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Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

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  • Joe L.
    Beyond Control Poster
    • February 1, 1988
    • 43220

    Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

    I've seen quite a few posts lately by folks that have had problems with oil drain plugs stripping out. This is a VERY common problem with oil drain plugs and there are all sorts of aftermarket "quick fixes" for it. Some work ok, some not so good. But, why does this problem happen in the first place? Well, there are quite a few reasons. One is that this plug is removed and installed a lot (hopefully) and the threads just wear out. After all, the flange in the oil pan with the female threads is a non-hardened piece. The drain plug is hardened. So, the weakest link is the threads in the flange. Of course, most of our cars are very old by now and those with original pans have lots of wear on the drain plug threads.

    Another problem according to some is over-torquing. I'm sure this does happen, but I don't think it's really all that widespread of a problem. Most folks install and torque these with an open end or box wrench and you just can't apply that much torque with such a wrench. In fact, I believe this is why GM changed about 1968 from the 7/8" head size to the 9/16 head size. A 7/8 open end or box wrench is a lot longer than a 9/16 and a lot more (and excessive) torque could be applied.

    Another problem, of course, is cross-threading. However, I don't even think that this happens as often as folks think. For one thing, oil drain plugs have a long pilot on them. This reduces the chance of cross threading, but does not completely eliminate it.

    I believe that none of the above is the biggest reason for oil drain plugs stripping out, though. I believe the biggest reason is road grit that seems to inevitably wind up on these threads. The grit, being quite abrasive, wears out the threads in the non-hardened flange plate. So, what to do about it? Well, here's what I do:

    After I remove the drain plug, I not only wipe it clean, I use a brush to clean any grit from the threads. I use a small, brass wire "toothbrush". Then, I clean the threads again with solvent.

    Next, after the oil has drained, I use a small, round brass wire brush (a rifle cleaning brush works well) to "scour" the threads in the flange plate . I rotate the brush and pull it DOWNWARD (so as not to allow any of the grit to be pushed up into the pan. Lastly, I use a pipe cleaner soaked with solvent to final clean the threads.

    When all is said-and-done, when you install the drain plug, it should go in SMOOTHLY with no "gritty" feel to it. If there is a "gritty" feel, you have not cleaned the threads well enough. Don't bother to remove it and clean some more---any damage is mostly done. Just make sure to do a more thorough job the next time.

    Yes, this procedure does take more time and you're not going to find ANY "quick lube" shop guys that are going to do it. But, it should prevent, or, at least, prolong the day of the absolutely DREADED and SICKENING feeling when the drain plug "won't tighten".
    In Appreciation of John Hinckley
  • Chuck S.
    Expired
    • April 1, 1992
    • 4668

    #2
    Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

    Originally posted by Joe Lucia (12484)
    ...The grit, being quite abrasive, wears out the threads in the non-hardened flange plate. So, what to do about it? Well, here's what I do:

    After I remove the drain plug, I not only wipe it clean, I use a brush to clean any grit from the threads. I use a small, brass wire "toothbrush". Then, I clean the threads again with solvent.

    Next, after the oil has drained, I use a small, round brass wire brush (a rifle cleaning brush works well) to "scour" the threads in the flange plate . I rotate the brush and pull it DOWNWARD (so as not to allow any of the grit to be pushed up into the pan. Lastly, I use a pipe cleaner soaked with solvent to final clean the threads.

    ...
    Joe, I think of myself as an AR OC perfectionist...I sorrowfully admit I cannot hold a candle to you.

    By your standards, I am an absolute slob. I assume that the draining oil flushes any grit out of the pan threads, wipe the outside perimeter clean and dry (already wiped clean before removal), and clean the plug threads with a paper towel covered fingernail.

    Comment

    • Joe L.
      Beyond Control Poster
      • February 1, 1988
      • 43220

      #3
      Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

      Originally posted by Chuck Sangerhausen (20817)
      Joe, I think of myself as an AR OC perfectionist...I sorrowfully admit I cannot hold a candle to you.

      By your standards, I am an absolute slob. I assume that the draining oil flushes any grit out of the pan threads, wipe the outside perimeter clean and dry (already wiped clean before removal), and clean the plug threads with a paper towel covered fingernail.
      Chuck------

      If it feels "gritty" when you thread the plug back in (and I'll bet it does), then the draining oil did not wash away all of the grit (and, I don't think it ever does).
      In Appreciation of John Hinckley

      Comment

      • Chuck S.
        Expired
        • April 1, 1992
        • 4668

        #4
        Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

        Originally posted by Joe Lucia (12484)
        Chuck------

        If it feels "gritty" when you thread the plug back in (and I'll bet it does), then the draining oil did not wash away all of the grit (and, I don't think it ever does).
        OK, I ADMIT IT. It has felt slightly gritty on some occasions when the plug was reinstalled.

        Most people wouldn't even notice that grittiness or think anything about it. As for trying to get quick lube techs and Mr. Goodwrench to take that kind of care...just be glad they've put the plug back in before dumping in fresh oil.

        But, you're right; that's why pan threads wear out. Whenever I feel the grittiness, I am aware that on this occasion I screwed up, and that it has not been helpful to my pan threads.

        For all you young guys out there...If I had only thought about this more when I was younger, such care would have paid off for me. (But, I probably would never have thought of using brass brushes or solvent on Q-tips! )

        If you're planning on keeping a car 40 years or more, remember that old adage..."If I had known I was going to live so long, I would have taken better care of my (oil pan threads)".

        It's good advice, Joe...I'm only having a little fun at your expense. HaHaHa

        Comment

        • Richard G.
          Extremely Frequent Poster
          • July 31, 1984
          • 1715

          #5
          Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

          I think it is just amateurs at work and has nothing to do with grit.
          Cross-threading would seem difficult to do. But one has to remember most of these cars were owned by young adult males and they did their own oil changes in the 50's & 60's. Tight was good and tighter better. Stripped because of over torque is likely the highest probability. But I have also seen them cross threaded. I have never seen anyone use a torque wrench on one.
          At work (none automotive but industrial) they are working on an initiative called "precision maintenance" that attempts to combat the bad practices almost all of us grew up with. Most of us would be amazed how little torque is required on these plugs it we were to compare that to what we actually put on them. Currently a typical torque for GM oil pan drain pugs is 35 lbs ft.
          Rick

          Comment

          • Joe L.
            Beyond Control Poster
            • February 1, 1988
            • 43220

            #6
            Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

            Originally posted by Richard Geier (7745)
            I think it is just amateurs at work and has nothing to do with grit.
            Cross-threading would seem difficult to do. But one has to remember most of these cars were owned by young adult males and they did their own oil changes in the 50's & 60's. Tight was good and tighter better. Stripped because of over torque is likely the highest probability. But I have also seen them cross threaded. I have never seen anyone use a torque wrench on one.
            At work (none automotive but industrial) they are working on an initiative called "precision maintenance" that attempts to combat the bad practices almost all of us grew up with. Most of us would be amazed how little torque is required on these plugs it we were to compare that to what we actually put on them. Currently a typical torque for GM oil pan drain pugs is 35 lbs ft.
            Rick
            Rick------


            The oil pan drain plug torque spec for 1963-96 Corvettes (except LT5) is 20 lb/ft. LT5 is 37 lb/ft. I think that anyone using a 9/16" open end or box wrench, as most do, would have to put a tremendous amount of "arm" to it to exceed 20 lb/ft by very much. Try installing one of these with a 9/16" open end or box wrench using normal force and then put a torque wrench on it set to 20 lb/ft and see how much additional "twist" it takes to get the plug to 20 lb/ft.
            In Appreciation of John Hinckley

            Comment

            • Tom S.
              Extremely Frequent Poster
              • March 1, 2004
              • 1087

              #7
              Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

              Joe
              This was a very good read. I agree with you and now that I think of it I have put a plug back in that felt gritty. I never thought about cleaning the threads on the pan, but I will in the future. Thanks for the good info. Tom

              Comment

              • Chuck S.
                Expired
                • April 1, 1992
                • 4668

                #8
                Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                Originally posted by Richard Geier (7745)
                ...Currently a typical torque for GM oil pan drain pugs is 35 lbs ft...
                Actually, Rick, the engine drain plug torque LS2 C6 Corvette is 18 ft-lb, but could be explained by that engine having a cast alloy pan. Regardless of the material, however, that tells me that drain plugs are quite secure at 18 ft-lb.

                In 2006, service manual showed the torque for the filter as 22 ft-lb, but I seem to remember that being reduced to 18 ft-lb in subsequent years. Both drain plug and filter are probably over torqued by most people. It's probably driven by the horrifying thought of what happens IF they loosen and fall off.

                Joe's advice to use an end wrench instead of a rachet handle and socket IS good advice...it's something an old grease monkey told me a long time ago.

                Comment

                • Richard G.
                  Extremely Frequent Poster
                  • July 31, 1984
                  • 1715

                  #9
                  Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                  Originally posted by Joe Lucia (12484)
                  Rick------


                  The oil pan drain plug torque spec for 1963-96 Corvettes (except LT5) is 20 lb/ft. LT5 is 37 lb/ft. I think that anyone using a 9/16" open end or box wrench, as most do, would have to put a tremendous amount of "arm" to it to exceed 20 lb/ft by very much. Try installing one of these with a 9/16" open end or box wrench using normal force and then put a torque wrench on it set to 20 lb/ft and see how much additional "twist" it takes to get the plug to 20 lb/ft.
                  Ever give a bolt just a little jag with a air wrench or use the long handled ratchet because that is what you had? Don't give the kids too much credit as I remember the stuff I used to do before I even owned a torque wrench. A large number of them got stripped somehow. If the dirt build up on the threads was such an issue one would think the sliding wear from the pistons would have been a bigger issue before the threads on the drain plug gave out. Just a .02 cents worth that's all.
                  Rick

                  Comment

                  • Timothy B.
                    Extremely Frequent Poster
                    • April 30, 1983
                    • 5186

                    #10
                    Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                    I have this same problem on my 67 and I purchased a new nut plate for the oil pan. When I remove the pan I am going to tighten the drain plug to the new plate and braze it in place.

                    Comments are appreciated before I do this job..

                    Comment

                    • Robert G.
                      Expired
                      • May 31, 1990
                      • 429

                      #11
                      Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                      One time as I was trying to loosen an impossibly tight drain plug, I found an orange, hard, clay like material in the threads that apparently a quick lube place had used on the plug the last time the oil had been changed. I figured they stripped the threads and used that cement like stuff to keep the plug in, but everything was ok. Any idea what material that might have been?

                      Comment

                      • Loren L.
                        Extremely Frequent Poster
                        • April 30, 1976
                        • 4104

                        #12
                        Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                        I have been present at the "ripping out" of two oil pan drains - fortunately not to one of my cars.
                        In both cases, the cause was a simple one - the guy doing the oil change was previously certified as a moron - couldn't possibly get that bolt back in without the use of his 1/2" drive air rachet using 110 psi.......

                        Comment

                        • Steven B.
                          Extremely Frequent Poster
                          • June 30, 1982
                          • 3989

                          #13
                          Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                          Originally posted by Robert Gallagher (17477)
                          One time as I was trying to loosen an impossibly tight drain plug, I found an orange, hard, clay like material in the threads that apparently a quick lube place had used on the plug the last time the oil had been changed. I figured they stripped the threads and used that cement like stuff to keep the plug in, but everything was ok. Any idea what material that might have been?
                          Robert, sounds similiar to a compound we used to use on brake lining presses when installing fresh molds and platens. We mixed it with oil and coated the threads of the bolts to prevent the bolts from backing out. After thousands of heat cycles they were a little hard to remove but it was better than dropping a one ton chunk of steel. IIRC the compound was "nicknamed" Malcom or something like that.

                          Steve

                          Comment

                          • Joe L.
                            Beyond Control Poster
                            • February 1, 1988
                            • 43220

                            #14
                            Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                            Originally posted by Timothy Barbieri (6542)
                            I have this same problem on my 67 and I purchased a new nut plate for the oil pan. When I remove the pan I am going to tighten the drain plug to the new plate and braze it in place.

                            Comments are appreciated before I do this job..
                            Tim------


                            Make sure there's enough thread length on the oil drain plug to fully engage the threads on the added-on flange plate if you do it this way. I do think it's better to do it like this, though, rather than try to remove the original flange plate. Doing so risks distorting or otherwise damaging the pan.
                            In Appreciation of John Hinckley

                            Comment

                            • Timothy B.
                              Extremely Frequent Poster
                              • April 30, 1983
                              • 5186

                              #15
                              Re: Why Oil Drain Plugs Strip Out

                              Joe,

                              To be honest I am going to try to remove the old nut plate. Is this spot welded and can it be done?

                              Comment

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