64 365 engine pulleys

[Michael G.]

The 64 car came with a 365 HP version of the 327, which was available with factory air and no power steering. This means, I think, that it would have had a two-grove pulley on the balancer.

Did this engine have a harmonic balancer similar to the 63 340 horse? If so, did the engine have deep groove pulleys like the 63?

Is there another version of the 327, ( not a solid lifter version) in any year (maybe the 1967 L79), that had the large balancer and power steering?

The bottom line is that I'm looking to add a deep-groove power steering pulley to a 63 solid lifter engine (don't worry about the oil pan, that's a another story)...

Thanks,

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

The 64 car came with a 365 HP version of the 327, which was available with factory air and no power steering. This means, I think, that it would have had a two-grove pulley on the balancer.

Did this engine have a harmonic balancer similar to the 63 340 horse? If so, did the engine have deep groove pulleys like the 63?

Is there another version of the 327, ( not a solid lifter version) in any year (maybe the 1967 L79), that had the large balancer and power steering?

The bottom line is that I'm looking to add a deep-groove power steering pulley to a 63 solid lifter engine (don't worry about the oil pan, that's a another story)...

Thanks,

Mike-------


The 1964 L-76 (365 HP) used a harmonic balancer IDENTICAL to the one used on 1963 L-76 (340 HP). It was GM #3817173 (finned version).

The 1964 L-76 used deep groove pulleys just like the 1963 L-76.

1965-68 L-79's (i.e. which were equipped with hydraulic lifters) used the same balancer as 63-65 L-76 and L-84 (except that from about 1967 the balancer omitted the fins).

No problem whatsoever to adding power steering to a 1963 L-76 or L-84. Use crank pulley GM #3766987 (which you should have if it's original) or GM #3858533. Use power steering pump pulley GM #3834720. The latter is discontinued but available in reproduction.

This is a very simple installation. One belt crank--waterpump---alternator. One belt crank--waterpump---power steering pump.

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, but I neglected to mention the addition of air conditioning too. Because the 1965-68 L79 uses the same balancer, I assume I can use the belt and component arrangement that was used on an L79 with power steering and air conditioning. (shown below, I think)

Screen Shot 2015-09-27 at 11.09.38 PM.jpg

I have 3858533 for the crank and 3770245 for the water pump, as well as the PS pump pulley. It appears that this set-up uses three grooves on the crank pulley, so I'd also need an add-on, deep-groove, single groove pulley for the crank. Any idea what pulley this would be? (A similar non-deep-groove add-on was used in 63, on the low-horse engines with air, but I think I need deep-groove).

Thanks,

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, but I neglected to mention the addition of air conditioning too. Because the 1965-68 L79 uses the same balancer, I assume I can use the belt and component arrangement that was used on an L79 with power steering and air conditioning. (shown below, I think)

[ATTACH=CONFIG]64572[/ATTACH]

I have 3858533 for the crank and 3770245 for the water pump, as well as the PS pump pulley. It appears that this set-up uses three grooves on the crank pulley, so I'd also need an add-on, deep-groove, single groove pulley for the crank. Any idea what pulley this would be? (A similar non-deep-groove add-on was used in 63, on the low-horse engines with air, but I think I need deep-groove).

Thanks,

Mike------


Now you've thrown a wrinkle into this that changes everything-----air conditioning. GM never used a pulley set for any Corvette small block application with power steering and air conditioning that included any deep groove pulleys. All SHP applications (L-76 and L-79) which included C-60 used the standard groove pulley set that was also used for all 250 HP and L-75 applications. That's the pulley set that you have pictured.

No Corvette ever used a 3 groove crankshaft pulley. What was used for non SHP and SHP w/C-60 and N-40 applications was a 2 groove pulley onto which was sandwiched a 1 groove pulley. This may appear like a 3 groove pulley but it's not although there are obviously 3 grooves.

The deep groove crankshaft pulley, GM #3858533, is not designed for an add-on pulley, let alone a deep groove add-on pulley, and I don't know of any ever-available pulley that can be added to it.

The deep groove waterpump pulley, GM #3770245, can support an add-on pulley. However, that add-on pulley was only ever used for The K-19 pump driver pulley.

It might be possible to use the deep groove pulley set for N-40 only applications. This would include crank pulley GM #3858533, waterpump pulley GM #3770245, alternator pulley GM #3829387, and power steering pump pulley GM #3834720. Then, you would have to modify the A/C compressor mounting so that the pulley aligns with the appropriate groove on the waterpump and crank pulley. Alternately, you might be able to use the deep groove pulley system used for L-79 with power steering and K-19. Then, also modify the a/c compressor mounting so that the compressor pulley aligns with the K-19 driver pulley.

I'm not saying that either of the above would work, only that it MIGHT work if you want to use a deep groove pulley system.

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Well, I'm confused.

Really, though, I'm not dealing with my standard L84 solid lifter motor anymore, as this engine now has an L79 hydraulic cam and electronic port fuel injection added to the L84 plenum. So, as my revs are limited to L79 level, I'm not sure deep groove pulleys are even necessary, and, as you stated, they weren't used on the L79 with AC and PS.

I guess the most rational thing to do is to build the standard L79 set-up on my car. (if there is anything rational about this build) Do you know the standard-grove pulley numbers used on the L79 with AC and PS? (I'd look it up myself, but I don't have a 67 AIM)

Thanks

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Well, I'm confused.

Really, though, I'm not dealing with my standard L84 solid lifter motor anymore, as this engine now has an L79 hydraulic cam and electronic port fuel injection added to the L84 plenum. So, as my revs are limited to L79 level, I'm not sure deep groove pulleys are even necessary, and, as you stated, they weren't used on the L79 with AC and PS.

I guess the most rational thing to do is to build the standard L79 set-up on my car. (if there is anything rational about this build) Do you know the standard-grove pulley numbers used on the L79 with AC and PS? (I'd look it up myself, but I don't have a 67 AIM)

Thanks

Mike-------

The following is the 1966-67 configuration which should work for a 1964:

waterpump-------GM #3995643 (not the original p/n but a GM replacement)

balancer (rear)---GM #3850838 (2 groove)

balancer (front)---GM #3751232 (1 groove)

power steering pump-----GM #3770509

alternator-------GM #3846180

ALL of the above pulleys are GM-discontinued. Most, if not all, should be available in reproduction.

By the way, the installed harmonic balancer has no bearing on this. The front-to-rear (pulley mount face to end of snout) dimension of the 6" balancer is the same as the 8".

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, I'll find all those parts somehow

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, I'll find all those parts somehow

Mike------

Actually, the GM #3995643 might be hard to find. So, the original pulley part number of GM #3890419 is probably easier. Should be lots on eBay and it's reproduced.

The GM #3850838 should be easy to find on eBay and I believe it's reproduced.

The GM #3751232 is still available from GM.

I'm not sure about a source for 3846180. However, I think you actually could also use the GM #10495191 which is still available from GM.

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

I've obtained all the L79 pulleys, brackets, and stuff and am about to put this all together. It just occurred to me that perhaps the L79 used a different water pump than the L84. I have a 3859326 pump. It looks similar to the L79 pump (it may be the same pump) and I'm wondering if it'll work with the L79 set-up?

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

I've obtained all the L79 pulleys, brackets, and stuff and am about to put this all together. It just occurred to me that perhaps the L79 used a different water pump than the L84. I have a 3859326 pump. It looks similar to the L79 pump (it may be the same pump) and I'm wondering if it'll work with the L79 set-up?

Michael------


I don't think that any 1964 originally used a 3859326 casting number water pump. However, the 3859326 will work perfectly for any 1963-64. One thing you have to be careful about is that the pump has the proper hub spacing. However, that has nothing to do with the pump casting.

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, I agree that the 326 pump was not original to my 63 L84 car, (my Duntov car has the 3872609), but it does work with the original pulleys and such. Michael Hanson writes that the 3859326 made it into production Corvettes in mid-1964 (per quote below), so it may(?) have been in 65 L89s...

"Well, I'll put it this way. The folks that made the original castings for water pumps, "Grey Iron Works", didn't even have the 326 number in their system until some time in very late 1963. I'm not sure when it finally became a casting, or a complete water pump on the Flint engine assembly line but I think we can conclude, with certainty, that none were in existance prior to probably some time in mid 1964." (Michael Hanson)

In any case, if you know if the 326 pump was in 1965 L89s or if you know the part number and/or the hub spacing of the pump used in those (and later) L89 engines, that'd be very helpful...

[Michael J.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Wow, you learn something every day, I didn't know they had L89s in 1965, I thought '67 was the first year for those.

[Joe L.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Thanks Joe, I agree that the 326 pump was not original to my 63 L84 car, (my Duntov car has the 3872609), but it does work with the original pulleys and such. Michael Hanson writes that the 3859326 made it into production Corvettes in mid-1964 (per quote below), so it may(?) have been in 65 L89s...

"Well, I'll put it this way. The folks that made the original castings for water pumps, "Grey Iron Works", didn't even have the 326 number in their system until some time in very late 1963. I'm not sure when it finally became a casting, or a complete water pump on the Flint engine assembly line but I think we can conclude, with certainty, that none were in existance prior to probably some time in mid 1964." (Michael Hanson)

In any case, if you know if the 326 pump was in 1965 L89s or if you know the part number and/or the hub spacing of the pump used in those (and later) L89 engines, that'd be very helpful...

Mike------


I seriously doubt that the 3859326 pump was originally used for any 1964's. In fact, it was not around for the beginning of 1965. The date on the GM drawing for the 3859326 casting is May, 1965. I expect that most 1965 Corvette applications with small block and external bypass (i.e. L-76, L-79, L-84) used the GM #3839175. The latter is an almost identical pump.

The actual part numbers for the pump assemblies will do you no good; the only place those numbers appeared was on the SERVICE parts boxes the pumps were supplied in.

The hub spacing for the L-79 pump was 5-9/16" or 1/8" greater than that or 1/8" less than that. I just don't recall what the actual dimension was.

[Wayne M.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

.... In any case, if you know if the 326 pump was in 1965 L84s or if you know the part number and/or the hub spacing of the pump used in those (and later) L84 engines, that'd be very helpful... [/COLOR]

This might help.



c

[Michael G.]

Re: 64 365 engine pulleys

Whoops, Michael, "L89" was a typo in my last post, meant "L79", as in earlier posts, sorry for the confusion. (Don't want to bring 427s into this discussion, its confusing enough)

Joe, I'll defer to your info on the 326 pump...thanks

Wayne, the chart is great...