Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe,
Thank you and the others for their help

I think I will order the drive gear that will allow me to change out the rear in the future. The car was a 3.36 originally and who knows, it may well be a 3.36 again after 5 or 6 thousand miles into my trip.

I put in the 3.70 not knowing it was a 3.70 , back in 71, boy , what I did not know in my early 20's. I just went to junkyard, found a 68 vette, and took out the rear from that car and put in in mine. Never looked at the numbers on it. I just though my car needed a new rear, it probably didn't, just u-joints. but in those days, junkyards were the car part stores of today. Only found out my rear was a 3.70 last year, when restoring car and I got the rust off the rear and read the numbers. I have thought I had a 3.36 for the last 38 years.

Jack

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe or others,

Since we have the speedo problem addressed, the "real reason" I dropped the tranny is a leak from the front bearing retainer. It is not leaking from the gasket , but from the hole on bottom of bearing retainer (surrounds main gear shaft ). I assume that hole is there to prevent leaks from reaching clutch disk, so that if you have a leak the oil goes down and out of bell housing, which it does. I am taking it to be fixed, but would like to know where the oil is coming from?

Is the nut loose, or is there a seal behind bearing retaining nut?

Jack

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe or others,

Since we have the speedo problem addressed, the "real reason" I dropped the tranny is a leak from the front bearing retainer. It is not leaking from the gasket , but from the hole on bottom of bearing retainer (surrounds main gear shaft ). I assume that hole is their to prevent leaks from reaching clutch disk, so that if you have a leak the oil goes down and out of bell housing, which it does. I am taking it to be fixed, but would like to know where the oil is coming from?

Is the nut loose, or is there a seal behind bearing retaining nut?

Jack

Jack-----



There is no input shaft seal on a Muncie transmission. By design, any oil that gets by will go into the recess on the rear of the front retainer and flow down, through a little trough cast into the rear of thee retainer, to a hole in the front of the case and back into the transmission. Check to make sure this hole is not blocked. Also, check to make sure that the retainer is installed in the correct orientation so that the trough leads to the hole. Actually, due to the "asymmetric" arrangement of the 4 bearing retainer mounting holes, it's not usually possible to get this wrong. But, check anyway just to make sure no one has found a way to get it wrong.

The main culprits for leaks from the front of the transmission are wear in the bearing retainer bolt hole tappings on the front of the case and distortion of the countergear shaft bore on the front of the case. However, neither of these problems will cause oil to emanate from the hole on the bearing retainer nose.

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe,
Thank you and the others for their help

I think I will order the drive gear that will allow me to change out the rear in the future. The car was a 3.36 originally and who knows, it may well be a 3.36 again after 5 or 6 thousand miles into my trip.

I put in the 3.70 not knowing it was a 3.70 , back in 71, boy , what I did not know in my early 20's. I just went to junkyard, found a 68 vette, and took out the rear from that car and put in in mine. Never looked at the numbers on it. I just though my car needed a new rear, it probably didn't, just u-joints. but in those days, junkyards were the car part stores of today. Only found out my rear was a 3.70 last year, when restoring car and I got the rust off the rear and read the numbers. I have thought I had a 3.36 for the last 38 years.

Jack

Jack------


For anyone that likes to use their car on relatively long road trips, I think that 3.36:1 is the best rear gear ratio. This is particularly true if one also has a wide ratio transmission, as you have. I think that after a 5 or 6 thousand mile trip you will appreciate this better.

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Jack------


For anyone that likes to use their car on relatively long road trips, I think that 3.36:1 is the best rear gear ratio. This is particularly true if one also has a wide ratio transmission, as you have. I think that after a 5 or 6 thousand mile trip you will appreciate this better.

Joe,

Would you like me to stop by on my 48 state trip. I am sure your insight and experiences would add to my research on long time corvette owners .

PM with your info and I will put you on the map.

Jack

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe,

Would you like me to stop by on my 48 state trip. I am sure your insight and experiences would add to my research on long time corvette owners .

PM with your info and I will put you on the map.

Jack

Jack------

If I'm around when you're in the area, it would be nice to see you. I'll e-mail the information.

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

I just dropped off tranny at L. Stiles . A retired builder from one of Maine's few transmission rebuild shops. He will have gear out for me in a day or so. I will have him put in same, but new gear. I will take photos of old one for Joe.

He is checking front for leaks. Mentioned counter shaft can become lose in housing after many years. In any case , he will make it stop leaking and I hope , I will have a working speedometer for the first time in 40 years.

Jack

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Mentioned counter shaft can become lose in housing after many years.

Jack

Jack------


Yes, he's absolutely correct. This is what I was referring to in a previous post regarding leaks relative to the countergear orifice on the front of the main case. It tends to "elongate" after long service and results in a leak from the front of the case. Primarily, front-of-case leaks from a Muncie are due to either this problem or wear of the bearing retainer bolt tappings in the main case. Either type of problem can be repaired.

I will look forward to seeing photos of the gear that comes out.

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

How to repair counter shaft opening?

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

How to repair counter shaft opening?

Jack------


The best way is to drill it out and install a bushing. However, this is tricky because there is not much "meat" at one point between the countergear bore and the front bearing bore. Basically, this is a job for specialist, but your guy sounds like he's such a person.

Another method is to prikpunch the perimeter of the orifice in order to upset enough material to re-establish a tight fit of the countergear shaft. Then, apply silicone sealer before pressing in the countergear shaft.

A third, sometimes effective method is just to apply silicone sealer to the interface between the shaft and the case after the shaft is installed. Sometimes this works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is that you don't find out until after the transmission is installed in the car and you've driven it for awhile.

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Jack------


The best way is to drill it out and install a bushing. However, this is tricky because there is not much "meat" at one point between the countergear bore and the front bearing bore. Basically, this is a job for specialist, but your guy sounds like he's such a person.

Another method is to prikpunch the perimeter of the orifice in order to upset enough material to re-establish a tight fit of the countergear shaft. Then, apply silicone sealer before pressing in the countergear shaft.

A third, sometimes effective method is just to apply silicone sealer to the interface between the shaft and the case after the shaft is installed. Sometimes this works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is that you don't find out until after the transmission is installed in the car and you've driven it for awhile.

Tell me about that, taking out the tranny without a lift can "really" try your strength, endurance and pain threshold for on the back car fixing. (done it three times this summer and fall ).

It seems that you and Larry are on the same page. He is leaning towards the latter punch and seal or silicone seal. I will see him in a day or so and he will have opened up the patient and will know what to do next.

Thanks Joe,

I hope some of the other members who , with old original trannys, will have learned something to help in dealing with similar problems of leaks and speedometer drive issues.

Jack

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Jack------


The best way is to drill it out and install a bushing. However, this is tricky because there is not much "meat" at one point between the countergear bore and the front bearing bore. Basically, this is a job for specialist, but your guy sounds like he's such a person.

Another method is to prikpunch the perimeter of the orifice in order to upset enough material to re-establish a tight fit of the countergear shaft. Then, apply silicone sealer before pressing in the countergear shaft.

A third, sometimes effective method is just to apply silicone sealer to the interface between the shaft and the case after the shaft is installed. Sometimes this works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is that you don't find out until after the transmission is installed in the car and you've driven it for awhile.

Joe, I have a question on the counter shaft repair.

Would a locktite type of solution work, The counter shaft does not rotate, and if the housing opening is enlarged due to time and ware, would a Locktite liquid be drawn into opening space and seal it?

Jack

[Joe L.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Joe, I have a question on the counter shaft repair.

Would a locktite type of solution work, The counter shaft does not rotate, and if the housing opening is enlarged due to time and ware, would a Locktite liquid be drawn into opening space and seal it?

Jack

Jack------



Yes, that might work. However, I think I'd use the green Locktite and apply it BEFORE AND AFTER installation of the shaft.

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

Jack------



Yes, that might work. However, I think I'd use the green Locktite and apply it BEFORE AND AFTER installation of the shaft.

Joe , Did you call my guy before I got there? Laurence shows me the counter shaft and states that green locktite before and after , in addition to the silicone. (he also said that the shaft opening was in good condition) We are also going to replace front bearing retainer, it is not bad, but I only want to put the tranny back in once more.

Now the good stuff. Look at attached pictures of drive gear that was removed. Lots of dings and pickpunch marks, deviation in gear , punch missed mark and hit gear.

I hope the new gear will solve this decades old problem for me.

Thanks for your help. We will know if all was in vane, if it leaks when I drive the car again. All new seals, gaskets , retainer, please Corvette God, be kind to a poor soul.

Jack

[Jack P.]

Re: Speedo photos to Munie speedo post

The new gear has come. See photos. It is the one for 3.08 to 3.55 sold by vendors.

The small gear came off my transmission.

The large gear is the one that should have been on my transmission for the original 3.36 rear base on posts.

The small one is the one that has been eating my plastic gears for years.

1.72 ish old gear with 3.70 problems
1.82 ish proper replacement gear m-20 wide ratio with 3.70

Was the small gear used for 3.70 and above rears?

I have a 3.70 in car for last 35 or more years , with the silver 22 tooth, I should be able to use the large gear, Yes ???

Jack