Guys, I already know that it is recommended to install an electrical fuel shut off valve in the fuel line on any Rochester Fuel Injection. What I am wondering is what valve is recommended and where the best place to put it on a 1962 and earlier fuelie unit. I have a 7014520 unit. I am also wanting to know the best way to wire it into the electrical system on the car? Thanks in advance. Brooks Glover Jr.(2141)
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Hi Brooks, You definitely need a fuel siphon valve kit. They are sold by all the F.I. people (including our NCRS National Adviser - listed in the Restorer). I have experienced the result of not having one on my 1960 320 unit, two bent rods! The kit installs between the fuel meter and spider, I wire it to the ballast resistor. It can be seen but is not real obvious. When I judge that section I note the installation but do not take off points, I consider it a safety devise. Good luck, Don H. -
Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
An easy valve to obtain is a fuel valve for a hot rod nitrous oxide system. Summit and Jegs carry them and delivery is quick. The pictures below show such a valve installed on a 4520 unit. As you'll discover, packaging is the problem.... there isn't much available room.... and on the installs I do, I complicate the install by always mounting the valve on a bracket bolted to the FI plenum. Reason is that I don't want the soft copper fuel tubes to carry the weight of the valve and, with engine vibration, risk work hardening and failure.
Don's advice about wiring to the hot side of the ballast resistor is spot on. If you are really adept at wiring, soldering, crimping, etc, you could consider attaching the solenoid wire to the connector pin feeding the cold enrichment heater. The advantage is simplicity: You don't have to remember the extra step of connecting/disconnecting the valve wire each time you R&R the FI unit.Comment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
I thought The anti-siphon breaker was standard on do you want to check your tires after 1958?Current Corvettes owned 1957 two top stealth 383 dual quads--1965 original low mileage 300 h.p. coupe.
Other Corvettes owned over the years:
1954. 1957 AIRBOX FI. Two 1958s one FI, One 2x4. 1961. 1964 convertible A/C auto trans. Two 1965s one coupe with 300 h.p. loaded A/C car, one 365 h.p. convertible Two 1966s one loaded A/C, BB coupe one loaded A/C, SB coupe. Two 1968s one BB convert, 1969 BB coupe. 1971. 1973. 1978 L-82. 1985, 1986 both 4+3s.Comment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Not following your sentence structure completely but I'll answer the question I think you are asking.
FI units made after '58 do have an internal check ball mechanism which prevents fuel siphoning. It works really well right up to the moment that it fails. This device has three failure modes:
1. The check ball malfunctions and fuel siphons into a cylinder.
2. The check ball and housing wear to the point that fuel pressure blows the ball out of the vent hole. Engine stops instantly.
3. The whole housing gets blown out of its cavity by fuel pressure. Engine stops instantly.
Properly installed, the electric valve completely eliminates failures #2 and #3. Electric valves can, of course, fail just like the check ball type of valve but the failure rate is orders of magnitude less. The only electric valve failure I've witnessed was on a valve which had been in service for 30 years.
The FI unit the OP asked about has no provision for anti-siphoning. It was manufactured before RP realized there was a problem. Retrofitting an electric valve is the only way to protect the engine it serves.Comment
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Current Corvettes owned 1957 two top stealth 383 dual quads--1965 original low mileage 300 h.p. coupe.
Other Corvettes owned over the years:
1954. 1957 AIRBOX FI. Two 1958s one FI, One 2x4. 1961. 1964 convertible A/C auto trans. Two 1965s one coupe with 300 h.p. loaded A/C car, one 365 h.p. convertible Two 1966s one loaded A/C, BB coupe one loaded A/C, SB coupe. Two 1968s one BB convert, 1969 BB coupe. 1971. 1973. 1978 L-82. 1985, 1986 both 4+3s.Comment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Guys, I have been out of pocket and just got around to looking at this forum on my computer. Thanks for the replies! I think this is what I need to know. I am going to go to both Summit and Jegs on line and see what I can get. The pictures that Jim L. posted look like a tight installation for the valve but I am sure it is doable. Thanks again and happy motoring! Brooks Glover Jr. (2141)Comment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
In my humble opinion the easiest way to install the anti Siphon valve is to buy a kit from any reputable FI guy. You get everything you need including prebent lines with the proper fittings. You do have to remove the plenum assembly from the intake manifold. Easy Job.Comment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
FWIW, the valve in the pictures is this:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nos-18080nos/overview/
There are less expensive valves but Summit and Jegs keep these on hand so they are available immediately if you need/want one.
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Brooks,I have been installing '57 and '58 to '62 siphon breaker kits (aka shut off solenoids) since 1985. They work great and no point deductions.
THe latest solenoid I have been installing is quite unique. I hesitate telling guys this but this is the place. The solenoid opens at 4.9-5.1 volts!!!
I test the solenoids with an AC/DC converter and can dial in the voltage, etc. I was amazed when I first saw this a few years ago. I called the company and complained that they sold me 6 volt solenoids. They said to me," We don't even make 6 volt solenoids" LOL
When I said I hesitate I mean that for one reason. Some have connected the hot wire to the 9V side of the ballast resistor instead of the 12V side.
Story: One of you bought a '58 to '62 FI car at an auction and it was a big buck show car. Then you called and said you had a knock in the engine. Old JD said you don't suppose you bent a connecting rod. The owner said that I had no clue what I was talking about. So I was very polite.
Three weeks later I got a phone call. The DB member here said he bent 4 rods. You know who you are but I ain't telling the world.
True story. JohnComment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Hey Jim (or John), Can you tell me the specifications for the anti-siphon valve? I have a couple that came with my unit. One looks old and one new. The new one is a Skinner C2DA1081. Both are bigger than the 18080NOS. The one you use Jim mentions a 200 HP fuel flow limit, which must not be a problem since you use it on your car... Also I was hoping you could advise the source for the bracket you use to mount it?
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Ian, I thought we discussed this in an email.The skinner valve on top was used on NOS systems (Not new old stock). Was also used on '64-65 fuel injections.
On both set ups it was designed for momentary use. Used to starting. Not designed to run open all day long. This info came from Skinner in the old days.
The one on the bottom looks quite familiar although it appears to have had a hard life.
Working on my vendor trailer. Email me later. JohnComment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
I highly suggest you don't run the hot wire aka the 12 Volt wire from ANY solenoid between the plenum legs as it might burn. Been there.
Run the hot wire out the drivers side. Away from the hot plenum. Run it thru the maize of parts. Air meter to bellcrank rod, Coil bracket, etc.
Then to the firewall and over to the 12V side of the ballast resistor. Crimp and solder the terminal end. Don't ask colors of wires I tell people on the phone. Just use a tester to see which side of the BR is 12Volt.
Make sure the hot solenoid is not touching the copper nozzle lines.
Use the 1/8" thick FI to baseplate gasket. The one piece gasket. JohnComment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Hi Ian,
The published specs for the NOS valve are not really relevant to FI application because the (not really specified) pressure is different from our applications. Remember, at wide open throttle and high RPM, line pressure in an FI unit can be 200 PSI! More than enough to overcome any internal flow resistance presented by the valve.
For a bracket, I buy the bracket sold by NOS (cost is about $8), and bend it to an "L" shape. I also trim a bit off the top of the "L". It provides a solid mount for the solenoid valve.
JimComment
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Re: Fuel Shut Off Valve for Early Rochester Fuel Injections
Thanks to you both. Your advice is gold.Comment
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