Winterize or Not?

[Duke W.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Sitting in a sealed polymer container brake fluid cannot absorb moisture, and neither brake fluid nor antifreeze cause plastic to corrode.

Over time the brake system absorbs moisture that will eventually cause corrosion of the brake system metal components that are in contact with the brake fluid.

Cooling systems have dissimilar materials, like iron, aluminum, and brass or copper. When joined by an electrolyte you have a galvanic cell which is essentially a battery, and one or more of the metals will be sacrificed, aluminum usually being the first. Observe that your radiator is mounted with rubber isolators. The primary reason is to electrically isolate the radiator, so it's like a disconnected battery. Measure continuity between your radiator and ground. If it's not infinity, your radiator is not electrically isolated, which will substantially increase the rate of corrosion.

That's why brake fluid and antifreeze should be changed on a time rather than mileage basis. Both chemicals contain corrosion inhibitors, but they are consumed in the process of protecting the brake and cooling system materials and this process is 24/7, 365/6 days a year whether the car is on the road or parked, including storage. The clock runs on brake fluid and antifreeze in storage, but not on fresh engine oil.

For further information Web search galvanic cell and electromotive force (EMF) to see the hierarchy of elements and which are sacrificial when in contact with other elements, usually metal.

Duke

[Gary B.]

HOW TO PROPERLY STORE A VINTAGE AUTOMOBILE
Author: Dan Dillingham NCRS Member #49672 05 December 2022 Revision: B
This document outlines the steps necessary to properly store an antique or vintage automobile throughout the months the car is not driven and is in storage. This is basically November through April in northern latitude climates and May through October in southern climates.
These steps are necessary to minimize corrosion and rust caused by high humidity and dampness, to remove moisture from the crankcase oil, extend gasoline freshness and prevent varnish from forming, maintain battery life, seal out possible infestation by rodents and small animals, and to protect the finishes from damage or deterioration.
Doing this will greatly improve engine startup when returning the car to operating condition and ensure that no damage or deterioration has occurred while in storage.
This document is designed for cars that are to be stored for 1 to 2 years max. For longer term storage, several years, there are additional actions that need to be taken that are not covered in this document.
Preliminary Preparation
1. Wash the car and clean the interior. If not clear-coated, then wax the car.
2. Drive the car to the nearest gas station that sells Ethanol free gasoline and top off the tank. This provides minimal air space for moisture to condense. This is important as alcohol absorbs moisture, is corrosive, and does not keep fresh as long as non-Ethanol gasoline does.
3. At the same time add a fuel stabilizer, such as Sta-Bil or equivalent to the gas tank.
4. Ethanol free gas is available in most localities in the United States. pure-gas.org is a free web spreadsheet that lists most gas stations in the US that sell Ethanol free gas.
Storage Location
1. Bring the car to its storage location. The location should be secure, environmentally controlled, or at least have non-condensing humidity, and be free from rodent and small animal access. If the storage location has a cement floor, lay plastic sheet on the floor where the car will be stored. This is to prevent moisture and dampness from migrating out of the cement.
Page 1 of 4


2. Leave the car resting on its suspension. Do not jack it up so the tires are off the ground. Add an additional 3 or 4 Lbs. of air pressure to the tires above the recommended pressure.
Lubrication
1. Drain the oil and filter while the engine is still hot and grease all grease fittings.
A Primer on Oil Classifications

2. The API classification is listed on all oil brands in a 2 or 3 digit alphanumeric code, deciphered as shown below:



S = Oil classification

3. This API grading system dates back to about 1969. Oils then contained ample amounts of zinc dialkyldithiophosphate (known as ZDDP). This additive provided additional lubricating and anti-wear properties and was essential for sliding surface engines; that is engines with flat tappet cams and lifters. Without this additive there is a real possibility of taking out the cam and lifters, especially with new or newly rebuilt engines.
4. Butin1975catalyticconvertersandun-leadedgasolineweremandatedequipmentonall automobiles manufactured in the US, and it was soon discovered that ZDDP was damaging catalytic converters, so automobile manufactures lobbied the oil companies to remove (or reduce) ZDDP from their oils. Their reasoning was most new cars have overhead cams,
Page 2 of 4






6. Install a new filter and oil but do not run the engine any more than is necessary. Let it sleep all through storage and do not touch it until you are ready to take it out of storage.

Electrical
1. Install a battery cut-off switch. The green knob variety will work, but the knife types are better. Disconnect the battery anytime the car sets. Only connect it when you are going to start it.
2. Install a battery tender (battery maintainer). These are trickle chargers that keep a charge on the battery to keep it from sulfating. This is very important when cars set for periods of time without being driven. Both this and the cut-off switch can be had at most any auto store or Walmart and are not expensive.
Coolant
1. Check the coolant level and make sure it is protected to the lowest temperature expected and make sure there are no leaks.
Page 3 of 4


Moisture Protection
1. Place several desiccant packs inside the car, under the hood, and in the trunk. Bake them first to drive out all moisture. Desiccant packs are often found in drug bottles. Start collecting them.
2. Tape off the tail pipe(s) and the carburetor or air cleaner air intake. This is to prevent air from entering the combustion chambers through open valves.
Covering
1. One cover system you can use is essentially a bag (Omni bag). You drive the car on the bag, the sides fold up and it zippers shut. There is a port that you connect to a shop vac and draw out the air. Then close the port.
2. The alternative is to cover the car with a good grade cloth car cover.
Removal From Storage
1. To remove the car from storage, simply undo what you did when you put the car in storage. Check everything over good and start the engine.
Page 4 of 4

[Larry E.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

[QUOTE=Duke Williams (22045);924503]Sitting in a sealed polymer container brake fluid cannot absorb moisture, and neither brake fluid nor antifreeze cause plastic to corrode.

Over time the brake system absorbs moisture that will eventually cause corrosion of the brake system metal components that are in contact with the brake fluid.

Cooling systems have dissimilar materials, like iron, aluminum, and brass or copper. When joined by an electrolyte you have a galvanic cell which is essentially a battery, and one or more of the metals will be sacrificed, aluminum usually being the first. Observe that your radiator is mounted with rubber isolators. The primary reason is to electrically isolate the radiator, so it's like a disconnected battery. Measure continuity between your radiator and ground. If it's not infinity, your radiator is not electrically isolated, which will substantially increase the rate of corrosion.

Duke>Thanks for the reply; always take note when you talk. Now added questions>

If one uses DOT#5 (Silicon) vs. regular (I think that is DOT#3) brake fluid can the life expectancy be
extended in storage??

If one has steel heads and block is the life expectancy extended in storage vs. aluminum heads on steel
block??

Also one must not forget when a car is in a OMNI Bag and stored correctly with the moisture drawing pellets>
THEN THE BAG BECOMES MOISTURE FREE. Thanks>Larry

[Duke W.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Since DOT 5 silicon brake fluid does not readily absorb moisture, it can remain in the system longer than conventional glycol based fluid, but I can't quantify it. A lot depends on use. If a car rarely sees rain or condensing humidity then changes may be infrequent or not necessary at all. I have heard reports of silicon fluid being in a system for 20 years without issue, but since, over time, the rubber elements can wear, and the wear particles can result in a sludge at the bottom of the m/c, an annual inspection that the fluid is clear and free of any sludge is a good idea. If you can't see the bottom of the m/c, I'd advise a change.

Some brake systems are vented to the atmosphere and some have a sealed cap with a bellows that expands to compensate for reduced fluid. If the seals are in good condition the later type can be considered to be "sealed" and will be better protected from moisture absorption than the former.

Zerex G-05 should be good for at least five years. I can't say if it should be changed more often on a Al head and CI block combination compared to iron/iron, but I can say that on the former the first material to see corrosion damage is the aluminum.

I have no data on the bag and dessicant, but for sure the lower the storage environment humidity the less chance of moisture entry into the brake system, but it doesn't make any difference for the coolant.

Duke

[Keith B.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

I have done nothing but turn the battery off for 10 years will no ill effects come springtime

[Anthony C.]

[Steven K.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

First year storing a car in a northern climate, essentially following Gary's guidelines above in a heated garage. Car went in beginning of Nov and won't come out until mid April. Any suggestions on starting it this spring. Assume the carb will try out, have read all sorts of advice from just pumping and holding starter for 30 sec (seems bad) to ketchup bottle of fuel squirted into the carb to carb cleaner pre-start.

[Anthony C.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

As I mentioned been doing this for 40 years .. start it every 2 wks keep everything flowing drive it in nice winter days .. that is why sooo many people have problems with there cars . They make them sit idle to long . A car in motion stays in motion .. drive her !!

[Steven K.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Not really feasible for me in Wisconsin. Car doesn't see rain let alone snow so it will stay tucked away until spring. I'm going to have to develop my own routine for starting it after a long rest. This spring will just be the first time.

[Leif A.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Not really feasible for me in Wisconsin. Car doesn't see rain let alone snow so it will stay tucked away until spring. I'm going to have to develop my own routine for starting it after a long rest. This spring will just be the first time.

Steven,
Why re-invent the wheel. After a week or so, the ethanol gasoline in your carb bowls is going to be dried out. Same routine for starting your car after long winter storage applies. Make sure your battery is fully charged. Without touching your accelerator, turn the ignition key to start and let the starter turn the engine over for about 5 seconds. This should fill the fuel bowls on the carburetor. Now, depress the accelerator to set the choke, press two additional times to squirt some gas into the primaries, wait 10-15 seconds to allow the gas to vaporize and then attempt to start the car. Sometimes, you may have to pump two additional times, wait 10-15 seconds and then the car should start right up. This is not new information. The only thing that has changed with the starting procedure from when these cars were new is that the formulation of gasoline (with ethanol) has changed and the fuel evaporates more quickly. Don't make it any more complicated than it truly is.

[Steven K.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Thanks Leif. I think I will adopt this process. Probably need a little more patience on waiting 10-15 for fuel to vaporize. Car is stored with no ethanol gas.

[Leif A.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Thanks Leif. I think I will adopt this process. Probably need a little more patience on waiting 10-15 for fuel to vaporize. Car is stored with no ethanol gas.

Yes, very important. If you don't allow the fuel to vaporize, and the engine doesn't start, you just continue to pour more and more gasoline into the engine, you most certainly will flood the engine. Just remember, it's the gas fumes that are ignited...not the liquid gasoline.

[Steven K.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

Got it Leif, thanks for the tip.

[Thomas S.]

[Bill M.]

Re: Winterize or Not?

After all these posts i sure mis the 70's when all i had was my 65 coupe push the snow off with a broom and get to work. the only winter change was 4 snow tires with steel wheels. Pint of black berry once and a while. Blanket for the girlfriend.