Groove in companion flange

[Joseph E.]

Hello,

I'm working on assembling the rear axle with 4:11 gears that came out of my '65 roadster which I'm in the process of restoring. The car is a low mile "barn find" with only 36K on the odometer. I see a distinct groove around the nose of the companion flange where the oil seal sits. It does not appear to be wear to me as it is a very sharp line that goes around the entire circumference of the flange nose. The groove seems to have been intentionally machined into the seal surface of the flange. The mark from the old seal shows that this line sits in the middle of the seal lip. It's deep enough where it will catch a fingernail if you drag one over it. Is this groove intended to hold oil to keep the seal lubricated or is it not supposed to be present at all? Thanks for any and all replies.

Joe

[Joe L.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

Hello,

I'm working on assembling the rear axle with 4:11 gears that came out of my '65 roadster which I'm in the process of restoring. The car is a low mile "barn find" with only 36K on the odometer. I see a distinct groove around the nose of the companion flange where the oil seal sits. It does not appear to be wear to me as it is a very sharp line that goes around the entire circumference of the flange nose. The groove seems to have been intentionally machined into the seal surface of the flange. The mark from the old seal shows that this line sits in the middle of the seal lip. It's deep enough where it will catch a fingernail if you drag one over it. Is this groove intended to hold oil to keep the seal lubricated or is it not supposed to be present at all? Thanks for any and all replies.

Joe

Joe------


Can you post a photo of it?

[Richard G.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

My guess is it has been caused by the seal rubbing. Their is no engineering reason for such a groove. This can happen faster than one would think. The 4:11 didn't help as the shaft would have a lot more rotations for the same mileage than say 3;08's. Its uncommon as the rubber is amazing in its ability to groove steel. Seems a speedy sleeve is in order.

[Joseph E.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I'll try to post a photo of the area in question. I can see a shadow on the nose of the flange where the old seal sat against the flange. The groove, however, is in the middle of this shadow and not at the top edge where the lip of the seal would have been sitting. How could a groove be worn into the flange when there is no edge being pressed into the flange in the area of this groove? Thank you for the input and I will try to get a photo posted.
Joe

[Gary R.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

Joe
Common to find with a pinion yoke, seal cut into it. If you take a piece of scotchbrite and polish it and can't feel it with your fingernail it should be good. If you can feel it I use a speedy sleeve on them. They are not commonly stocked, at least in my area, so you may have to order. They run about $25-30.
Be sure to seal both the pinion and yoke splines, I use Permashield.

[Joseph E.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I cannot get a clear photo of the groove in the flange with my camera for the members to see who requested it. Gary, can you provide a part number and source for the repair sleeve that you mentioned? Also, would replacing the entire flange with a new one such as the one that Ecklers offers be a good idea or are these new replacement parts not quality pieces? Thank you.

Joe

[Joe L.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I cannot get a clear photo of the groove in the flange with my camera for the members to see who requested it. Gary, can you provide a part number and source for the repair sleeve that you mentioned? Also, would replacing the entire flange with a new one such as the one that Ecklers offers be a good idea or are these new replacement parts not quality pieces? Thank you.

Joe

Joe

Repair sleeve is National/Federal Mogul #99170. Just about any good auto parts store ought to be able to order it for you. This part was never available from GM, though.

[Gary R.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I use the CR brand, same part#99170. googled and prices range from $23- $53
https://www.rockauto.com/en/parts/skf,99170,differential+pinion+repair+sleeve,13976

[Dick W.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I use the CR brand, same part#99170. googled and prices range from $23- $53
https://www.rockauto.com/en/parts/skf,99170,differential+pinion+repair+sleeve,13976

I always use Permatex non hardening gasket sealer under the flange. We probably installed hundreds of them in various applications and every now and then you would get one that weeped under the sleeve

[Joseph E.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

Thank you to all who responded and the information that was provided. It will be put to good use in restoring the proper sealing surface to this flange.

Joe

[Gary R.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I always use Permatex non hardening gasket sealer under the flange. We probably installed hundreds of them in various applications and every now and then you would get one that weeped under the sleeve

Hi Dick
I am confused where you are using the #2 Permatex, under the seal flange I am thinking, which is the OD of the seal? If so I use RTV on the seal OD but always use sealant, #2 or Permashield, on the splines.
Thanks

[Dick W.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

Hi Dick
I am confused where you are using the #2 Permatex, under the seal flange I am thinking, which is the OD of the seal? If so I use RTV on the seal OD but always use sealant, #2 or Permashield, on the splines.
Thanks

Use it under the sleeve. C/R rep suggested that.

[Gary R.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

Use it under the sleeve. C/R rep suggested that.

Ah ok between the sleeve and yoke OD, I use a loctite gel there, flange sealant. I would be surprised if oil wicked up there since it's press fit but you never know

[Richard G.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I never use any product on the OD of the seal.

The red stuff (different colors depending on the manufacture) is a type of glue.
Just install them into a clean and oil free bore, you will not have a leak there.

If the seal has nothing on the OD, plain steel, I would use a sealant but I see very few with out the glue/sealant.

[Joe L.]

Re: Groove in companion flange

I never use any product on the OD of the seal.

The red stuff (different colors depending on the manufacture) is a type of glue.
Just install them into a clean and oil free bore, you will not have a leak there.

If the seal has nothing on the OD, plain steel, I would use a sealant but I see very few with out the glue/sealant.

Richard------


Yes, the pinion seals almost always have sealer (usually red or green in color) pre-applied to the outer surface of the seal frame (at least, the GM and other major brands do). However, I think they were talking about the pinion flange repair sleeve. The sleeve does not have any sealer pre-applied and most that use this type of repair sleeve on the pinion flange (or the harmonic balancer) use some sort of sealer between the sleeve and the original surface. I use Loctite green.