1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

[Kirk M.]

I have an April build 1967 327/300hp convertible with PS, PB and AC. I would like to take it back to the "original" ralley wheels. I base this on the fact that my spare tire tub which appears original is "bolted" for ralley wheels and not the bolt-ons that are currently on the car. From a purist standpoint, I was interested in acquiring the correct ralley wheels and mounting some whitewalls (my car in Ermine White and think it would look cool). So, I've read innumerable threads on ralley wheels and really am not sure what EXACTLY I should be looking for. My guess is:

15 X 6 DC or DG large marked. Either no date or dated B/C/D 7?

Am I correct? Anything else I should look for? Correct bolt pattern for mounting???

I would also like to use the original bias tires rather than the radials I have on it now. My thoughts are, if I take a long road trip (Route 66), I will re-mount the radial bolt-ons and burn some road up. For local shows and judging, I will use the ralleys. Thoughts? Thanks.

Kirk

[Wayne K.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

For driving the radials are a better choice. As far as what they would look like on your ermine white car I'm including a couple photos of my car with radials & ralley wheels.

[Mike M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Kirk,
the longer bolts in your spare lid were to accomodate the wider redline tire option. The bolt length has no relationship to the wheels.
Regarding the wheel code, see the earlier post below. It appears from all that has been said that you will be safest with the Large "DC' stamping.
Dates on all original '67 Ralley's regardless of code will only be stamped on the inside of the rim, hidden by the tire. No dates appeared near the valve stem as in later years.
HaND

[Kirk M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

I think it looks awesome. Thanks for the pic.

For driving the radials are a better choice. As far as what they would look like on your ermine white car I'm including a couple photos of my car with radials & ralley wheels.

[Kirk M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Kirk,
the longer bolts in your spare lid were to accomodate the wider redline tire option. The bolt length has no relationship to the wheels.
Regarding the wheel code, see the earlier post below. It appears from all that has been said that you will be safest with the Large "DC' stamping.
Dates on all original '67 Ralley's regardless of code will only be stamped on the inside of the rim, hidden by the tire. No dates appeared near the valve stem as in later years.
HaND

Sometimes it doesn't quite come out like I meant, but that is what I meant. I am currently running redlines on my bolt-ons, so I kinda connected the two. However, now that you say that I think I may understand it better - so, you could have bolt-ons with say blackwalls or whitewalls and still fit in the standard bolt spare tire carrier. Is that correct??

Which poses an interesting thought for just changing the tire to whitewall instead of buying an extra set of rims. Having said that though, I can't tell you how many comments I've gotten on the redlines with the bolt-ons. So, maybe I keep heading in the direction I was going.

One more thing - even though I will know - I guess I could get 15X6's with BIG DC and any date since they aren't visible - or is the big DC only a 67 stamping?

[Kirk M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Can someone walk me (gently) through the 15 X 6, 15 X 7 and 15 X 8 differences. Is it just a sequentially larger series of rims that hold larger tires? Will all large DC coded ralleys have the correct offset to mount properly? And yes, finally, what is being "offset" - the rim around the brake discs, axel hub? Remember, this forum is for learning even if the questions seem "stupid" (ie: be kind). Thanks.

Kirk

[Rick S.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

When I bought my 67, it had repo bolt-on wheels with blackwalls but the car came with, I believe to be, original large DC rallye wheels. I am the 4th owner and the original owner sent me a photo shortly after he took delivery. I put the redlines on the rallye wheels and really like the look, no matter what the paint color happens to be.

[John H.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Can someone walk me (gently) through the 15 X 6, 15 X 7 and 15 X 8 differences. Is it just a sequentially larger series of rims that hold larger tires? Will all large DC coded ralleys have the correct offset to mount properly? And yes, finally, what is being "offset" - the rim around the brake discs, axel hub? Remember, this forum is for learning even if the questions seem "stupid" (ie: be kind). Thanks.

Kirk

Kirk -

67's used 6", '68 used 7", and '69-'82 used 8" wide rims (the dimension across the rim, from inside-to-inside of the rim flanges).

All "DC"-stamped rims will have the same offset.

"Offset" is the term the OEM's use, which is the dimension between the plane of the centerline of the rim and the plane of the wheel mounting surface; if the mounting surface plane is outboard of the plane of the rim centerline, the wheel has positive offset - if the mounting surface plane is inboard of the plane of the rim centerline, the wheel has negative offset. It's not convenient to measure.

The aftermarket uses the term "backspacing", which is measured by placing the wheel front-side-down on a flat surface, putting a straightedge across the rim, and measuring from there down to the wheel mounting surface.

Here's a diagram that shows wheel measurements.

[Kirk M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Thanks John, as always your explanations are succinct and to the point and done in a "gentlemanly" manner. Something a person who is genuinely interested in learning all he can about his car, like myself, really appreciates. Thanks again.

Kirk

[Mike M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Hi kirk
I'm with you on this one. (That is, if I think what I thought I heard you say in what you were thinking is what I thought you meant.)
I try to stick to the facts on this board, but, once in a while a surpressed opinion just bubbles up. My apologies in advance.
'67's were meant to have Ralleys and White Walls, period.
The bolt-ons are dull and detract from that cool look.
I was never enamored with Redlines, because the repops are a dull red.
The originals were an orangish red and did really stand out.
OK, I finished with the soapbox, someone elses turn.
HaND

[Patrick T.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Here is a picture of the "DC" near the valve stem. PT

[Kevin M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Rick,

Your original picture of the engine compartment is great! Have you ever had the intake manifold off? there is some debate as to the finish of the bolts. If you know the original finish would you post it. Crap that picture is in another post... you can email the answer don't wat to hijack this thread.

KM



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[Joe R.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Hi Kirk:

I have two sets of tires and wheels for my car:

1) Original Ralley wheels with correct reproduction redline bias ply tires.
2) Repro bolt-ons with modern redline radials

My car is red, so I like the look of the redlines. I use combination #1 for judging and combination #2 for driving.

The point that I would like to emphasize is that I LOVE driving my car with the radials, and I HATE driving it with the repro bias plies. The bias ply tires are rather "squirrely," especially at highway speeds.

I'm told that the optimal wheel alignment for radials is different than for bias plies, and that part of what I experience may be because the car is set up for radials. Some people say that if the alignment is optimized for bias ply tires, the cars drive okay.

However, I think most would agree that for driving, radials are the way to go. Based on my experience with my car, I would advise against using bias ply tires for anything but judging. The radials are just so much more fun.

[Kirk M.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Thanks Joe. Once again good information that I can make a better judgement call on. At least my idea of having two sets of tires - one for judging and one for driving isn't as crazy as my wife says it is - oh wait a minute - that's right you guys are all crazy like me! So, does that mean my wife's right - naw!

Anyway, never thought about the alignment issue between bias and radials, but now thanks to your post it is something I can look out for. I certainly know that my redline radials tear up the road and some of the mountain driving in Virginia and West Virginia that I have done will attest to that. Never had a problem with handing whether it's 90+ down the interstate of 40+ twisting through the mountains. Not sure I want to test the same theory with the bias ply tires.

I really do hope my car looks as cool as I think it will with whitewalls on ralleys! Thanks again everybody.

Kirk

[Joe R.]

Re: 1967 Ralley Wheels - Here We Go Again

Hi Kirk:

I suggest that you gather more information and plan carefully before you take the plunge on tires and/or wheels.

A good overall compromise is to use a single set of tires and wheels for both driving and judging. There are nice radial tires available that will get only a small deduction in NCRS judging. A couple suppliers to consider are Diamondback Classics and Coker Tire. Study the section on tires in Section 4 of the Judging Reference Manual, ask a lot of questions, and check the archives before you decide what tires to buy.

Another important consideration is whether the bolt-on wheels you presently have are original GM wheels or older reproductions. If they are original GM wheels they are worth about $10,000 and are highly coveted. If they are older reproductions they will get an originality deduction in NCRS judging.

If it turns out that you presently have reproduction bolt-ons and completely incorrect tires, you have a long way to go if you want to maximize your score in NCRS judging. To purchase and restore a set of original Ralley wheels, trim rings, and center caps will likely cost more than $1500. If you then purchase a set of five reproduction bias ply tires, you will be out another $1000.

What you will end up with is a gorgeous set of Ralley wheels and tires that judge well but drive poorly. Chances are that you will end up getting another set of modern radials, mounting them on a second set of wheels, and using them for 99.9% of the time (whenever your car is not being judged).

This two-complete-sets-of-wheels-and-tires approach is used by a lot of the hard core NCRS folks who want to maximize judging points, but it is an expensive way to go. I used this approach, but I'm not sure I would do it again.



So, if I had it to do over again, I might have chosen some sort of compromise approach where I use the same set of radial tires and correct wheels for both driving and judging. I would lose a few more points in NCRS judging, but the money saved could be applied to other aspects of the restoration that would buy back the points lost on tires.