Garage heating and cooling

[Paul J.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Could someone recommend a book or web site for garage plans? I am interested in building a 40 X 50 garage with an office and storage on the second deck. Information for radiant floor heat would help too. I live in Colorado and this will be my first winter, we'll see what it brings.

Todd

Todd:

I looked at every picture and all the internet information that I could find. I studied the TV car show shops in detail. I designed the area for specific equipment like a wet sink and blasting cabinet, my 12' long workbench, and I reframed one wall to exactly fit my compressor. It is wired for TV and a stereo system, and has a nice compressed air supply system. I took over a year to plan my garage/shop and I still made mistakes (like my trolly and chain hoist needs to be 6' further back so I can lift steel bodys). It is still a work in progress. Don't forget the capabilities of your electric service. My advice is to take your time and think it through, look at every garage you have a chance to, and pull in ideas from others who have done this before.

Good luck and have fun, I sure did.

Paul

[Patrick H.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Maybe a ceiling mounted electric heater is the best option. Hopefully no flames (unless there is a serious problem!). Probably not as efficient as gas heat, but I don't have gas to the garage right now anyway. Here's a heater I am considering:

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...t_6970_595_595

It's a bit undersized for my application, but I can wear warm clothes to make up the difference. I don't think I want to wire up more than 240 V 30 A service.

Joe

I got one free several years ago and used it.
It sucks up electricity and doesn't get that warm.
When the fan broke I did not replace it with a similar model.

I now have one similar to this:



Works great. The only drawback is that if you put it on high for a while you'll have plenty of humidity. Warm the garage up slowly and you're fine.

Patrick

[Tom K.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Joe, I have Wayne Dalton insulated doors on my garages and I think they are the best insulated door out there. When the time comes to do something with the wood door I would be glad to show them to you. We can talk about them at the next meeting if you are there.
Tom

[Tom R.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

The first picture is the inside of my steel door. John has the really nice cored doors but it's colder where he lives. The foam on the back of the door goes under the bracing and has a nice vinyl coating on it. I will probably add another inch of foam glued directly onto the existing foam in the future.

John & Paul

I have something like that polymer but I don't think its as wide. How did you both treat the bottom beside the standard rubber strip that accompanies the garage door?

[Joe R.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Joe, I have Wayne Dalton insulated doors on my garages and I think they are the best insulated door out there. When the time comes to do something with the wood door I would be glad to show them to you. We can talk about them at the next meeting if you are there.
Tom

Tom,

Good to hear from you. I'm hoping to be at the next meeting. Maybe I could stop by and get some ideas sometime. When do you head south?

Joe

[Joe R.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

I got one free several years ago and used it.
It sucks up electricity and doesn't get that warm.
When the fan broke I did not replace it with a similar model.

I now have one similar to this:



Works great. The only drawback is that if you put it on high for a while you'll have plenty of humidity. Warm the garage up slowly and you're fine.

Patrick

Patrick,

It sounds like I should rethink my heater purchase. Do you have any info on yours like manufacturer and part number?

Joe

[Paul J.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Tom:

I think you're talking about the rubber seal on the bottom of the door. I've seen two types, one which is hollow and collapses against the floor with weight of the door, and the other is a flap either on a metal strip or by itself which protrudes from the front of the door and lies flush on the floor. I have the hollow type, as this is commonly used on steel doors. The last wooden door that I had had the flap type.

The hollow type only protrudes a little when the door is down, and forms around the seal on the side. So we always run the side seal to the floor. With the flap type bottom seal I would still run the side seal to the floor, but I would the notch the flap on the bottom seal so it doesn't interfer with the side seal flap. You could also turn the bottom flap around, although I've never seen anyone do this.

Paul

[Paul J.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Patrick:

Is that a gas unit, and if so, do you have any ventilation for the combustion gases. Also, how does this unit mount?

Paul

[Robert B.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

I could use a little advice on heating and air conditioning for my garage. We have moved in recently. The garage is brick, two car, detached. It is not insulated. It has electric service and a garage door (wooden) opener. That's about all it has at present. I am planning to frame the walls and ceiling, add circuits / outlets, insulate, drywall, paint, add lighting and put epoxy on the floor. I would also like to heat and cool it. We live in St. Louis. For those who were here for the convention, you know what summer is like here, hot and muggy! Winter is cold, too, it gets down near zero at least once a year. Any ideas would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Joe

I just ordered a Dayton G73, 17,000 BTU electric heater and it should arrive tomorrow. I have a 3 car garage with a 10'6" ceiling height. I went with electric because I didn't want any open flame in my garage (even in a furnace), I don't want to plumb for gas, I didn't want to vent the unit to the outside and I was concerned about both carbon monoxide and moisture condensing on everything in the garage. I have an electrician coming over when the unit is in to install a 240v, 30 amp feed for $325. The heater was $284 with a promotion and free shipping.

My garage is sheet rocked and insulated but I plan on adding foamboard insulation to the steel doors as other have.

http://www.air-n-water.com/product/G73.html

[Paul J.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Robert:

I've been looking at the same heater that Joe is, but I'm concerned that 17,000 btus is not enough. Are you sure that it will be enough? I agree that electric is best for a garage. I wired a 220v outlet near the ceiling over my workbench when I built my shop. Gas is "toasty" warm, but I have a friend who had some problems with a gas heater.

Paul

[Robert B.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Robert:

I've been looking at the same heater that Joe is, but I'm concerned that 17,000 btus is not enough. Are you sure that it will be enough? I agree that electric is best for a garage. I wired a 220v outlet near the ceiling over my workbench when I built my shop. Gas is "toasty" warm, but I have a friend who had some problems with a gas heater.

Paul

17,000 should be enough if you have insulation on all 5 walls (ceiling, garage doors, walls, etc. Also, no leaks at the garage door floor and sides to blow cold air in. Having a fan to move the warm air from the heater to far away parts of the garage helps. You only get the full 17,000 btu if you have a full 240v @ 20 amps. I had the service checked coming into the house and I have 248v at the meter so I am o.k. You can get the 208 model that puts out 17,000 at 208v and 25 amps.

Of course the delta between the outside air and the air in the garage that you are comfortable with is a factor to consider. If it's below zero outside and you want your garage to be 80* it might be a stretch.

I plan on installing the heater over the weekend so I'll let you know how it works out.

[Brian K.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

For some reason my pictures came out wrong so bear with me.

The second picture shows how the seal sets on the door. I'm painting the house but the dirt makes it easier to see. John's house is too clean, but you can see from his picture how well the seal blends in.

The next picture shows the seal from the inside (on the right). I put this in to show that the seal stands proud of the wall by about 1/4", although it's hard to see. This is so the seal lies tight against the door.

The next picture is the seal material. It is a hard polymer with a soft polymer flap heat welded to it. It nails on and is paintable. I've purchased this at my local builder's supply house and at Lowe's, which means that you should also be able to find it at Home Depot. I've found it in 8' and 10' lengths, but I would'nt be surprised if they sell 12' pieces also.

The first picture is the inside of my steel door. John has the really nice cored doors but it's colder where he lives. The foam on the back of the door goes under the bracing and has a nice vinyl coating on it. I will probably add another inch of foam glued directly onto the existing foam in the future.

I had those but these work better: http://www.sealeze.com/sectional.htm

[Robert B.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Robert:

I've been looking at the same heater that Joe is, but I'm concerned that 17,000 btus is not enough. Are you sure that it will be enough? I agree that electric is best for a garage. I wired a 220v outlet near the ceiling over my workbench when I built my shop. Gas is "toasty" warm, but I have a friend who had some problems with a gas heater.

Paul

Here is a place to calculate the BTU's needed. According to this you would need two 5000 watt 17,067 BTU/hr heaters to warm a three car garage with a 10'6" ceiling 40*F over ambient.

Since a full length of my house is also the garage wall I'm counting on some leakage from the house. My garage is always 10*F warmer in the winter than it is outside.

http://www.heatershop.com/btu_calculator.htm

[Wayne K.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

Has anyone used or know if gas radiant heating mounted on the ceiling like I've seen in commercial garages would be a good way to go?

[Grant M.]

Re: Garage heating and cooling

I have an 800 Sq Ft three-car garage with insulated walls, ceiling and doors, plus insulation under the concrete floor as per John Hinckley's specs for his garage. The ceiling is 12 ft high and I live in Ottawa (Canada) where the winter temperatures frequently get down to 0 degrees F or lower for sometimes days at a time. I told my contractor that I wanted to maintain the space at 40 degrees F or so all the time to permit chemical storage etc, with the ability to get it up to 60-65 working temperature. Next Monday my heating contractor will be installing a Lennox gas-fired/separated combustion (no open flame issue to deal with when painting etc) space heater, mid-efficiency with 85,000 BTUs input and 60,000 BTU output, which he says will do the job.

I'll let you know how it works later this winter when it gets cold up here....

grant