intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

[Mike E.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Mike,
You certainly have more "skins on the wall" than I do, so help me understand please. Wasn't the "I" used in stamping dates as in V06I0HP on a block stamp. Just trying to clarify what I thought was the case which was "I" used in stamping but not used in casting.
Thanks for your clarification in advance.

[Terry M.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Leif, Well well, THANK YOU you are 1/2 right- which is enough. Interesting ( and EVEN Terry missed this) 5th " The alpha numeric code is the same as for engine blocks" and below is a chart showing normal letter / date NO M. So I go to page 85 block/ cylinder case casting dates
again NO M BUT next paragraph "M Casting Code" One exception (what a joke- there were lots) M in lieu of a date foundry code
to evaluate a change after evaluation to be destroyed OR RELEASE IN TO PRODUCTION Looks like my old eyes still work a bit-
IF St Louis did M on blocks maybe intake manifold too ?????
Leif thanks, you got it going see page 85 figure M 1.3 M casting code Terry - make sense see photo I sent

I have seen the M for cylinder cases, but not yet for intake manifolds -- but long ago I learned never to say never.

The other possibility is that the person applying the date code to the molds in the casting department messed up. I have been told that the job of placing those date codes was what today we would call an entry-level task, so a mistake is not outside the realm of possibility.

All other things being equal I would call this one of those "the benefit of doubt goes to the owner" situations. One has to see the entire car, however, to make such a determination. It can not be made over the internet.

[Leif A.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

That “I” is a designator for “1”—-it is essentially a specific style of a “1”. Look at your example. V06I0 is June 10. It has nothing to do with the month. A through L castings correlate directly with each month January through December. You will only find “M” (the 13th letter in the alphabet) in castings as per the posted letters in this thread (experimental castings); therefore “I” is not skipped. Back to stamping: you will never find an expansion tank, alternator, starter, etc. for example, with an “I” for a month code. Of course, then GM did put a stamped “I” for a month designation on trim tags. Hope that all is clear.

Thanks Mike...crystal clear.

[Patrick H.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Terry, This is the 70 Convertible I just bought, original owner original title 7,000 mile original rough paint pretty much virgin no damage
I am interested in Survivor , we talked about the carpet dye. I have a good number of questions re what I can / can not do to maintain
survivor. Service stuff has been replaced carb, alt, W pump and probably starter OK to put on dated original parts, Sokolowski has most.
OK spot paint lacquer, has roughly 10% paint repairs I should do right nose/hood. OK to degrease under hood. Valve covers and intake NEED paint- you seem the be the man that knows got a bit of time ? Much appreciated Bob 760 4130 363

Bob,

You can replace whatever has already been replaced, BUT doing so will not garner you any additional credit in Survivor or Bowtie judging. If it's not the part placed on the car at St. Louis, it doesn't matter. This is a different way of thinking than Flight judging.

I would not do any paint repair if you're serious about your desires with the car, whether it's paint to the body or the engine or anything else.

You may GENTLY clean the car, and that's about it. No paint, no improvements, nothing - IF you want it judged.

I'll give the same advice you were given before you bought it - have someone familiar with these cars and the Survivor/Bowtie judging inspect it before you do anything.

[Terry M.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

THANK YOU So M is possible old dog learned something today !

Bob

Those letters are about M coded cylinder cases, as was the notation cited from the NCRS TIM&JG. In those cases (a bad pun) there was NO DATE on the cylinder case. There was just the letter M followed by several numbers in place of the date. This is a far cry from the letter M being used for a month code with the rest of the date in place, as your intake presents.

You really need to present your car for judging at a Regional so we all can get a chance to look at it and offer you some "eyes on" opinions. The internet is a poor substitute for nine people (I am including the team leader) spending an hour or so (It really should be a half hour, but if your car is as interesting as you present ....) and offering their opinions. You will also get a chance to become more familiar with the NCRS matrix judging system, and the Bow Tie Judging system, and their differences. Don't do anything to it. Just bring it to us. We don't bite; I promise you.

[Bob B.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Terry, I will bring it to a Regional soon, kind of a interesting car some of the service pieces have been changed out over the years and I am going to get the correct / dated items alternator, carb, water pump come to mind but the rest of the car I will leave as is, warts and all.
I think some guys are correct letter wise on normal years, but 70 was unusual with dating starting with Jan rather than the normal Aug-Sept beginning of model year. One of the many things that makes the 70's appeal to me sort of the "67 of the Shark years" they got it right.
Where is the best place to get guidance of do's and DON'TS of survivors ? Bow Tie ? Thanks again, Bob

[Bob B.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Patrick, OK message received. Obviously I have to read up more on Survivor/bow tie I am pretty used to Flight judging,
I have been to several National conventions and as many classes as I could get in and OJ and Judged at west coast shows several times.

Thanks all,
Bob

[Terry M.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Where is the best place to get guidance of do's and DON'TS of survivors ? Bow Tie ? Thanks again, Bob

For Bow Tie guidance (in writing) the NCRS Judging Reference Manual has it. You will get guidance here (and you have.) from some of us. We will be happy to tell you more at a R3egional == Keep us posted on your plans so those of us partial to chrome bumper C3s can be sure to be there.
For Survivor you can contact The Bloomington Gold folks. Google them and ask for their Survivor Material.

[Bob B.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Terry, I must admit I skipped over the Star/bowtie info in the Judging Reference Manual- my mistake. I was looking only at Flight judging and
IT IS DIFFERENT ! I AM going to drive this car, paint mismatch and all. Bit of a balancing act between strictly leaving AS IS and
keeping it drive able / safe. I will keep you up to date with the progress and sorry but I am sure I will have more questions. IF you are putting on any classes at National I will see you there I still want to see that 70 of yours. Thanks for your patience.
Bob

[Terry M.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Terry, I must admit I skipped over the Star/bowtie info in the Judging Reference Manual- my mistake. I was looking only at Flight judging and
IT IS DIFFERENT ! I AM going to drive this car, paint mismatch and all. Bit of a balancing act between strictly leaving AS IS and
keeping it drive able / safe. I will keep you up to date with the progress and sorry but I am sure I will have more questions. IF you are putting on any classes at National I will see you there I still want to see that 70 of yours. Thanks for your patience.
Bob

I will be putting on -- with lots of help -- the Advanced Judging Seminars at the National in Greenville == that is if the creek goes down.

My 1970 will be in the Special Collection at the Bloomington Gold event in Indianapolis the last full weekend of June 20-23, 2019.

I plan to have it at the 2020 National Convention in French Lick Indiana also. After all that is the year of the 1970, so I can't miss that. I am being lobbied to put it in for Flight Judging in order to show judges what an original car is like, but I hate to do that at the potential of denying someone else a chance to have their car judged. There is lots of time for that idea to play out, however.

[Patrick H.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

I will be putting on -- with lots of help -- the Advanced Judging Seminars at the National in Greenville == that is if the creek goes down.

My 1970 will be in the Special Collection at the Bloomington Gold event in Indianapolis the last full weekend of June 20-23, 2019.

I plan to have it at the 2020 National Convention in French Lick Indiana also. After all that is the year of the 1970, so I can't miss that. I am being lobbied to put it in for Flight Judging in order to show judges what an original car is like, but I hate to do that at the potential of denying someone else a chance to have their car judged. There is lots of time for that idea to play out, however.

There are a few of us alive and still kicking who have judged it previously! (Seven Springs National, 1994 (?))

[Terry M.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

There are a few of us alive and still kicking who have judged it previously! (Seven Springs National, 1994 (?))

Hmmm!! The dark ages. Patrick you are getting on. I think I had the 1970 there for something. 5th star maybe.

[Patrick H.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Hmmm!! The dark ages. Patrick you are getting on. I think I had the 1970 there for something. 5th star maybe.

Last outing for the Duntov is what stuck in my head.
I don't recall you being in the correct area for Bowtie, which was nearer the hotel end of the lot.
Check the dates on your awards.

[Bob B.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Patrick- I just went thru your photo bucket of your 71, that car is amazing very well cared for. It shows 60,000 miles (?)
and still has the original water pump, alternator, etc carpet chrome and paint look like a 6 month old car. My convertible interior is not as nice , the top probably got left down a couple times and the FLA sun kills paint. Other than what appears like many hours of careful cleaning did you have to replace any of the items that wear out in 60,000 miles ? Water pump, alt that sort of thing ?
Thanks, Bob

[Patrick H.]

Re: intake 3965577 dated M 10 9 not possible? March 23 body

Patrick- I just went thru your photo bucket of your 71, that car is amazing very well cared for. It shows 60,000 miles (?)
and still has the original water pump, alternator, etc carpet chrome and paint look like a 6 month old car. My convertible interior is not as nice , the top probably got left down a couple times and the FLA sun kills paint. Other than what appears like many hours of careful cleaning did you have to replace any of the items that wear out in 60,000 miles ? Water pump, alt that sort of thing ?
Thanks, Bob

My 72 has 62002 miles right now.
I have photo collections on a few cars posted. If it's the yellow car then yes, that's mine.
If it's the green car, then its a 6500 mile car I photographed a few years ago.

Mine has had water pump, 1 heater hose, 1 radiator hose, differential cover, tires and exhaust replaced, as well as air and oil filters.
I think off hand that's it.