"Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

[Rich G.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Dick, That pad picture you posted looks EXACTLY like mine. I'll try to get a picture today and post it.

Rich G

[Dick W.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

The picture I posted was from a car that got full credit for the pad.

[Pat M.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Seems like people are wasting their time trying to recreate perfect broach marks for restamps. Since genuine factory restamps were crude and ugly it sounds like that would be the best way for someone to try to replicate them - so judges and others will say "no way an owner would restamp like that on purpose"!!

[Dick W.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Pat, don't think that has not been tried. I have seen several attempts at that.

[Pat M.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Wow Dick, amazing that you could tell a real factory grindout from an owner grindout. Now THAT's discerning!

[Terry B.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Would a judge at a regional or national event give credit to the owner if they had a letter from Al Grenning stating the numbers on the engine pad were authentic or are you at the discretion of that particular judge and team leader at that particular event?

Terry

[Jack H.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Many reply's focus on the Flint/Tonawanda pad stamp, but the thread asked about the St. Louis VIN stamp...

I'm pretty sure there were cases where: (1) the VIN stamp was done incorrectly, or (2) the engine failed and was replaced with a substitute from inventory.

In the case of #2, that would have created an 'orphan' of the original motor as it was VIN stamped for a car already finished and gone out the door. Once the original failed motor was repaired and ready to install in another vehicle, it would have needed a VIN stamp 'correction' to agree with its new host car.

I can't say I know what the policy was in St. Louis (probably changed over time)... It might have been to grind and re-stamp. It might have been to 'X' over the original VIN and re-stamp. And, it could have been to put the replacement VIN stamp in the 'alternate' location on the block...

But, there's one example of this practice that I do remember. It was the case of one of the earliest 396 cars that was built on the line in St. Louis and shipped to Chevrolet Engineering at the proving grounds for test purposes.

It's stamp pad had 3-4 VIN wacks. The engine was pulled for various reasons, analyzed, and subsequently re-installed in another Corvette. The sucessor car's VIN was stamped in a fresh location on the pad and the prior vehicle's VIN was oblitherated by stamping sucessive 'X' characters through it...

Now, that's NOT an example of typical factory production techniques. But, it was an example of conformance to then current GM policy.

[Dick W.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Would a judge at a regional or national event give credit to the owner if they had a letter from Al Grenning stating the numbers on the engine pad were authentic or are you at the discretion of that particular judge and team leader at that particular event?

Terry

I would expect that each pad would stand on it's own merits the day of judging

[Alan D.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

I feel your pain being the owner of a 64 factory regrind.

Had shown pictures of my pad before Nationals to some key people and they were OK with it, however took a 25 point hit despite being OKed (I believe) by Judging Chairman. Think the judge may not have liked the drop in "RX" however . . .

So went the Al Grenning route, but did with pictures - still some $$. NCRS does not have to accept Al's paper work during a show however your probability of acceptance is much higher. (hope 100%)

[Tim S.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Another one, 1971

Thank you. I have a 67 300hp that looks much the same. I have had a few "experts" claim GM NEVER would do anything like that. Who would bogus a 300hp car? I now rest easier.

Tim

[Rich G.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Attempt at a picture of my stamp pad that started this thread.

Rich G

[Rich G.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Here's the same picture "adjusted" a bit. Not sure if there is a noticeable difference

Rich

[Tom H.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

The picture I posted was from a car that got full credit for the pad.

Dick:

You say "FULL CREDIT" meaning no deduction for the pad surface ? Even if one knew it was original, wouldn't a deduction of some sort be made for the unusual "non typical" pad ?? Not doubting you, just asking the question.

[Jimmy G.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

1965 396 425 HP Verified and used by Freddie Grimm in the NCRS Judging School

[Michael W.]

Re: "Factory" Grind out on Stamp Pad

Dick:

You say "FULL CREDIT" meaning no deduction for the pad surface ? Even if one knew it was original, wouldn't a deduction of some sort be made for the unusual "non typical" pad ?? Not doubting you, just asking the question.

All three elements of the pad are all-or-nothing score items and are scored independently of each other.

In this case the VIN derivative and engine machine code are not in question, only the pad surface. IMHO, this would not take a deduct for either of two reasons:

1) the judging manual states that some evidence of the original surface must still be present. Doesn't say all.

2) factory grinds outs are well documented as having occurred during regular factory production and are therefore 'typical'.