Traction control

[Bill B.]

Re: Traction control

"Wheel hop" (the axle tramping up and down during launch) only occurs if the axle housing rotates and distorts the spring, which then loads and unloads; The Traction-Masters don't allow the housing to rotate, so there's no spring distortion or resulting "wheel hop". The design prevents any forward or rearward motion at the spring attachment to the axle housing (preventing rotation of the axle housing), while allowing free vertical motion of the axle for suspension jounce and rebound.

I have better things to do then to beat a dead horse....if you want the last word put it here _______, you won!

Bill

[Stuart F.]

Re: Traction control

Well, I go for the under axle after market bars myself as I have had a lot of experience with them on tri fives. But, I have known a number of C-1 owners racing successfully with the factory bars - one even was running a 500 inch Poncho w/six dueces and big M & H slicks - every weekend. I think on the Vettes it was concern for ground clearance, and rightly so. I have also broken the welds loose on after market bars so I know they take a pounding.

Stu Fox

[Don H.]

Re: Traction control

As usual Mike is right. I have drag raced my '60 for many years, the Lakewoods work great and are bolt on! Don H.

[Steven B.]

Re: Traction control

I can't remember the source but many years ago I saw a film (possibly 16 mm) that showed a launch of a solid axle Corvette without t-bars and showed the twist and hop. T-bars were installed (Traction Masters as I recall) below the axle and a launch filmed showing no twist and hop. It must have been about 30-35 years ago and may have been at an SAE meeting.

Has anyone seen this film?

[Michael H.]

Re: Traction control

I can't remember the source but many years ago I saw a film (possibly 16 mm) that showed a launch of a solid axle Corvette without t-bars and showed the twist and hop. T-bars were installed (Traction Masters as I recall) below the axle and a launch filmed showing no twist and hop. It must have been about 30-35 years ago and may have been at an SAE meeting.

Has anyone seen this film?

I haven't seen the film clip but their absolutely right. It's the twist, or rotation of the differential housing, that causes/creates wheel hop, just as John Hinckley explained. (axle tramp, as GM described it)
With the diff connected with a four link system (spring is one link and the traction bar is the other) the housing isn't able to rotate.

[Chuck P.]

Re: Traction control

Well remember one late evening in 1961 when I launched the old '54 (with six and 57 chevy 3 speed), I thought the rear axle would never stop hopping. What a frightful feeling. By the way, I just recently acquired a set of yellow bars taken recently from a 57 a fella was customizing with a four link. By the way, I have that old 54 again and hope to have it back on the road sometime in the future--complete with original engine, but 4 speed this time around.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Traction control

Michael;

You say the housing "isn't able to rotate"? Let me tell you, it will still try like hell which leads to broken welds as I mentioned before. Even with "Traction-Master" bars on my 57 post at Union Grove, when I ran dual Caddy Quads w/ both primaries together, the torque increase off the line was enough to cause all kinds of wheel hop which, you guessed it, broke the rotor making it look like the engine blew up. Was not a good way to impress a new girl friend. She cried.

Stu Fox

[Edward M.]

Re: Traction control

There is a pair of "NOS" traction bars for C1s on Ebay right now

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/VINTAGE-NOS-1957-CORVETTE-TRACTION-BARS-56-58-59-60-55_W0QQitemZ180351033951QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item180351033951&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318

[Stuart F.]

Re: Traction control

I forgot to mention the real reason the new girl friend and I didn't hit it off was that I was laughing because I knew what happened. She didn't think it was funny probably as she didn't know if we'd make it back home, She just didn't fit in with our car crazy crowd.

Stu Fox

[Michael H.]

Re: Traction control

Michael;

You say the housing "isn't able to rotate"?

Well, it isn't supposed to be able to rotate. I know they do though, even with Traction Masters". I had a set on my 57 FI Bel Air and I still had some wheel hop at times. (at the same drag strip)

After I installed clamps on the leaf springs, the hop pretty much disapeared. (made the car ride like a dump truck though.

I broke the tip on several rotors too. Thought I lost an engine the 1st time that happened.

[Bill M.]

Re: Traction control

Well, it isn't supposed to be able to rotate. I know they do though, even with Traction Masters". I had a set on my 57 FI Bel Air and I still had some wheel hop at times. (at the same drag strip)

The Traction Master rubber bushings have to allow for the axle to rotate relative to the frame. (If the bushings were very stiff, the bars would act like torsion bars, increase the rear roll stiffness, and significantly increase oversteer.) The rubber bushings probably allow for some axle wind-up...

After I installed clamps on the leaf springs, the hop pretty much disapeared. (made the car ride like a dump truck though.

That's what Chevy did on the 5-leaf 684 springs; 6 meaty clips on each spring. I thought my seat belt was gonna cut me in two when I had those springs on my '59 and ran over a big bump. Ouch.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Traction control

Michael;

I think the best thing I did to control the rear end on my 57 was to load it heavy, jacking the front end up and lowering the rear. It would really Plant that sucker, and it helped the ET slips as well. My only problem came about from having to use wedges to realign the drive train as the pumpkin was angled up too far. The wedges straightened out the alignment to the drive shaft, but forced it further into the tranny. The rear universal broke at well over 100 mph going through the lights. It looked like a total blow up as 4 years of dirt on the under carriage let go at once. Broke the bell housing, all the ears off the 4-speed, the starter was dangling from the wires and made my e-brake into a round hoop. Not Pretty. By chance were you there? Was about the last Sunday Drags in 1961.

Stu Fox

[Stuart F.]

Re: Traction control

As a side to wheel hop, usually when the rotors broke it was just the plastic nub on one side due to the rotation. One could usually pop the cap, snap the contact back straight and it would get you home if you didn't do a street race on the way.

Stu Fox