1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

[Dominic P.]

Need some help in seeking out where to find a rubber insulator for a 1966 telescopic steering rag joint.

Any help on where to buy the rubber insulator is appreciated!

Also any photos available showing the correct rubber insulator for this application, is also appreciated!

Thanks,
DP

[Joe L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Need some help in seeking out where to find a rubber insulator for a 1966 telescopic steering rag joint.

Any help on where to buy the rubber insulator is appreciated!

Also any photos available showing the correct rubber insulator for this application, is also appreciated!

Thanks,
DP

Dominic----


Just about any of the Corvette vendors should have the coupler repair kit you seek. I know that Dr. Rebuild carries it. If installed correctly, this kit will provide for a 100% functional coupler. However, it won't end up being 100% correct in configuration. You can come much closer to the latter by installing a new reproduction coupler. Dr. Rebuild and other vendors have these, too. Although considerably more expensive, if it were me, I'd go with the new coupler assembly.

[Jim S.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
At risk of highjacking this thread. I have had a running battle with numerous suppliers that list a flexible coupling assembly rebuild "kit". My main concern is that common bolts rather than shoulder bolts are supplied in the kits to attach the flex coupling to the steering column flange. The bolts in the OEM flexible coupling assembly were special shoulder bolts.

It is common engineering knowledge that you never try to make a bolted connection depending upon squeezing a rubber element. The bolts supplied in the kit could result in a potentially dangerous connection.

I have written many letters to numerous Corvette vendors outlining this problem over the past year. A few wrote back that they were taking it up with their supplier(s). No one has ever gotten back with me to say that parts in the kits have been corrected.

At least from the pictures of the rebuild kit hardware that are on several vendor websights and in their catalogues, it doesn't seem that the hardware has been modified.

One other concern is that the kits have no means of providing an electrical ground path across the flexible coupling assembly. OEM flexible coupling assemblies had ground wires, ground strips, or a screen mesh molded into the fact of the rubber coupling disc.
Jim

[Joe L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
At risk of highjacking this thread. I have had a running battle with numerous suppliers that list a flexible coupling assembly rebuild "kit". My main concern is that common bolts rather than shoulder bolts are supplied in the kits to attach the flex coupling to the steering column flange. The bolts in the OEM flexible coupling assembly were special shoulder bolts.

It is common engineering knowledge that you never try to make a bolted connection depending upon squeezing a rubber element. The bolts supplied in the kit could result in a potentially dangerous connection.

I have written many letters to numerous Corvette vendors outlining this problem over the past year. A few wrote back that they were taking it up with their supplier(s). No one has ever gotten back with me to say that parts in the kits have been corrected.

At least from the pictures of the rebuild kit hardware that are on several vendor websights and in their catalogues, it doesn't seem that the hardware has been modified.

One other concern is that the kits have no means of providing an electrical ground path across the flexible coupling assembly. OEM flexible coupling assemblies had ground wires, ground strips, or a screen mesh molded into the fact of the rubber coupling disc.
Jim

Jim-----


I agree. If I were installing one of these rebuild kits, I would try to use as much of the existing hardware as I could. I should have mentioned that in my previous post. However, I don't think I'll ever be installing one since most of the couplers are still available from GM and, regardless, I have enough NOS examples "in stock" to last me until I'm about 500 years old. To me, steering is too important to take a chance on using one of these kits.

The reason that I suggest the kit, at all, is because there are folks that prefer to maintain as much of the original components on the car as possible. So, if one uses one of these kits, one gets to keep the original coupling castings and stampings which may have "nuances" of detail folks want to preserve. Still, as I mentioned, when one of the kits is used, the result will not be 100% correct in configuration, anyway. The kits are not for me, though; I wouldn't use one unless there was absolutely no alternative available. And, I've seen to it that doesn't happen to me. Unless, of course, I live to be older than 500. Then, I might run out.

[Jim S.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
There are now off-shore manufactured flexible coupling assemblies. Early batches arrived with the flat in the gear flange (bow tie) machined 180 degrees out of position. I guess you would call it a mirror image! People started reporting that their steering wheels were upside down when they completed their installation.

I wrote to Corvette vendors on that one too!

An easy way to detect a non-Saginaw Steering Gear manufactured assembly is the way the stop pins are attached to the bow tie flange. You can see in the above picture that method of attaching the stop pins is by means of a cold staking operation. The pins are counterbored on the end and staked. It is a relatively secure manufacturing operation, but it is not the way Saginaw did it.

Saginaw always used a hot riveting operation. The end of the pin was heated cherry red and the end upset into a button. That is why people find that when they grind the head off they find that they still have to drive the pin out of the flange with a punch. Saginaw took a lot of care in trying to make the assembly as robust and safe as possible. We at Saginaw always called those parts - rivets because of the operation. I have been calling them stop pins because if is easier for non-engineering people to understand a name for the part by its function.

Jim

[Dominic P.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Jim/Joe,
Thanks for the quick responce......

I will try Dr. Rebuild and go from there.

[Roberto L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
There are now off-shore manufactured flexible coupling assemblies. Early batches arrived with the flat in the gear flange (bow tie) machined 180 degrees out of position. I guess you would call it a mirror image! People started reporting that their steering wheels were upside down when they completed their installation.

Hello Jim, thanks for all your valuable information in different boards. Recently I ordered a flex coupling like the one you show in the post above, thinking it was the correct one... I prefered the complete flange instead of the rebuild kit for the reasons you and Joe mentioned, but unfortunately I discovered the flat in the wrong position.

Apparently I should installed it in reverse (pinch bolt head down) with no other problem. I'm thinking as an alternative way, to modify the flat and install it the right way, as the flat section seems very thin. I will use the original pinch bolt of my present coupling and the other bolts as well.

Best regards

[Jim S.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

If you have an OEM style 1966 manual gear, the input shaft will not have a flat. Therefore the flexible coupling that you have just purchased will not assemble to the shaft.

I am not familiar with the 1966 style flexible coupling assemblies. When I go to the Zip Store they have pictures of two different flex coupling assemblies (one for the 1963-66 standard column and another for the telescoping column.) Both come as full assemblies (upper and lower flanges already riveted or bolted together.) They are very different from the standardized flexible couplings that I have posted.

Before 1967 Saginaw manufactured only the adjustable steering columns. The car (and truck) divisions designed and purchased their own steering components. There were many different designs of flexible couplings, steering columns, etc.

I became the supervisor of the Saginaw Steering Gear flexible coupling product engineering group in 1970. By that time, Saginaw had 100% of the GM steering column business and was able to standardize a great number of steering components. The flex coupling stop pins were made the same size and shape. Attaching bolts were two different sizes (5/16-24 and 3/8-24).

Jim

[Roberto L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

If you have an OEM style 1966 manual gear, the input shaft will not have a flat. Therefore the flexible coupling that you have just purchased will not assemble to the shaft.

I am not familiar with the 1966 style flexible coupling assemblies. When I go to the Zip Store they have pictures of two different flex coupling assemblies (one for the 1963-66 standard column and another for the telescoping column.) Both come as full assemblies (upper and lower flanges already riveted or bolted together.) They are very different from the standardized flexible couplings that I have posted.

Before 1967 Saginaw manufactured only the adjustable steering columns. The car (and truck) divisions designed and purchased their own steering components. There were many different designs of flexible couplings, steering columns, etc.

I became the supervisor of the Saginaw Steering Gear flexible coupling product engineering group in 1970. By that time, Saginaw had 100% of the GM steering column business and was able to standardize a great number of steering components. The flex coupling stop pins were made the same size and shape. Attaching bolts were two different sizes (5/16-24 and 3/8-24).

Jim

Jim, in my case (sorry for disturbing the thread) I have a 70 and got a 70 coupling identical to the pictured you showed in a previous post. The vendor offered it for 70 cars up, actually for late 69 up (cars with flat in the input steering shaft). It seems correct regarding size, stop pins are the same size and bolts are correct with shoulders, etc, but the flat is in the wrong position, so I suspect I could install it in reverse, upside down, without problem. To be honest I'm very upset with this kind of parts, it is very difficult to get parts living outside USA and I trusted the vendor...

[Jim S.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Roberto,
With the gear on center, you should be able to install the pictured flex coupling upside down (pinch bolt inboard with its head pointing down. I would also check to determine if the attaching bolts are shoulder bolts. Or possibly do they have some type of bushing that will serve as a shoulder. Otherwise remove and use your original shoulder bolts.

Lastly, with the gear on center and the flex coupling attached, the larger 3/8-24 shoulder bolt should be at the 9 o'clock position (looking at the gear and coupling assembly from the driver position). The 5/16-24 bolt should be at 3 o'clock.

Jim

[Joe L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

If you have an OEM style 1966 manual gear, the input shaft will not have a flat. Therefore the flexible coupling that you have just purchased will not assemble to the shaft.

I am not familiar with the 1966 style flexible coupling assemblies. When I go to the Zip Store they have pictures of two different flex coupling assemblies (one for the 1963-66 standard column and another for the telescoping column.) Both come as full assemblies (upper and lower flanges already riveted or bolted together.) They are very different from the standardized flexible couplings that I have posted.

Before 1967 Saginaw manufactured only the adjustable steering columns. The car (and truck) divisions designed and purchased their own steering components. There were many different designs of flexible couplings, steering columns, etc.

I became the supervisor of the Saginaw Steering Gear flexible coupling product engineering group in 1970. By that time, Saginaw had 100% of the GM steering column business and was able to standardize a great number of steering components. The flex coupling stop pins were made the same size and shape. Attaching bolts were two different sizes (5/16-24 and 3/8-24).

Jim

Jim-----


The 67-L69 do not have a flat, either. This coupling was GM #5699250 for 1967-68 and became GM #7806391 for 1969 (and also SERVICED 67-68 after January, 1970).

In VERY late 1969 the coupling with the flat began to be used on Corvettes. I don't know just when this happened but I do know that my original owner 1969, built in mid-September, 1969, used the coupling without the flat. So, the new design went into use sometime between then and December 31, 1969 when 1969 production ended for Corvettes. I believe the new-style steering box and coupling were probably intended for the 1970 model year but went into use for very late 1969's since production went so late that year.

The L69-71 coupling was GM #7808553. That became GM #7813351 for 1972-74 and L69-71 SERVICE. GM #7818568 replaced the latter for 1975-82 and L69-74 SERVICE.

The 1963-L69 wormshaft (i.e. no flat on the splines) was GM #5677658. The complete worm nut and shaft assembly was GM #5677650.

The L69-82 wormshaft assembly (i.e. with flat spot on splines) was last available as GM #7812942. There may have been predecessor part numbers but I have not been able to come up with them. I don't think that this piece was ever available as a shaft-only; just the complete worm nut and shaft assembly.

By the way, the 1965-67 telescopic column coupler was GM #5692974. I've got one of these around here, but I've forgotten how it differs from the non-tele coupler.

[Jim S.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
I have most of the 1967 -82 flexible coupling assembly drawings that you reference. It would make a good article to track the differences through the years and part numbers. I am afraid that it will be no small task however.

I do not have the 1965-66 flex cplg drawings for the standard and telescoping columns. You mentioned that the telescoping flex cplg asm is 5692974. Can you provide the part number of the standard flex cplg assembly? I will try to get the drawings.

Jim

PS: Sorry about highjacking this thread.

[Joe L.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Joe,
I have most of the 1967 -82 flexible coupling assembly drawings that you reference. It would make a good article to track the differences through the years and part numbers. I am afraid that it will be no small task however.

I do not have the 1965-66 flex cplg drawings for the standard and telescoping columns. You mentioned that the telescoping flex cplg asm is 5692974. Can you provide the part number of the standard flex cplg assembly? I will try to get the drawings.

Jim

PS: Sorry about highjacking this thread.

Jim----

Yes, the 63-66 coupling assembly was GM #5690809. The lower portion of the assembly as a separate part was GM #5691327.

[Dominic P.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

Folks,
FYI,
Did try Dr. Rebuild, but they said they could not help on supplying the rubber insulator ( for a 1966 telescopic steering application)

Any further advise on where to locate this item is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Dominic

[Brian K.]

Re: 1966 Rag Joint Rubber Insulator

You might want to try "N-36 restorations" since they specialize in telescopic columns.