'60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I would be extremely grateful for any photos of the center lower radiator seal as installed. Any installation tips/tricks/advice would be great. Thanks.
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Daniel, Welcome. I see this is your first time posting.
Is your '60 equipped with a stock Brass/copper radiator or a Aluminum Top Tank radiator? The seals are the same for both but just curious as if you have a Top Tank you may want to see what I've done with those to aid airflow. See 2nd link below.
I looked through my files and can't find any photos with the 3 piece stock lower seals, but later I can get you some as I have a '59 and a '61 here so I can shoot a few pics for you. I just installed them recently on that '61.
Basically, the top length of the long horizontal lower seal is glued to the lower horizontal face of the radiator support. The lower full length is glued to the flat horizontal fiberglass valence. You will see that it's actually quite useless there. The 2 lower corner seals glue the the support and the inside corners of the valence and skirt corners. Best to glue the corners first and then add the long horizontal.
Here are a few threads in the Archives that may help, and if you note at the bottom of this page there are "Similar" threads that may help. I looked and there are no photos here anywhere showing that lower seal using the search function.
Links...
Here & Here
edit....Here are some from the '61 below.
RichLast edited by Richard M.; May 7, 2017, 07:30 AM. -
Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Thanks for the pics Rich.
I am a new NCRS member. My late Father was a Corvette collector, and I have taken on the responsibility of caretaker for his collection. He has an original, unrestored, 1960 Honduras Maroon hardtop/convertible, 283 cu. in. motor. I have been told the unique thing about his car is the radiator support is for an aluminum radiator, but the factory installed a copper/brass radiator. His car does not have the bottom seal. Or it has been removed/fallen off.
The reason for my inquiry is, a close friend of mine has restored a Tasco Turquoise 1960. His car has an aluminum, top tank radiator. He got a deduction at the Lakeland, FL regional for not having the bottom seal. I was hoping to see some pictures of the bottom seal as installed so we could make sure his is correct. On his '60 there are 4 square washers with screws coming up from underneath through the fiberglass. I saw in another thread on this topic that the top edge of the seal should attach to the radiator frame (as you stated) and the bottom edge should rest against these four screws. Currently we trimmed the seal so that it would rest against the screws, and thus lay flat across the length of the seal. Just trying to find confirmation that this installation is correct. I don't see the screws on your '61.Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
61 and 62 had the fiberglass molded and adhered so that the plate with the screws was eliminated. The long lower rubber seal was not scientifically assembled. It was glued in poorly, and often glued in crooked. It is often missing or has slipped part way or all the way down. That original seal had several longitudinal lines in it. Replacements lack those lines.Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I'm curious about your car. Is the car a solid lifter 2X4 or F.I. car? Those are the ones that received an aluminum radiator. It seems there were production problems with the aluminum rads. and if there wasn't one available, the car received a brass one. This created a problem as the aluminum rad. has the drain on the drivers side with the corresponding hole in the support. The brass one has the drain on the pass. and the rad. support has the hole on the pass. side as well. This meant that when they installed a brass rad. into a car with the support for an aluminum rad., they had to cut a hole for the drain. I seen a few of these, including my 60 that I've owned for over 40 years. Years ago, I talked to Noland Adams about this very topic and he agreed that the added hole was most likely done at the factory.Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I removed the core support from my 60 late last year and cannot remember seeing the middle seal. Don't know if it was not there, fell off, or whatIt has the aluminum tank top radiator
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Hello Jim:
The car is a solid lifter 2x4. I have not really looked at the radiator/support in this car. Next time I am with the car, I will take a look to see if the radiator set up is as you have stated.
Have just been keeping it clean, well maintained, running, and driven occasionally. :-)Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I am guessing that having the seal, even if it is a repro, is better than not having the seal, with respect to judging?Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Terry, the lower seal was likely never there because it was useless on a Top Tank system. It didn't seal anything behind it. With the Top Tank type installed there is a huge air gap just above the lower horizontal of the support up to the bottom of the radiator.
When I restored a '60 a few years ago I went "Dark Side"
and modified the seal design to include a seal of my own fabrication to help direct air "at" the radiator instead of letting it pass "under" the radiator. Definitely not typical production but I wanted the engine to get maximum airflow for driveability. That was a 270HP 2x4 setup. Pics of that seal modification in the link in my previous post and again below.
Daniel, The main steel core support was identical in 1960 for either brass/copper or aluminum radiator. What was different for the aluminum radiator usage was the addition of the side brackets to accommodate the Top Tank setup as the stacked aluminum radiator was not as wide as the brass/copper version.
Below are some photos of the brackets, originals, and reproductions from Dewitts. The originals were too far gone so I opted for the new pieces. Also pics of the '60.
RichComment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Jim, "Main".....Meaning the entire U-Shaped piece. I didn't want to get details about the other changes as it can be a bit confusing, but I guess now may be a good time since I may have confused it. I'm pretty sure I have most of this right and usually go deep into my notes and books but this time from memory.
The 1959 and 1960 supports featured the absence of weld nuts inside the U channel of the support for radiator mounting like the 1961/1962 supports which have weld nuts. 1960 brass/copper and Top Tanks had the 5/16" weld nuts integrated into the side frames of the Brass/copper radiator itself, or the pressed in round steel inserts on the side extension brackets for the Top Tanks.
The 1960 support(and IIRC some early 1961 supports to use up 1960 Top Tank radiators) Top Horizontal bar was different as it moved forward to make room for the Top tank. This also required a hood change which kicked the horizontal section between the hood hinges more forward as well.
To the best of my knowledge and research, and restoration tinkering, most, not all, 1960 hoods had this change to accommodate the top tank, even if the brass/copper version was installed.
Below, the 1960(and maybe late 1961 as the tags indicate) hood horizontal section "feature" can be seen at the top area of the hood.
Late 1961 and 1962 radiators core supports were different yet again as they had a top center mount for the aluminum radiators,(1961 support below) as well as the unique bottom standoff welded to the U-Shaped support with rubber donuts for bottom mounting. The top horizontal bar "kickout" forward, like the 1960 version bar) can be seen too. Also notice the 61/62 Hood photo above has that cutout feature in the center to clear the aluminum radiator top bracket.
Here is the 1960 support showing the horizontal bar kickout also. Notice no weld-nuts on the inside U-channel verticals.
Since I'm at it here's the 1959 support. Notice how the top horizontal bar is straight across with no "kickout" toward the front.
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
One of your statements - "The 1960 support(and IIRC some early 1961 supports to use up 1960 Top Tank radiators) Top Horizontal bar was different as it moved forward to make room for the Top tank" makes it sound as if all 1960 radiator supports were the same. There were two different core supports used in 1960. One for top tanks rads. and one for copper/brass rads. The difference being the upper brace as you pointed out and the location of the drain hole.Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
Yes, but I believe they were using up old 1959 core support stock when the brass/copper was used early on in 1960. For the TT they had to use the other support. I do not know when the hoods changed but I recall researching that at some point all supports could handle either, therefore the latter was used. Could be in error though. If you have definitive data I'd like to know where it's documented. This has always been a confusion to me.
RichComment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I never paid much attention to when the hood change occurred. The A.I.M. shows support #3744656 for copper/brass rads. (don't know if that's the same one used in 59) and #3772854 for top tank rads. I've never seen any documentation superseding that info. either in the A.I.M. or elsewhere. If at some point a change was made to use #3772854 for all cars, wouldn't there be a change to the A.I.M. reflecting that and a note to manually cut a drain hole on the pass. side if a copper/brass rad. was installed?Comment
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Re: '60 Radiator Support Lower Seals- installed photos?
I have a different question somewhat related to 60 radiator core supports. Years ago mine was hit pretty hard from the front on the passenger side. I am pretty sure the inner passenger side fender was replaced along with some pretty major fender repairs. From the time that accident repair was completed, it always looked like the passenger side headlight pair sat noticeably lower than the drivers side. Fast forward to late last summer as I was did-assembling things for a body off restoration, I saw that the only thing securing of the inner fender to the core support is two smallish bolts thru the inner fender into the core support itself. I know the bottom is held up with shims and rubber bumper atop on the 3rd member; and that the inner fender looks to be "glassed' together into the other various fiberglass parts at the front. My question is were these to holes that secure the inner fender to the core support pre located? In other words, if a "rookie" were fixing this accident, could the mounting to the core support be the culprit making the fender on that side be lower?Comment
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