When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"? - NCRS Discussion Boards

When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

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  • Michael W.
    Expired
    • April 1, 1997
    • 4290

    #16
    Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

    Answer me this folks- why is putting a Bowtie (Survivor) back to together with original pieces NOT restoration?

    What's the difference between building a car for Flight judging and re-assembling a car for Bowtie?

    Comment

    • Michael N.
      Expired
      • April 30, 2001
      • 3

      #17
      Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

      Thanks again to everyone who took the time to reply. We are very comfortable doing total restorations to NCRS specs and most of our cars that get judged get Top Flight awards, but this is a unique situation. I feel that we can persuade the owner to scale back his requests in order to preserve the originality of the car.

      Comment

      • Roy S.
        Past National Judging Chairman
        • July 31, 1979
        • 1025

        #18
        Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

        Originally posted by Michael Ward (29001)
        Answer me this folks- why is putting a Bowtie (Survivor) back to together with original pieces NOT restoration?

        What's the difference between building a car for Flight judging and re-assembling a car for Bowtie?
        No difference! in my thought process.

        Comment

        • Ridge K.
          Extremely Frequent Poster
          • May 31, 2006
          • 1018

          #19
          Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

          Originally posted by Patrick Hulst (16386)
          Ridge,

          Are you implying that "survivors" are generally trailered and restored cars are generally driven? Or that you'd rather have a restored car that you can drive? I'm trying to figure out where you're coming from.

          Having been to multiple NCRS meets and Bloomington events, I would not personally ever make the generalization that the unrestored cars are trailered and the restored cars are driven. I've seen it both types of cars trailered to all types of events. And, I've seen both types driven to all types of events. Perhaps your experiences differ from mine.

          I've driven my (now) 5-Star Bowtie car many miles in attempting its awards, including driving it to the NCRS National in 2004 for its Bowtie judging. And, many of the cars I saw there were often driven. Logistics often keeps one from driving your older Corvette to an NCRS event where it is being judged, as the car isn't supposed to move from the judging field. So, I've had to trailer mine to 2 events even though I hated doing so just because I needed to be able to move my family around during a meet.

          Oh, forgot. I trailered it for the 3rd ever time to an event last year, as it had to stay indoors at Carlisle for 4 days on display. I hated trailering it that time too, and almost drove it down there.

          It won't be long and I can get it out of storage for some nice drives.

          Patrick






          If I could have afforded a large collection, I may have considered keeping it as is, for a while, but as a guy who chose to retire early in life, that is not an option. So, I choose to follow the mission of the NCRS, and restore it to the very best standards available.

          Upon completion, I will be able to hop into a pristine clean interior, fire her up, and drive her across country to whatever NCRS venue, I choose. And, I believe she will judge very well. With luck, I just may achieve the top flite award, I so highly hold in esteem.



          Good carburetion is fuelish hot air . . .

          Comment

          • Tom M.
            Expired
            • January 1, 1993
            • 716

            #20
            Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

            Originally posted by Michael Nelson (36103)
            Thanks again to everyone who took the time to reply. We are very comfortable doing total restorations to NCRS specs and most of our cars that get judged get Top Flight awards, but this is a unique situation. I feel that we can persuade the owner to scale back his requests in order to preserve the originality of the car.

            Comment

            • Patrick H.
              Beyond Control Poster
              • December 1, 1989
              • 11643

              #21
              Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

              Originally posted by Ridge Kayser (45955)
              Ridge,

              There can be a fine line between when to restore and when to leave a car alone. I'm doing that now with another 72 (I don't own it) that is a very original car but the owner wants it to foremost be driveable. So, some parts will be replaced though everything will be done to appear as close to original as possible. After all, I have another good example sitting 20 feet away that I can copy.

              I'm lucky that my 72 is as original as it is, and that it is entirely roadworthy. This other one has about the same miles as mine but 15 years in a barn have been hard on it. So, it will be a "not quite Bowtie" car but still very original and driveable.

              And, some people don't like the look of a worn part or a bit of rust. I understand that too, but always advise people who have cars with a lot of originality left in them to be careful how much replacing they do just to make parts of the car shiny again. Again, it's only original once.

              FYI, I have "street" tires and a new radiator cap that I use on my car when driving it, as well as replacement filters. It doesn't go down the road with "all" of its show parts in place.

              Patrick
              Vice-Chairman (West), Michigan Chapter NCRS
              71 "deer modified" coupe
              72 5-Star Bowtie / Duntov coupe. https://www.flickr.com/photos/124695...57649252735124
              2008 coupe
              Available stickers: Engine suffix code, exhaust tips & mufflers, shocks, AIR diverter valve broadcast code.

              Comment

              • Ridge K.
                Extremely Frequent Poster
                • May 31, 2006
                • 1018

                #22
                Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                Originally posted by Patrick Hulst (16386)
                Ridge,

                There can be a fine line between when to restore and when to leave a car alone. I'm doing that now with another 72 (I don't own it) that is a very original car but the owner wants it to foremost be driveable. So, some parts will be replaced though everything will be done to appear as close to original as possible. After all, I have another good example sitting 20 feet away that I can copy.

                I'm lucky that my 72 is as original as it is, and that it is entirely roadworthy. This other one has about the same miles as mine but 15 years in a barn have been hard on it. So, it will be a "not quite Bowtie" car but still very original and driveable.

                And, some people don't like the look of a worn part or a bit of rust. I understand that too, but always advise people who have cars with a lot of originality left in them to be careful how much replacing they do just to make parts of the car shiny again. Again, it's only original once.

                FYI, I have "street" tires and a new radiator cap that I use on my car when driving it, as well as replacement filters. It doesn't go down the road with "all" of its show parts in place.

                Patrick



                Thanks again, Ridge.
                Good carburetion is fuelish hot air . . .

                Comment

                • Reba W.
                  Very Frequent User
                  • June 30, 1985
                  • 937

                  #23
                  Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                  To add to Patrick's post about driving cars that have won mulitple awards. We have a Duntov car and a Crossed-Flags car that are going to participate in track laps around Lowe's Motor Speedway at the Carolinas Regional next month.

                  Comment

                  • Patrick H.
                    Beyond Control Poster
                    • December 1, 1989
                    • 11643

                    #24
                    Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                    Originally posted by Reba Whittington (8804)
                    To add to Patrick's post about driving cars that have won mulitple awards. We have a Duntov car and a Crossed-Flags car that are going to participate in track laps around Lowe's Motor Speedway at the Carolinas Regional next month.
                    And, we had several similar cars participate in our Proving Grounds event last year including an L-88.
                    Vice-Chairman (West), Michigan Chapter NCRS
                    71 "deer modified" coupe
                    72 5-Star Bowtie / Duntov coupe. https://www.flickr.com/photos/124695...57649252735124
                    2008 coupe
                    Available stickers: Engine suffix code, exhaust tips & mufflers, shocks, AIR diverter valve broadcast code.

                    Comment

                    • Harmon C.
                      Extremely Frequent Poster
                      • August 31, 1994
                      • 3228

                      #25
                      Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                      95% of the people who looked at my 5 star Bowtie car in my garage beside the three or four perfect frame off cars wanted to know when I was going to fix up that car to be perfect like the others.
                      Only the few people in NCRS understand what all those paint chips and flaws are all about.I like overrestored cars like most of what you see today at our meets.
                      Lyle

                      Comment

                      • Patrick H.
                        Beyond Control Poster
                        • December 1, 1989
                        • 11643

                        #26
                        Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                        Originally posted by Ridge Kayser (45955)


                        Thanks again, Ridge.
                        If I were going, I'd take you up on your offer.

                        Unfortunately the recession has hit the medical field as well, and though I planned on it for the last 2+ years I will not be attending this year's National in San Jose, CA. My next one is likely 2011 in Novi, MI.

                        Patrick
                        Vice-Chairman (West), Michigan Chapter NCRS
                        71 "deer modified" coupe
                        72 5-Star Bowtie / Duntov coupe. https://www.flickr.com/photos/124695...57649252735124
                        2008 coupe
                        Available stickers: Engine suffix code, exhaust tips & mufflers, shocks, AIR diverter valve broadcast code.

                        Comment

                        • Ridge K.
                          Extremely Frequent Poster
                          • May 31, 2006
                          • 1018

                          #27
                          Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                          Originally posted by Patrick Hulst (16386)
                          If I were going, I'd take you up on your offer.

                          Unfortunately the recession has hit the medical field as well, and though I planned on it for the last 2+ years I will not be attending this year's National in San Jose, CA. My next one is likely 2011 in Novi, MI.

                          Patrick
                          I'll look forward to meeting you at a future event. And by the way, Doc, once we get socialized medicine, the government cash will be flowing into medical offices, as quickly as they can print it up.
                          I'm taking my stimulous check, and driving to San Jose.
                          Ridge.
                          Good carburetion is fuelish hot air . . .

                          Comment

                          • Patrick H.
                            Beyond Control Poster
                            • December 1, 1989
                            • 11643

                            #28
                            Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                            Originally posted by Ridge Kayser (45955)
                            And by the way, Doc, once we get socialized medicine, the government cash will be flowing into medical offices, as quickly as they can print it up.
                            I would suggest that the statement above differs somewhat from my view. This would be based on the rate of pay I currently receive (or better yet, do't receive) from the government programs that exist today.



                            If it happens in the next few years, I already know what my next job will be - and no, it won't be in medicine.

                            Patrick
                            Vice-Chairman (West), Michigan Chapter NCRS
                            71 "deer modified" coupe
                            72 5-Star Bowtie / Duntov coupe. https://www.flickr.com/photos/124695...57649252735124
                            2008 coupe
                            Available stickers: Engine suffix code, exhaust tips & mufflers, shocks, AIR diverter valve broadcast code.

                            Comment

                            • Tom M.
                              Expired
                              • January 1, 1993
                              • 716

                              #29
                              Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                              Originally posted by Patrick Hulst (16386)
                              I would suggest that the statement above differs somewhat from my view. This would be based on the rate of pay I currently receive (or better yet, do't receive) from the government programs that exist today.



                              If it happens in the next few years, I already know what my next job will be - and no, it won't be in medicine.

                              Patrick
                              Pat, You can pour some concrete with me, http://www.marcucciconcrete.com/

                              Comment

                              • Jeff G.
                                Expired
                                • October 25, 2006
                                • 187

                                #30
                                Re: When is a "survivor" no longer a "survivor"?

                                Ridge,
                                I can't help but chime in again here.
                                What you are describing in the form of restoration with your car is very different from the first thread. He wants a "survivor", and you don't. The advice seemed straight forward for him.
                                Jeff

                                Comment

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