67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
I am looking at a 67 400 coupe and the owner has no paperwork other than the Original Statement of Origin. The HP (SAE) states what looks like 67.8 or 67.9. Also, the statement of origin states the sprung weight of the car was 3355. Anyone out there help me discern if based on the weight or the SAE HP if this car was originally a 400 coupe? ANy help is appreciated as always. I am planning on buying a plane ticket tonight that's on hold, but can't do it until I get some advice...Thanks ARA
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
The taxable horsepower that appears on the MSO (Manufacturer's Statement of Origin) tells you what the bore of each cylinder is via the formula
# cylinders x (bore [in inches] ) squared, divided by 2.5
You can't tell whether it was a L36, L68 or L71 /L89 / L88; all you can say is that it's an engine with a bore of 4.25" and probably a 427 (assuming the stroke). Also, your SAE hp is probably 57.8 (not 67.8).
example: a 396 is 53.6 hp, derived from (8 x 4.094 x 4.094) divided by 2.5. -
Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Wayne, thanks for the reply. Does the weight of 3355 assist in discerning if the car was a 400 coupe? This was a non power option car without smog. Thanks ARAComment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Sorry Ara -- you'll have to get responses from others with equipment similar to what you describe who also have their MSO. Also mention if A/C or automatic; that will help.
The shipping weight on the MSO of a particular 396 coupe [not mine] was 3229 lbs.Comment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Ara:
Some information from my files:
Description Weight-lbs
1967 Base Coupe 3140
4-speed Transmission -5
Powerglide +1
Radio +21
390 HP engine +215 (iron manifold)
400 HP engine +151 (aluminum manifold)
435 HP engine +149 (aluminum manifold)
If I add only the extra weight of the 390 HP engine to the base weight, I get 3355 lbs.
If I assume that car had a radio and 400 HP engine, but no other options, I get 3312 lbs.
Transmission differences not included above, but are almost negligible in both cases. You can add or subtract depending on what is actually installed.
No power brakes or power steering?? They add 12 lbs (brakes) and 21 lbs (steering) each, respectively. For other options, let me know, or make an educated guess.
Appears to me to be too close to call based on what I know of the car. Since you know the car better than I do, you can revise my numbers based upon exactly what you have.
Hope this helps.
LarryComment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Thanks for the replies. The car has a 400, 4 speed, TI, headrests, no power options, red lines, rally wheels, off road exhaust and am/fm radio and vinyl interior. Hope this helps....THanks ARAComment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Sure sounds like the only way to get 3355 is with a 390 HP engine??Bill Clupper #618Comment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
I went back and checked a second source. It shows the 1967 Base Coupe weight at 3155 lbs, or 15 lbs heavier than my earlier number. Which is more correct? I don't know at this time.
If the engine option was 390 HP with 4-speed and a radio, then the weight could be either 3371 lbs or 3386 lbs depending on the base weight used. More than the 3355 lbs you mentioned in your original post.
If the engine option was 400 HP with a 4-speed and radio, then the weight could be either 3307 lbs or 3322 lbs depending on the base weight used. This is slightly less than the 3355 lbs number.
Your call......I could argue it either way. Probably is a real 400 HP car and a few extra pounds were added for some reason. Just pay close attention to the engine stamp and date codes.
LarryLast edited by Larry M.; November 4, 2009, 09:42 PM.Comment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Larry, thanks for the posts. Could headrests or off road exhaust account for the slightly lean weight you think? The casting date is Sept 21, 1966, the engien assembly is January 30, and the body is Feb 6th. The car judged TF at a regional, but the casting date is a hair out there in my opinion. The engine pad looks good, with good characters, but until I see it I won't know (and may not know it then even). I am stuck...Thanks again for the posts and valuable info. ARaComment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Paperwork that I have on my 67 327/300 4spd with A/C shows hp @ 51.Comment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
There's a lot more to look at than that paper,SAE, HP,weight etc. You need to have the owner send you a good picture of the Stamp Pad. Post that picture when you get it. OR hire an NCRS judge to check out the car with you.Comment
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Brian -- you may be referring to info on state titles, but the original MSO (from which some states took the shipping weight and SAE [taxable] hp), stated the horsepower to one decimal place. In your case, for a 327 engine that would be 51.2.
Here's an (original) example of an MSO for a 396 coupe that has a history on eBay and our DB. If you have old copies of the Restorer, Loren Lundberg has an MSO article on early (pre-BB) cars.
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Re: 67 400 decoding SAE HP help please......
Correct, my info comes from the Missouri DMV.Brian -- you may be referring to info on state titles, but the original MSO (from which some states took the shipping weight and SAE [taxable] hp), stated the horsepower to one decimal place. In your case, for a 327 engine that would be 51.2.
Here's an (original) example of an MSO for a 396 coupe that has a history on eBay and our DB. If you have old copies of the Restorer, Loren Lundberg has an MSO article on early (pre-BB) cars.
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