Engine Oil circulation

[Bob A.]

I recently had my 63 - 327/340 engine completely restored. It's a 98.2 NCRS Top flight/Bloomington Gold car. The engine was totally dissembled. All moving parts were replaced with NOS parts with the exception of the crank since it was fine. The cam-lifters-valves-bearings-pistons-rods... were all replaced with NOS parts at considerable expense. The block was honed, bored & dipped... Unfortunately, after a short 30 mile run upon leaving the shop, we found numerous issues with the engine restoration. As a result, I will be taking it to a different, highly reputable, local engine shop for diagnostics and remediation.

Of particular concern is in checking the valve adjustments, we found that the valves on cylinders 1 & 2, both intake and exhaust, are not getting oil like 3 thru 8. In 3 thru 8, the oil comes up through the push rods quickly, the oil is highly visible and puddles in the rocker arms in 30-60 seconds. It takes the oil in cylinders 1 & 2 about 3-4-5 minutes to come up. When it finally comes up, it does so at an anemic rate, is hard to visually detect, even when holding at higher RPM's (1500-2000) for 60 seconds. Push rod passages are clear, oil level is full, oil pump is working fine as evidenced by the oil distribution in 3 thru 8.

Any guidance on potential causes/diagnostics for poor oil circulation in the valves for cylinders 1 & 2 is much appreciated.

Bob
#32465

[Larry M.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

What is your hot oil pressure at idle and at 2000 RPM??

Larry

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

I recently had my 63 - 327/340 engine completely restored. It's a 98.2 NCRS Top flight/Bloomington Gold car. The engine was totally dissembled. All moving parts were replaced with NOS parts with the exception of the crank since it was fine. The cam-lifters-valves-bearings-pistons-rods... were all replaced with NOS parts at considerable expense. The block was honed, bored & dipped... Unfortunately, after a short 30 mile run upon leaving the shop, we found numerous issues with the engine restoration. As a result, I will be taking it to a different, highly reputable, local engine shop for diagnostics and remediation.

Of particular concern is in checking the valve adjustments, we found that the valves on cylinders 1 & 2, both intake and exhaust, are not getting oil like 3 thru 8. In 3 thru 8, the oil comes up through the push rods quickly, the oil is highly visible and puddles in the rocker arms in 30-60 seconds. It takes the oil in cylinders 1 & 2 about 3-4-5 minutes to come up. When it finally comes up, it does so at an anemic rate, is hard to visually detect, even when holding at higher RPM's (1500-2000) for 60 seconds. Push rod passages are clear, oil level is full, oil pump is working fine as evidenced by the oil distribution in 3 thru 8.

Any guidance on potential causes/diagnostics for poor oil circulation in the valves for cylinders 1 & 2 is much appreciated.

Bob
#32465

Bob------


Not related to the oil flow issue but what was the GM part number of the connecting rods you installed? If they were actually 1963 rods you made a big mistake. Those rods are weak. I would never use them in an engine, NOS, used, or re-conditioned.

[Bob A.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Larry,

The hot oil pressure was below 30 at both idle - 800-850 rpm's and around 2000 rpm's. Cold oil pressure was below 50.

Thx,
Bob

[Bob A.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Joe,

Will find out and advise.

Bob

[Bob A.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Joe,

The connecting rods did not have a part # stamped on them but they did have the GM logo. Not sure what that means to not have a part # on them?

Bob

[E B.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Oil pump issue ? Also the front of engine is the last to receive oil via cam bearings. Ed

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Joe,

The connecting rods did not have a part # stamped on them but they did have the GM logo. Not sure what that means to not have a part # on them?

Bob

Bob------


The part numbers for the rods are rarely, if ever, on the rods themselves. They are found on the boxes the rods are supplied in. Since you mentioned that you had NOS rods I just assumed that you had the boxes.

[Troy S.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Back in March, I had a similar oil flow concern with my 1963 360 during the oil pump test. Two intakes were producing very weak oil flow. Please reference the following post:


https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...885#post867885


I had installed Sealed Power AT-992s solid lifters and reused the push rods that were in the car. Noticed that some of the AT-992s had an inconsistent design and are now made in China. At the very least, I had a set of AT-992s that did not come from the same production run. See pic.


After feedback, I switched out the old oil push rods with a new set of NOS GM #14095256 pushrods. You can find them on eBay. I also swapped out the AT-992s with a set of Comp Cam 813-16s. Performed the test again and problem was solved. Not saying the AT-992s are bad, I just opted for another route.


Also read some posts that cautioned rebuilders about small amount of debris such as old gasket material can clog lifters.


Hope this helps.
-Troy
208BDB0E-6C46-4BBC-89E7-771F55BA68D3.jpg

[Richard M.]

Re: Engine Oil circulation

Also read some posts that cautioned rebuilders about small amount of debris such as old gasket material can clog lifters.


Hope this helps.
-Troy

Troy, Yes I agree it is very possible that any debris could work its way forward and clog the end of the oil paths to the lifters.

Bob, I would start by removing the intake manifold, releasing all rockers, pull all pushrods and lifters and maintain order locations in a holder to check them all by flushing everything in a clean solution and inspect for debris. If you find debris it may be in your best interest to pull the engine for a complete teardown. I know it's sounds extreme but may be necessary.

As a example, I had a 283 shipped to me from a friend that was at a machine shop for rebuild and built as a shortblock with new cam, lifters, pushrods, pistons, crank, rods, all new bearings etc. All I had to do was assemble the rest of it. I decided to send it out to another machine shop to completely disassemble and rebuild because that first shop was a nightmare on my friends previous 283 build on a '60 I restored.

This is what my new shop found when he took it apart for cleaning. When he "rodded" out the lifter oil galleys he called me and said I may want to come down and take some photos for my friend. I did. The previous shop didn't do a good job cleaning as can be seen below. My intuition paid off. The new shop did a great job and saved the day.

P2180002.jpg

P2180004.jpgP2180005.jpg

P2190022.jpg

P2190024.jpg

Not oil related, but he also had to re-surface both decks of the block because they were severely uneven from the decking the first shop did. It took five 0.001" passes to get it flat.

after 1st pass
100_3691.jpg

2nd
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3rd
100_3693.jpg

4th
100_3694.jpg

after final pass
100_3695.jpg

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