1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
My '63 has a long standing steering problem of poor or no return of the steering wheel after turning. A local mechanic tried to resolve the problem by adjusting the box, which was only a year old with few miles on it. His effort did not help. So I'm biting the bullet and trying the adjustment myself. I turned the adjustment screw one eighth turn counter clockwise and noticed some improvement during a road test. Encouraged, I turned the adjustment screw another eighth turn and the roadtest was improved again. My question is: How much more can I turn the screw in these increments before something else might go wrong? I don't know if one eighth is a small, medium or large adjustment. There are currently about 4 threads showing above the lock nut. Thanks to all for your help and patience.
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
This is a long standing problem? Even with a new steering box? If the box was set up correctly, your problem is probably an alignment issue ie: lack of positive caster. In order to correctly set up a steering box, all linkage needs to be removed and you'll need a 0-30 in. lb. dial reading torque wrench (my Snap-on wrench was $300). The instructions are in your service manual and Gary R. on this forum has posted a great write-up on the procedure. Your "hit & miss" method will guarantee a new steering box in your future. -
Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Richard,
I often copy and save tech documents for future reference. I happen to have one on C2 steering box adjustment procedures. See the attached word document. Note, I am not the author of this document. It was written by Jim Shea and is available on his website. You will notice that the document reinforces the procedure described by Jim above - and provides a lot of details. Hope this helps.EdComment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Hi Guys,
Richard, typically the alignment as Jim mentions is the reason with return issues. However a couple of red flags here. One you have a rebuilt box and the question is what was the steering like before you swapped the box? If it was loose on center was the box rebuilt with new gears or just a master kit? The fact you made adjustments does help clear up some things. When you turn the adjustment screw CCW you are drawing up the pitman shaft teeth from the worm nut teeth to loosen the lash. 4 threads showing is not good with original gears.
I have worked on many, way too many, common rebuilt boxes and can say I would be concerned at what you may have there. I have seen many boxes with worn out gears reused, some have welded teeth, others have the worm nut purposely flipped upside down to try and compensate for worn teeth, if you have one of these boxes you are never going to get it set correctly.
What I would do if I had it here is first hold it in a vise and check the lash from lock to lock with a 0-30 in/lb wrench. Mark each position with a paint pen and split the difference to get center. With the torque wrench you can see where the drag is, I set them at 5-12-5. If the gears are good you should have a smooth drag, no choppy needle movement, and the high lash reading should be on center. Then you know the box is close, I go through them a bit more then that but at that point you should be able to drive the car. Now if you have one of those vendor rebuilt boxes all bets are off.
I took apart a box last week and found the ball guides were split open, all the balls rotated out and were in the grease. There was an 1/2" of play in the input shaft.
If you have other questions you can contact me directly and I will go over them with you. Properly setup, with correct alignment and good suspension parts these cars handle very well. Many guys listen to others on the various forums and switch to rack or Jeep box conversions but never had a correctly setup box to compare.
I almost forgot, IF you want to try an on the car adjustment then you can center the box, then loosen the lash bolt jam nut and turn the lash screw CW until you feel it snug up. Tighten the nut at that point. DO NOT follow what I have read on CF many times and back the lash screw out 1/2 turn at that point. That achieves nothing.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
I just hope the mechanic you had work on it didn't ruin it.....easier to do than you think by a novice....
I would take Gary's offer above to help you out directly. You can mess these old steering boxes up by too much cranking down on adjustments.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
The key to the on the car adjustment is mentioned in Gary's last paragraph, "center the box" at that point the gears are at the high point where the interference is supposed to be felt.
At full lock left or right, the gears do not have interference so the return to center of the steering wheel is easy. If the lash screw is tightened down without the box centered you will cause wear on the gears and the box will get sloppy. Another aspect is the shim on the adjustment stud, play in this area allows the sector gear to drop during use causing wear in the gear mesh. For some reason the few boxes I have done all seem to have excess play in this area.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
My thanks to all who replied. I will review my Shop Manual and especially Jim Shea's article (Thanks Ed) which addresses returnability which is my problem, before I go further. As a novice I have two last questions.
1. The adjuster screw has 4 threads showing above the lock nut. Does this mean I am reaching the end of counter clock wise adjustability?
2. Are one eighth and one quarter turns small, medium or large? Maybe this can't be answered.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
I don't remember the thread pitch on the adjustment screw but think of it this way - if it's a 1/4 X 20 screw, 20 complete turns equals 1" of movement. 1 turn equals .05", 1/4 turn equals .0125" etc.
You didn't answer my question about when this issue started. You stated it was a new box with only a few miles. Was it rebuilt to address this issue? Did your mechanic adjust it because the rebuild didn't fix this issue? As I stated in post #2 and Gary in post #4, it's most likely an alignment issue unless your steering box is really screwed up inside.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Jim, sorry I didn't answer your question. I have posted two other threads on this subject, July 31, 2014 and Oct. 8, 2014, so I may be taking short cuts in replies that aren't appropriate. The history and conclusions of those threads all pointed to a too tightly adjusted steering box. The brief story is that I had a local repair shop install brand new; steering box, control valve, power cylinder, idler arm and P.S. hoses. I also had him move the tie rod ends to the front holes from the rear where they were located. The car steering was adequate but I thought it was time after 50 years and 80,000 miles to refurbish it. After the installation and a four wheel alignment the steering felt stiff with no steering wheel returnability after cornering. The caster was satisfactory at this point. I had another local shop adjust the box on the car with no improvement. So after buying a new box supposedly adjusted at the factory, having it installed by a pro who should have known if the box was adjusted properly then taking it to another shop for an on the car adjustment the returnability was still unsatisfactory. So I'm thinking if the box is too tight I will gradually back off the adjustment myself and see what happens. So far my tinkering has improved returnability, I'm tempted to continue but this is all new to me. There is no way to tell if the factory and the two mechanics got things right, it doesn't seem they did. The box may be damaged but other than returnability the steering seems ok.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Hi Richard,
Without trying to be redundant, I really have a concern on the box you bought. I may be way off base but I am basing this on experience and building 100's of these boxes. The original factory was Saginaw, they supplied the boxes between 1963-1982 then the recirculating ball setups were pretty much done. Jim Shea will know the exact time period but I believe by 1985 the machines used to make new gears for these boxes and building the boxes was all done and gone. So getting a "real" "new" box is questionable, there have been new boxes on the market over the years and some were worse then the original worn out one they replaced. About 10-15 years ago a lot of vendors were caught with bad stock and still sold them to guys. The machines were sold a couple of times and went through more business closures.
Look at your box, does it have a slotted lash screw or a socket head set screw? Is the lock ring solid aluminum or stamped steel and what kind of cover is on the box, cast iron or aluminum?
What you're saying adds up to some box issues still. Now new gears will set up differently on these boxes. I have the complete new gear stock from Corvette Steering and can say these gears have to be fit to every box. It is not uncommon to find new gears setup high with a few threads showing or the opposite- low. That doesn't make them bad but original gears are in the 2 - 3 thread range OR with some of the 60's casting 1 thread. Each box has to be setup based on the housing and gears.
While I have met many very good mechanics that can build just about anything on a car most fell flat on boxes, arms, and vette diff's. I am not saying your guy is one like that, I have no way to know but since there was a problem before and after and the adjustments seem to be off still I will still recommend starting from the beginning and making sure the box is correct. Then go back to the alignment. If the box is what I think it is then alignment isn't going to work until it's correct. Find someone with the 0-30 in/lb TW and call me to go over the checks.
Good luck.
PS- I saw where said you went over the box before so I checked and saw I already addressed the same concern last year. I didn't recall that prior to posting, I'll let it go now.Last edited by Gary R.; November 20, 2015, 09:45 PM.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Richard, I read your two previous threads and agree with Gary. Your best bet is to pull that box and ship it to Gary. That way, you'll be able to 100% rule out the box as an issue. I'd be curious as to what he finds when it's opened up. Good luck.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
Gary/Jim: I do want to give you both a few more specifics on this box just for your info. I bought it new from Corvette Central (CC) in May 2012...yes, that's how long I've been at this. The box has an aluminum cap and adjusting requires an Allen wrench, no slot in the adjuster. Its CC part number 562148, still available on their website. They are described as all new, no core charge, pre-set and manufactured by the original supplier whatever that means. In going back and reviewing my order form I see that the catalogue said 63-69 boxes got cast iron top covers and 70-82 got aluminum CC #563244. Since I have the aluminum top it appears that this box was the 70-82 version. My bad for not checking closer. I'll ping on CC first thing Monday to see if this is just a cosmetic difference or if there is some real physical difference. The power cylinder they sold me at the same time as the box blew its seal as soon as it was pressurized. Chinese product....nuff said. Not sure where I'm going with this problem but I appreciate your thoughtful comments.Comment
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Re: 1963 Steering Box Adjustment Tips
I have seen what I believe are similar if not the same type of box. Not sure if CC makes them, I doubt it. I had a couple here and literally threw them out in the scrap barrel. The ones I have seen were poorly setup and the gears would not dial in. The allen adjusting screws are not the same as the originals, the originals were bevel bottomed. Possibly you have a box that isn't part of the group I saw, I really can't say.
The aluminum caps were first used in 1969 and carried through 1982 and I assume as a service part. The cover bushings changed by 1979 and were a thin cupped bushing in place of the thicker bushings the older boxes had, however it doesn't really matter at the top as much as the (2) bushings in the housing.
The input splines changed in late 1969 from a full fine spline to a coarse spline with a "D" Flat milled in at high center- 12 o'clock. As a result the rag joints were reconfigured to fit, so you can't use a 63-E69 rag on a L69-82 box. What type of rag do you have? I have actually seen some crossed over and ground to fit-that you do not want to do as failure of this part will result in loss of steering and a lot of fiberglass across the road.
I don't believe the mfg was licensed to use the Saginaw road "S" logo so the housings I saw didn't have that.
I was hoping you just had a lousy built original box, because those can be properly rebuilt. The new housings may be rebuildable but they just weren't worth the effort- again the ones I have seen. Some of them used a steel end nut instead of the original cast nut. The lock ring was also solid not stamped steel like original.
The high centers were all over the place and the preload on the bearings was too loose.
I don't have anymore original 63 boxes, sold the last (2) a few months ago otherwise I would send you one to try in your car.
I don't know what else I can tell you at this point. I would still get the TW and see just what this box is doing and if it can be dialed in.
Maybe CC will be able to get you another box?Comment
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