Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

[Clem Z.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Thomas -- here's four pics from the article. I can see the "T" handle on the shifter (on my magazine copy, with a magnifying glass), so I assume stock shifter and console boot.

You can see the those two console gauges we talked about earlier.

These are just digital pics directly off the magazine -- my scanner wouldn't do much better as the screening dots really show up on such small size originals, and the pages are wrinkled due to (past) wet storage.

the picture that shows the dash my guess is the large gauge in the middle of the dash is a magnehelic gauge and they are checking for positive pressure from the hood scoop near the carb air intake.

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Joe,Terry

Thanks again. There is picture in a previous post (2009) of the orange Zl-1 that Clem Zahrobsky worked on.The sidepipes on that car would seem to fit the description on those on this car. Does Clem or anyone else know if these were Kustom sidepipes ?

[Clem Z.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Joe,Terry

Thanks again. There is picture in a previous post (2009) of the orange Zl-1 that Clem Zahrobsky worked on.The sidepipes on that car would seem to fit the description on those on this car. Does Clem or anyone else know if these were Kustom sidepipes ?

the original were kustom but i am not sure if they were replaced

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem

Thanks for the reply. I've seen pictures of cars with Kustom sidepipes with different length tubes and wondered if they were original or owner modified. Do you remember if the Z-L-1 pipes had muffler inserts? The owner of this car said the stock inserts didn't fit.

[Dick W.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem

Thanks for the reply. I've seen pictures of cars with Kustom sidepipes with different length tubes and wondered if they were original or owner modified. Do you remember if the Z-L-1 pipes had muffler inserts? The owner of this car said the stock inserts didn't fit.

There only one insert for the Kustom's and one for Hooker's. Either he has Hooker mufflers trying to install them in Kustom headers, or he has Hooker headers trying to install Kustom mufflers in them.

To the best of my knowledge, the mufflers came with the side pipes, when you bought the kit. But then again, that has been 40 years ago. When I get time, I will look it up in the GM parts book. I still have the pages that deal with the hi po parts of that era

[Clem Z.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem

Thanks for the reply. I've seen pictures of cars with Kustom sidepipes with different length tubes and wondered if they were original or owner modified. Do you remember if the Z-L-1 pipes had muffler inserts? The owner of this car said the stock inserts didn't fit.

as far as i can remember john never had mufflers in the side pipes. remember he was a state cop back then.

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Dick,Clem,

Although it's been a while (29 years) since we discussed it, I remember the 2nd owner stating that the "stock" muffler inserts wouldn't fit. Whether he was refering to stock Kustom or stock Hooker I don't know. New question...Clem do you or anyone else know if the L-88's or Zl-1 used a full sized battery? Was there an optional small light weight Delco battery available?

[Joe L.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Dick,Clem,

Although it's been a while (29 years) since we discussed it, I remember the 2nd owner stating that the "stock" muffler inserts wouldn't fit. Whether he was refering to stock Kustom or stock Hooker I don't know. New question...Clem do you or anyone else know if the L-88's or Zl-1 used a full sized battery? Was there an optional small light weight Delco battery available?

Thomas-----


As far as I know, all L-88 and ZL-1 were supplied with a production line, standard battery. I don't think that any smaller, lightweight battery was EVER used in PRODUCTION. In fact, I don't even recall that any were available, at all, at the time.

I would think that GM's position would have been that if someone wanted a smaller, lightweight battery they could easily install that themselves if such were available in the aftermarket.

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Joe,

The battery I'm refering to was a Delco battery supposedly about the same size as one for a lawn tractor. 2nd owner at first thought battery might be from a corvair,but found the corvair battery to be larger. Do you or anyone else know if Delco made a small battery like this and application it was used for? Just to see if it really was from a lawn tractor, I tried one (lawn tractor battery) but it would not start the car.

[Clem Z.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Joe,

The battery I'm refering to was a Delco battery supposedly about the same size as one for a lawn tractor. 2nd owner at first thought battery might be from a corvair,but found the corvair battery to be larger. Do you or anyone else know if Delco made a small battery like this and application it was used for? Just to see if it really was from a lawn tractor, I tried one (lawn tractor battery) but it would not start the car.

aircraft batties are smaller than car batteries

[John H.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Joe,

The battery I'm refering to was a Delco battery supposedly about the same size as one for a lawn tractor. 2nd owner at first thought battery might be from a corvair,but found the corvair battery to be larger. Do you or anyone else know if Delco made a small battery like this and application it was used for? Just to see if it really was from a lawn tractor, I tried one (lawn tractor battery) but it would not start the car.

Tom -

I spent several years at Chevrolet Engineering in the late 60's, and hit the Experimental Shop, Motor Room, Dyno Cells, Test Car Garage, and Design Mock-Up Room just about every day. Any similarity between most of the Experimental, Test, and Press cars in those days and any production cars or engines was purely coincidental; those cars and engines were built (and re-built many times) at Chevrolet Engineering, not at assembly plants, with many experimental and outside-purchased parts that never saw a part number for evaluation and test, and many of the cars didn't even have VIN numbers.

They were born from Design Work Orders and Build Work Orders, and many were further redesigned, altered, and rebuilt at the Proving Grounds as part of the test schedules. Anything and everything could have been done to them from week to week, and only the original internal paperwork and DWO/BWO supplements can tell those stories. There was virtually no connection between any of those activities and the world of daily design and production; trying to connect them 40 years later isn't going to happen.

Some of that stuff made it out the back door, and most didn't; today's regulatory and certification environment didn't exist back in the 60's.

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem,John,

Thanks again for the help.The aircraft battery is something I hadn't thought of. Did Delco make airplane batteries? If they did, do they look like car batteries? Would an airplane battery have enough CCA's to crank an L-88? I thought that maybe the battery was something intended for a foreign car(cortina, renault,fiat?) but I don't know if Delco made batteries for those kind of cars and even if they did, would they be able to crank the larger motor? John, just how hard would it have been for someone to get something "out the back door", especially a vehicle that was designated for termination? Who would be paid (for the car)and how would the title work be done (in secret?) Do you think the individual in possesion of this vehicle,especially if they were a G.M employee, might br concerned about the possible effect on their job ( could they be fired ?) Do you think it possible any of those cars escaped their fate?

[Clem Z.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem,John,

Thanks again for the help.The aircraft battery is something I hadn't thought of. Did Delco make airplane batteries? If they did, do they look like car batteries? Would an airplane battery have enough CCA's to crank an L-88? I thought that maybe the battery was something intended for a foreign car(cortina, renault,fiat?) but I don't know if Delco made batteries for those kind of cars and even if they did, would they be able to crank the larger motor? John, just how hard would it have been for someone to get something "out the back door", especially a vehicle that was designated for termination? Who would be paid (for the car)and how would the title work be done (in secret?) Do you think the individual in possesion of this vehicle,especially if they were a G.M employee, might br concerned about the possible effect on their job ( could they be fired ?) Do you think it possible any of those cars escaped their fate?

a lot of racer used the aircraft battery to save weight but i don't remember who made them. we always started the car with a jumper battery and the aircraft battery was used just to fire the ignition. they would start the car but we did not want to take a chance of running it down before the race.

[Thomas P.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem,

Thanks again for the help. This battery may have been used the same way as the battery you referred to. All I know is that it was a small delco battery that was able to start the car on it's own until the weather got cool. New question.... do you or anyone else know if G.M (or the aftermarket) offered panels to close off the headlight openings. They were possibly made of aluminum and sealed the headlight openings in the body once the headlight assemblies were removed.

[Joe L.]

Re: Duntov's 1968 L-88 test cars

Clem,

Thanks again for the help. This battery may have been used the same way as the battery you referred to. All I know is that it was a small delco battery that was able to start the car on it's own until the weather got cool. New question.... do you or anyone else know if G.M (or the aftermarket) offered panels to close off the headlight openings. They were possibly made of aluminum and sealed the headlight openings in the body once the headlight assemblies were removed.

Thomas------


I don't know of any aluminum or similar panels that were ever available from GM to cover the headlight opening after the headlight assemblies were removed. However, GM did once offer clear "plexiglass" panels to cover "fixed" headlamps and, presumably, also removed headlamps. These were GM #3961465 and 3961466. Discontinued a LONG time ago.