2 Body Paint questions

[Mark A.]

I just finished painting my 69 Monza Red coupe. Paint was U-Tech ( Sikkens urethane). I have another 69 Monza red coupe as well, painted by me about 5 years ago, with Dupont paint. My latest 69's color appears to be a darker red than the other 69. I also looked at my 70 with original Monza red paint still on it. It also appears lighter. Possibly faded? My paint supplier mixed the red according to #974 Monza red paint chip in the Corvette color chip booklet from CTR Industries. As the point of building this car is to obtain another Top Flight award, I'm a little concerned about the color. Should I be, or not?
I also would appreciate feedback on what you painters are doing to dull the door jambs. Is there a chemical to rub on or maybe course rubbing compound? Thanks for the help. Mark

[Mark M.]

Re: 2 Body Paint questions

You have the best way to compare it. The original paint car. The paint companies haven't put much effort to match some colors in all the types available today. I just did a 65 nassau blue which took 9 spray out samples to get it real close. The first one was their latest version of the code. It looked pretty but next to original samples saved off the car, it wasn't even close. These cars originally had a bake process which flowed the paint again. The jams weren't excessively dull as some have been restored. Less course compound to start than try courser til you like it. Some guys use Dupont jamming clear, but I tried it once and didn't care for it.

[Domenic T.]

Re: 2 Body Paint questions

Mark,
You probably know this, but as hard to believe, the base color of the primer will change any # paint. Back in 59 I was torn between 2 red colors in the sample book. I noticed that they had the same mixture #'s. The old timer said that they were the same mix, but both had a different color primer under them.
I did a door on a car and it did not match, then I remembered what was told to me years ago about primer color and did it over to get the match.
If I want the paint to dull I use a product that will make gloss paint flat. I believe it's called a paint enhanser . I especially use it for some interior paint that needs to have the gloss removed to match the leather or vinyl. Just mixes with the paint to get the finish you want.
I first spray the gloss, then mix in the product to dull the paint for interior work.
Worked very well on my 67 where some panels needed to be flat base rather than gloss. Also in the 2 part paints, I leave the clear top coat off to get the flat effect.
The only thing I don't like is that there is no mixing instructions as it is used in all paints. You have to experiment with the amount to get what you want.
It was about 50.00 a quart last time I bought it, and a common mistake is not mixing it enough or using a fine paint strainer. Poorly mixed it will cause it to show tiny white specks.

Dom

[James G.]

Re: 2 Body Paint questions

When painting cars for NCRS judging I send sprayouts to the national paint judges for their input.

That being said, I try and find an original sample to scan at the paint jobber - in my case Finish Masters -
I find even with a scan it takes a little tweaking mix ratios with solids and with metallics there are many more variables including direct and side shift.

In catalyzed Urethane you may have to put 25%+ flattener to knock the gloss down, catalyst really glosses the paint. IF it's not glossy enough all you have to do is polish it slightly and the effects of the flattener are basically negated -
For a more lacquer look on metallics I mix clear and color for a couple of coats then shoot the last coat of clear with 15% flattener, when polished you wouldn't ever realize it had flattener.

[Mark M.]

Re: 2 Body Paint questions

You both have excellent points. The original primers I believe were red than gray. Yellow on gray can end up with a green hue. Most paint companies have large sample groups on rings or chains. The samples are 3x6 inch or so and are in groups of many color variations of each color group. I don't know if all companies make them available but with holding ones that look close on the original sample, in sun light and shop light, an excellent starting point is found. The scan as James mentioned may be the easiest starting point. The modern paint metallics don't seem to be offered as small as the originals so trying to minimize to look closer as original changes shade and coloring. It helps to have mixing station available as smallest mix x how many samples can add up. My biggest help is long time friend who's a paint master of lets say over 40 years.

[Frank D.]

Re: 2 Body Paint questions

This came up not long ago, red oxide was the underlying primer with gray over it as an indicator coat to sand down lightly and discover defects, and yes the primer will absolutely affect the hue of the top coat. (My Riverside Red single stage 63 in primer):