah right let's yank it and rebuild it, that ain't happening, picked up a amp thing today, dont think it is right,has starter current on bottom from 400 amps to 400 amps, Milton model 1230?
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