grinding sound from headlight bucket

[Tim D.]

I am finishing a complete restoration of my 64. I just had both of my headlight motors professional rebuilt. I installed ALL new parts on both headlight systems. I lubed everything that moves with white litheum grease. Everything was adjusted properly such as side to side gap, up/down travel etc. I installed all new wiring and switches etc. The lights worked perfectly for about 2 weeks. Now, all of a sudden, I have a horrible grinding/scraping noise coming from my passenger bucket when it is both raised and lowered. It only lasts for a second or two and then it goes away. In other words, it doesn't grind for the entire time the buckets are moving up and down. It also seems like the motor on the passenger side moves both in and out on the inner pivot shaft. I can move it with my hand out to the retaining clip and then push it back in again towards the y stop. I tried tightening the black headlight motor mounting brace with the rubber spacers because it seems like it is allowing the in and out movement. It is hard to pinpoint exactly where the noise is coming from but it almost sounds like it's coming from where the knurled knob meets the end of the headlight motor. I shot it with a squirt or two of WD-40. Is something binding or did someone not rebuild my motor correctly or what? I would like to avoid removing the motor and starting over if possible. I'm very frustrated after spending all of that time and money to get it all working correctly and now this. Any and all thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks, Tim

[Lynn H.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Tim,
While I am not an expert on this (or anything else). I do have a couple of thoughts and possible suggestions. I would think slight lateral movement of the motor itself is not alarming if you really think about how it is retained (just that little clip and the strap) to the assembly. Removing just the motor itself is really not that complicated and I would suggest rermoving the clip and screw on the strap and checking the motor itself a couple of ways. You can leave it hooked to the harness (you will need to put an external ground jumper wire on it) and having someone work the switch with the motor in your hand. Or, you can unplug the harness and test it on the bench by yourself with a battery or battery charger. Use jumper to ground case of motor to negative terminal, and touch positive jumper to one of the leads one at a time (up and down). You may be able to tell at that point if the "grinding" is coming from the motor itself. At that point you should be able to move the assembly (without the motor) to see if you have any binding action going on there. I recently ran into a similar probelm with a recently rebuilt motor, and found the problem to be the screw and lock nut that controls the end play of the armature in the motor was not adjust properly. I was able to back this screw out a hair and problem was solved.
Good luck,
Lynn

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Hi Lynn, thanks for your suggestions. I like your logic of testing the motor first (independently). Then, also checking the bucket pivot action etc for binding, after the motor is removed from the equation. This would seem to be a good way of locating where the grinding is coming from. Also, thanks for walking me through a couple of ways to test the motor. I think I have an article somewhere about tearing down and rebuilding a headlight motor. This would come in really handy so I have something to go by in case the grinding IS coming from the motor. I don't suppose you have any photos of your motor when it was taken apart etc, do you? I do find it strange that everything worked perfectly for about 2 weeks and then suddenly this grinding noise started. I really appreciate your help. Tim

[Joel T.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Tim;

I just rebuilt the motors on my 1963.. It was my first attempt at this sort of thing and an interesting process... fun actually.

I ran into two situations which may be worth looking into...

On my left motor, after the rebuild, I did bench testing. Used an extra battery I had along with one of those push button remote starter switches. The motor worked well in one direction but poorly in the other (the two separate contact at the back, each drives the motor in one direction or the other). I tried adjusting the armature range of motion... that long screw at the front of the motor with the 7/16" locking nut. I adjusted it so as to provide a tad of armature up and down range of motion.. basically made no difference. I finally applied a few drops (only 2-3) of oil (3 in 1) to the rear shaft and bearing and the problem went away.. the motor now runs great in both directions. Like night and day.

The second issue was the headlight bucket itself, left side. it was rubbing against the opening... Did not make a noise but there was enough interference so as to potentially damage the gears.. Using info from this board, I repositioned the bucket and that problem went away.

I did install the right hand motor without much bench testing... and now I have the same issue as you are describing.. My guess is that I need to oil the rear bearing on that motor as well.

As the other poster said, taking the motors out is a two minute thing... the service manual will tell you how to do it. It is a bit tricky working upside down using a mirror but it can be done... I am living proof!!

Good luck!

Joel

[Peter B.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Tim,

I have similar problems although I haven't gotten into the rebuild yet. I found the following link in a search of the Archives, a .pdf photo file that goes thru the motor rebuild. Hope this helps. I'm continually amazed at the wealth of info in the Archives, it's become my primary source for research.

Regards, Pete

http://65corvette.nonethewiser.net/technical/Headlight_Motor_Rebuild.pdf

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Joel,

Thanks so much for your reply. I love this site and the wealth of sharing knowledge etc. It is nice to know that others have had the same issue and to find out how they solved it. I will give it all a try and report back my findings. You are right about it 'almost' being fun. These cars can be so frustrating BUT when you finally get something fixed correctly it is such a FANTASTIC feeling. Thanks again and have a great day! Tim

[Joel T.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Tim,

I have similar problems although I haven't gotten into the rebuild yet. I found the following link in a search of the Archives, a .pdf photo file that goes thru the motor rebuild. Hope this helps. I'm continually amazed at the wealth of info in the Archives, it's become my primary source for research.

Regards, Pete

http://65corvette.nonethewiser.net/t...or_Rebuild.pdf

Hi Pete;

I used this set of instructions as well... The only tricky thing is the orientation of that pot metal gear. The instructions show a 180 degree rotation to avoid the worn teeth... If you test the motor you will not be able to track this orientation easily. I wound up replacing one gear just to be sure.

All in all, I am happy with the way they turned out..

Have fun!

Joel

[Joel T.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Joel,

Thanks so much for your reply. I love this site and the wealth of sharing knowledge etc. It is nice to know that others have had the same issue and to find out how they solved it. I will give it all a try and report back my findings. You are right about it 'almost' being fun. These cars can be so frustrating BUT when you finally get something fixed correctly it is such a FANTASTIC feeling. Thanks again and have a great day! Tim

Hi Tim;

Agree with your fantastic feeling point of view... I look at this as therapy!! The key to the shootin match for me is to make sure that I have blocked off sufficient time to do the job slowly and "right".. Spending a rainy Saturday in the garage working on something or another is a wonderful thing.

Have fun and holler if we can help,

Joel

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Pete,

Thanks soooooooo much for the archive link with the great photos and step by step instructions for the motor rebuild. That is the link that I ran across a couple of years ago. I could'nt remember where I saved it. I was REALLY dreading taking all of this apart again. I spent a great deal of time replacing every part of my complete headlight assemblies and getting my buckets perfectly aligned both side to side, all panels flush and the front ridge line dialed in (all without scratching my new paint job). I am a bit peeved that I paid a company to 'professionally' rebuild my motors and it seems like the passenger side motor wasn't done properly. It also doesn't give me a great deal of confidence about how the driver's side motor was done. However, all of you guys that have responded to my post have given me the motivation and courage to tear it down again and hopefully get to the bottom of it. I don't know about the rest of you Vette guys but with my restoration everything seems to be "two steps forward and one step back". I guess after you do a couple of restos you learn and are able to get it right the first time (at least more often). I will report back as soon as I tear it down and put it back together. Your help is greatly appreciated. Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Hey Joel,

You just hit the nail on the head. I am setting the world's record for the longest restoration ever.....25 years and counting. I have owned this car since I was 16. It was the first car I ever bought with my own money and I have a lot of sentimental value in it. However, I'm almost finished and it really looks great. Now, I just have to get everything working as good as it looks. I used to get frustrated because of how long this is taking, but now, I just look at it as a hobby. I really enjoy taking it slow, putting on some good music and locking myself in my garage. It is my little world and I love it! I too, think it's good therapy! It is raining all week here in St. Louis. The Cardinals laid an egg in the playoffs and the Rams stink, so I'm going to spend all week working on the car. I will report back ASAP! Thanks again, Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket

Joel,

By the way, I just saw your hometown boy, Bruce Springsteen here in STL last Sunday night. Fantastic show as usual. I've seen him about 10 times over the years. They played the entire 'Born To Run' albumn from start to finish, in order. As usual, he and the 'E-Street Band played for about 3 1/2 hours. Sorry this is off topic but I couldn't resist. Tim

[Tim D.]

Re: grinding sound from headlight bucket gone!

This follow up is long over due. Now that spring has sprung I tackled my grinding headlight motor issue. I followed everyone's advice from my previous posts and my headlight buckets, motors etc., work like they are brand spanking new! I am very pleased thanks to everyone's advice and help. As recommended, I removed the motors from the buckets and verified that the buckets were not binding and also verified the grinding was in fact coming from both motors. I tested the motors in the car, heard them grinding, then removed the motors from the car and completely rebuilt them on the bench following this link sent by Pete:

http://65corvette.nonethewiser.net/t...or_Rebuild.pdf

This was so easy, almost fun and very satisfying! Thanks to all for your help. You guys are great! Tim