The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

[David M.]

shouldn't

[David H.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Form Etiquette

David

We're still working on civility.

David



Top of Forum Discussion we do have an etiquette section. Your comments however are applicable to all forums - Fixed? What was your fix?

Perhaps an expanded "For Sale" section!

Forum: Technical Discussion

In order to foster an atmosphere of mutual respect and professionalism, the NCRS requests
all members adhere to the following Discussion Forum Standards.
1. Terms of Use
2. Etiquette
3. No Advertising
4. Orphan Documents and Stamped Parts

[David M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Form Etiquette

Thanks Dave, there it is. How did I miss it...refrigerator eyes. Still getting used to that new header.

It could use a small tune up. A line or two. By etiquette I'm leaning toward structure and common sense posting, above and beyond being nice and playing by the rules. I think the ideas I posted above could be captured in one line....unlike I'm able to do.lol

(Sticky) Stuck to the top of the normal post bar it would force/nudge/guide new members to read it before their first post???

Just an idea to improve an already amazing site.
Id be happy to assist. If not Ill let it go.

Dave

[David H.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Form Etiquette

Thanks Dave, there it is. How did I miss it...refrigerator eyes. Still getting used to that new header.

It could use a small tune up. A line or two. By etiquette I'm leaning toward structure and common sense posting, above and beyond being nice and playing by the rules. I think the ideas I posted above could be captured in one line....unlike I'm able to do.lol

(Sticky) Stuck to the top of the normal post bar it would force/nudge/guide new members to read it before their first post???

Just an idea to improve an already amazing site.
Id be happy to assist. If not Ill let it go.

Dave

Dave

Your original post was spot on. Very helpful if OP would close a thread with what worked/what didn't. CF, Digital C, CAC all share this thread "remains open" characteristicas well. Same with a new "somewhat related" question spliced into an on-going thread. That person's question is often buried as unseen, when they should have just started a new thread.

Some very knowledgeable folks on this forum. I expect they get frustrated answering the same question over-and-over. We have a stickey "Database of Restoration Documents" that consolidated a remarkable amount of information - question if those members that don't frequent TB even know it exists.

Personally, would like to see a consolidation of Joe Lucia's posts on part numbers - great information.

Dave

[Richard M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Form Etiquette

Dave, et al,

Your thoughts are for good cause. As far as a Sticky, yes that too is a good idea, and we can potentially do that here in the above TDB area, but I'll suggest the body of it be in our Help Forum(Support, Feedback & Suggestions Forum) and simply link to it above. We want to try to keep the TDB reserved for technical issues only, with certain exceptions as we've seen to ensure all of us are aware of certain important issues.

One note about Stickys. They are ordered chronologically, just like non-Sticky Threads. The top order will always be the most recent Post, so all Stickys will move around with most recent post on top.

Let me go over some of your thoughts, and also present some experiences I've had myself over the many years I've been hooked into our TDB. I just thought about the timeline I've been on here too....wow, it's been a while. I go way back to the early first site shell we had, which had a black background and tricky to follow threads. This was in the 90's as I recall. But it was fun and really loved learning from all of the members, and guests. Back then, anyone could participate. Sometimes it got a bit thwarted though. I tried to stay out of those discussions. But I found myself on the TDB every single day of my life since then. That's right, for the last 30+ years I've been on here, every morning with a coffee.... reading, learning, sharing and enjoying my time here. Oh, and it's not just the morning.... it's actually whenever I get a chance to check in and see what's happening, day or night.

When researching information here, it does take some effort on occasion. When we switched over to the vBulletin software, it took a while to learn the new features. I did a self generated extensive test of the new Boolean search features. It had some quirks and wasn't consistent sometimes. It often gave inconclusive results. But this was because of the intrinsic limitations of the vBulletin software itself. We have to live with its inaccuracies for now. The IT Team has a difficult job of working with it sometimes. I'm not directly involved in our IT support, but our team tries hard to keep everyone in tune. I volunteer when I can to help with things, time permitting.

One of the things that has been on my list to help with is to generate some additional Help & Suggestions Sticky threads with some of the exact things you've suggested. Call it Etiquette or Protocol, or Suggested Routines, Writing Recommendations or whatever. One thing though, we cannot force Members to do a particular "technical" thing, or to write multiple paragraphs versus one long non-delineated post . We can only "suggest" technical and writing methods, but with those suggestions we should show how it can be beneficial. This could help.

When a Member creates a Thread, and then creates another thread with a continuation, it can get lost in the shuffle and hard to follow and see the final outcome, whether it be found or not. One of my self- tasks is to show methods to avoid that confusion. It's been on my to-do list for a while. Firstly, it'll be recommended not to do this "dual" thread process. But if so, a link should be created in the "New" thread, pointing to the original. Many folks don't know how to do this. My plan is to show them how to, and it's actually quite easy.

Another idea is to suggest not to Reply to "Old" threads with a "New" question, basically starting a new Thread inside another Members Thread. Many times users will start replying to the original Poster's question which sometimes is many years old and makes the original thread confusing. It's always preferred to start a New Thread with a similar subject, and if the information is pertinent, simply add a link in it to the Old thread. I use this method often.

As far as our Search Engine goes, it's actually quite powerful, if the user knows the most efficient Search String methods and the various Search Modes. I know it all pretty well and have written some down and posted in the Help forum EDIT: Here. I use these methods often with very good results.

Another thing I would like to do is show how the vBulletin "Display" Mode works and how it can be beneficial to use one over the other. Display Mode is selectable in the User Profile as a Default, or can be switched only when selecting and viewing a Thread. I'll review this too. EDIT: Mark did a great Info Post in here after this one.

And let's not forget about Photos. I've done much work analyzing the "Upside Down" and "Sideways" photos issue. Unfortunately, it's a problem within the vBulletin software. I've discovered workarounds and fixes, albeit a bit complicated and cumbersome. I'd like to share that too but I feel it'll be too much for some to follow. EDIT: If you feel adventurous some day, get yourself a large coffee and a dozen donuts and see This Info Thread.

As mentioned, you have some good ideas which would be beneficial to all. I'll be involved in trying to help with this, and in fact add to it. My only caveat right now is I'm tied up with other priorities, but will try to assist with some of the things discussed when things settle down for me here.

Rich

[Tim G.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Form Etiquette

Great post, Richard. Thank you.

[Richard M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

I just received a pdf from Member Dave Z with a great explanation of Display Modes. Special thanks to Dave for his efforts. See attached.

I'll add this here now and will re-organize with my other data points in the future.

Note that Linear Mode is the ideal selection, keeping all posts in order with most recent up top, or last up top, via a Drop Down selection option in the User Profile... General Settings.

Note that Hybrid Mode can mis-order posts when users Reply to a embedded post.

EDIT: In other words, you're reading a long thread and find a post in it that you want to reply to. You click the Reply Button, or Reply with Quote, Button INSIDE that Post, create your reply and Submit it. Your Post is now deep inside the entire Thread, NOT as the Last most Recent Post as would be viewed in Linear Mode. The chronological order has been lost now. Anyone reading this thread later, for the first time, and doesn't notice the timestamp, gets confused.

This often causes confusion when reading posts. John W & Rob M(Admins), and I spent much discussion about how to eliminate chronological confusion. But the method is complex. See This Thread HERE

In summary, If you view in Display - Linear Mode, anytime you Reply in a thread(Top Left or Bottom) Reply Buttons, your Post will be chronologically as the last, most recent Post. If you want to Quote a previous Post embedded in the Thread, use the "Multi Quote Button"(it'll add a "check mark" in the box, even if it's just ONE Post your replying to). Your Post will be the most recent when finished, regardless of the Display Mode. This will keep post order chronological.
Caveat: The vBulletin SW has a bug. After your reply is made using Multi Quote, it leaves the Multi Quote button "check mark" still selected. It won;t clear it when you're done. You'll have to go back in the Thread and "unclick" the "check mark(s)". If you do not, the next time you go to Reply to a Post, it'll still think you're multi quoting as it never cleared. It's a artifact of your previous post.

Threaded Display Mode only Displays the first Post, with a order of posts at the header. In my opinion, a useless Mode.

Rich

[Mark F.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

I just received a pdf from Member Dave Z with a great explanation of Display Modes. Special thanks to Dave for his efforts. See attached. Rich

Thanks Rich and Dave,

In addition to what Dave has in his pdf, I use the Linear oldest first order, but frequently also use what I call the "Last Post double-right >> arrows button"
It's the button all the way to the right directly under the member's NCRS number. - see red square in the image below...

I find it particularly useful on strings I've subscribed to and have already read all the previous posts...it just takes me to the last one posted. I know I could just do "newest first" in linear mode, but prefer "oldest first" for new posts I'm reading for the first time.

Last Post double-right arrows button_001.jpg

[David M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

All,
I certainly understand the lack of time. Maybe Ill have more once retired...???
I too look at each of my fav tech sites daily sometimes multiple times.
"we cannot force Members to do a particular "technical" thing," but we can lead by example.

My other love is 66-72 442s. Currently have one of those too...its a 68 thing. Actually have had the Olds since 1985, nut n bolt restored in 1990.

Excellent discussion. Some great additional suggestions mentioned. Its all about data preservation/storage. Cumulatively, there is a lot of experience & brain power here.
I was hoping my post would be well received and viewed as help. I blog/post on other automotive sites and have raised the same concerns. Non-delineated paragraphs are soooo hard to read...for me. But I have A.D.D. and get easily distracted.

I am a troubleshooter by profession and by nature. I enjoy helping others through problems from experience. Learn from all the missing skin on all 10 knuckles.

I write technical standard operating procedures and work instructions during the day. So Im kind of biased with grammar & structure. I'm far from perfect. Grammarly (highly recommended) and spell check are my friends.

I recommend installing a snipping tool app on ones computer. That is the simplest basic photo editing tool around. You can draw, add arrows, rotate, crop etc. Install one with a ruler & protractor options to allow straight lines curves etc. Its not as professional as Power Point and MS word. Conversely its easy to learn, especially if you watch a YouTube on it. Simply down load a pic from your phone to your laptop, Snip away.

Thanks for the other tips gentlemen.
As stated earlier I'm willing to toss my hat in the ring if any help is ever needed beyond technical.

TX,
Dave M

[Richard M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

Thanks Rich and Dave,

In addition to what Dave has in his pdf, I use the Linear oldest first order, but frequently also use what I call the "Last Post double-right >> arrows button"
It's the button all the way to the right directly under the member's NCRS number. - see red square in the image below...

I find it particularly useful on strings I've subscribed to and have already read all the previous posts...it just takes me to the last one posted. I know I could just do "newest first" in linear mode, but prefer "oldest first" for new posts I'm reading for the first time.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]121625[/ATTACH]

Thank You Mark, Yes I use that quite often too, but I use most recent first, up top, as I spend way too much time reading stuff and usually read every single post, every day, so I don't want a repeat.

The only issue is if it's a THread I haven't viewed before, I then have to scroll down to the bottom to see Post#1. If it's multi pages, it can get a little cumbersome to find the beginning.

Rich

[Dennis C.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

Thank You Mark, Yes I use that quite often too, but I use most recent first, up top, as I spend way too much time reading stuff and usually read every single post, every day, so I don't want a repeat.

The only issue is if it's a THread I haven't viewed before, I then have to scroll down to the bottom to see Post#1. If it's multi pages, it can get a little cumbersome to find the beginning.

Rich

I use Linear mode. If you click on the double down arrow inside the black circle on the left side, just before the thread name, it takes you to the first post in that thread you have not read. Since the post are in date & time order, you then just scroll down to see next post or up to see older post you already read.
Your history is kept on NCRS server, so this works on any device you use to access the board.

[Richard M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

All,
I certainly understand the lack of time. Maybe Ill have more once retired...???

Since I retired years ago(from the past career), I have no idea why, but all I can think of sometimes is how the heck did I do all of that "non-work" stuff, while I still worked full time? It seems like I got more stuff done back then, than I do now. Plus time seems to accelerate at the speed of light these days as opposed to the past decades. Why is that?

I too look at each of my fav tech sites daily sometimes multiple times.
"we cannot force Members to do a particular "technical" thing," but we can lead by example.

Dave, Yes I agree but some folks either don't know how or just in a habit of doing things a certain way. Maybe all this discussion will alter some to follow some of these methods.

My other love is 66-72 442s. Currently have one of those too...its a 68 thing. Actually have had the Olds since 1985, nut n bolt restored in 1990.

Excellent discussion. Some great additional suggestions mentioned. Its all about data preservation/storage. Cumulatively, there is a lot of experience & brain power here.
I was hoping my post would be well received and viewed as help. I blog/post on other automotive sites and have raised the same concerns. Non-delineated paragraphs are soooo hard to read...for me. But I have A.D.D. and get easily distracted.

Yes I'd say well received and it's good that it has opened discussion.

I am a troubleshooter by profession and by nature. I enjoy helping others through problems from experience. Learn from all the missing skin on all 10 knuckles.

I write technical standard operating procedures and work instructions during the day. So Im kind of biased with grammar & structure. I'm far from perfect. Grammarly (highly recommended) and spell check are my friends.

Agree. And I used to do that too in my field. I guess it rubs off on the forums we often visit.

I recommend installing a snipping tool app on ones computer. That is the simplest basic photo editing tool around. You can draw, add arrows, rotate, crop etc. Install one with a ruler & protractor options to allow straight lines curves etc. Its not as professional as Power Point and MS word. Conversely its easy to learn, especially if you watch a YouTube on it. Simply down load a pic from your phone to your laptop, Snip away.

I use that old, not perfect, free on the laptop... "MS Paint" program for that. My new Samsung phone has a even better editor, but my fingertips are too bulky to use it efficiently. Irfanview is also on my computer for editing and bulk resizing and special effects editing. That's a freebee too.

Thanks for the other tips gentlemen.
As stated earlier I'm willing to toss my hat in the ring if any help is ever needed beyond technical.

You've already helped with your ideas. Members who take the time to try to follow some of this could help them.

TX,
Dave M

Rich.................................

[Richard M.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

I use Linear mode. If you click on the double down arrow inside the black circle on the left side, just before the thread name, it takes you to the first post in that thread you have not read. Since the post are in date & time order, you then just scroll down to see next post or up to see older post you already read.
Your history is kept on NCRS server, so this works on any device you use to access the board.

Thanks Dennis, I never noticed that was there.

Rich

[Mark F.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

I use Linear mode. If you click on the double down arrow inside the black circle on the left side, just before the thread name, it takes you to the first post in that thread you have not read. PERFECT ! Since the post are in date & time order, you then just scroll down to see next post or up to see older post you already read. Your history is kept on NCRS server, so this works on any device you use to access the board.

Thanks Dennis, I never noticed that was there. NOR DID I ! Rich

Great advice, Dennis !
You just saved me a lot of time
Thanks a bunch
Double Down Arrow to read 1st UNREAD post.jpg

[Don H.]

Re: The Importance of Proper Tech Forum Etiquette

thanks Dennis, I too learned something new about using this site.