WHat does the CE really stand for??

[Chris L.]

I have read many different scenarios on what the CE stands for on an engine pad and have often wondered what the REAL story was. People claim it stands for CHEVROLET ENGINE or COUNTER EXCHANGE and say it is DOCUMENTED but...... what's the correct story?? Thanks

[Terry M.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Chevrolet Engine. There is also a CT for Chevrolet Transmission.
The full story has been posted here in the past by me. It is from a 1968 TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) -- and I am not going to keyboard it again. It is way too long.

If the search facilities here don't bring it up someone else is free to enhance their keyboarding skills.

[Chris L.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Thanks Terry...I'll try to find it in the archives.

[Wayne M.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Chevrolet Engine. There is also a CT for Chevrolet Transmission.
......

Also for service, empty 4-sp transmission cases used a "CC xxxxx" stamping.

[John H.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Chris -

Here's the guts of the Service Bulletin, from our CRG (Camaro Research Group) website (www.camaros.org):

Service Engine (CE) and Transmission Coding

Quoting from the Chevrolet Dealer Service Information Bulletin, 69-I-1, dated 19 Sept, 1968:

The following system will be used to identify service engine and transmission assemblies* including replacement parts. Manufacturing plants will number each assembly as it is produce. The first letter will designate the GM division which produced the engine.

C-Chevrolet L-Oldsmobile K-Cadillac B-Buick P-Pontiac

The second letter will designate the type of unit "E" engine or "T" transmission. The number following the letter will designate the model year "9" for 1969. The last five digits specify the service replacement unit sequence number. The group of numbers to be used by Chevrolet manufacturing plants are as follows:

Engines:

Flint Motor Plant (L6 Engines) 00001 to 19999 80001 to 89999

Flint V8 Engine Plant 20000 to 49999

Tonawanda Motor Plant 50000 to 79999

Example: Number CE900175 designates Chevrolet engine - 1969 year, and the 175th unit produced for service at the Flint Motor Plant (L6).

Transmissions:

Cleveland Tranmission Plant 00001 to 14999

Toledo Tranmission Plant 15000 to 24999

Saginaw Tranmission Plant 25000 to 34999

Muncie Tranmission Plant 35000 to 44999

Hydra-Matic transmissions will be numbered with the letter "H" regardless of the G.M. Division using the transmission.

* This numbering system applies to service engine assemblies, partial engines, fitted cylinder cases, cylinder cases, transmission assemblies and transmission cases.

[Wayne M.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Chris -

Here's the guts of the Service Bulletin, from our CRG (Camaro Research Group) website (www.camaros.org):

Service Engine (CE) and Transmission Coding

Muncie Tranmission Plant 35000 to 44999 ....

Very interesting, John. In my 396, I'm currently running an OTC M22 (owner at that time worked as counterman at Nehls Chevrolet in Marshall TX). Stampings are "CT1 ---- lots of space--- 43265" Build code is P1D19C which I assume is 19th April 1971 assembly.

My question is was that block of numbers supposed to cover all service trannys from Sept '68 onward, or did the counter re-set at 35000 at the start of each model (or calendar) year ?

[John H.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

My question is was that block of numbers supposed to cover all service trannys from Sept '68 onward, or did the counter re-set at 35000 at the start of each model (or calendar) year ?

Wayne -

The research we've done (on engines, not transmissions) indicates that beginning in 1970, when the end of the originally-assigned block of numbers for a given engine plant was reached during any given calendar year, an alpha character (starting with "A") was inserted after the number that denoted the year of production, and the block of numbers started over again from the beginning.

We've documented the following "supplemental" CE block numbering conventions:

Flint Motor (L-6 engines): A00001-A19999 & A80001-A8999

Flint V-8: A2000-A49999 & A90000-A99999

Tonawanda: A50000-A79999

It may be similar for transmissions, but we hardly ever see "CT" (or "CC") transmissions, while "CE" blocks show up all the time (the 5/50 powertrain warranty program was a financial disaster out of all proportion to the original projections against which it was sold to management).

[Ray G.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Wayne -

while "CE" blocks show up all the time (the 5/50 powertrain warranty program was a financial disaster out of all proportion to the original projections against which it was sold to management).

Hello;

We believe the main reason for the abuse of the 5/50 warranty is that it was perceived as free parts and labor to cover racing losses.

Just my 2 cents.
Ray

[Anthony G.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

I'd like to jump on this thread for a second if I could to clarify my understanding of my current situation.

My 66 ragtop was built in May 66. All the numbers match on the car (heads, carb, distributor, intake, alternator, tranny, rear, even the water pump) except the block. It is a proper 327/350hp casting number, but of 1967 vintage.

The block was decked at some time in the past, so the numbers on the pad are lost to history.

I can only assume that the short block was replaced under warranty, or done so by a previous owner who I have not been able to track down. I am back to 1975, but the trail is stone cold before that.

So, since the casting number and configuration is correct, I don't lose the full 350 points, but I guess I would lose the 175 for having the wrong date. Is this correct?

If this was answered somewhere else, I apologize. I spent some time searching but could not find that answer.

[William C.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Please clarify the casting number question as the '66 and '67 castings were different casting numbers. Is it a service 1966 block with a 3858174 casting, or a service '67 block with casting 3892657?

[Anthony G.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

Whoa, maybe I'm a complete knucklehead. Let me relook those numbers when I get home. My brain housing unit led me to believe that it was the correct casting number. Perhaps the block is the right one after all.

That would make me one happy boy!

I'll get back to you as soon as I can.

[Anthony G.]

Re: WHat does the CE really stand for??

OK, I'm just a regular knucklehead.

The casting is 3892657, which I understand is correct for 67. Therefore I suppose I would lose all 350 points because either the factory put together a bad short block or the original owner blew it up.

I didn't take the time to look at the date on the block but while the car was up on the lift I reconfirmed the tranny and rear, and after I put it back down the carb, intake, and alternator.

Hmmm.